The Most Underrated Movie?
- Thread starter M-Red
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I find Insurrection Unfairly maligned. Yeah it was a glorified episode, but it was a good episode, and the scene between Picard and the Admiral and "How many does it take admiral" line was a great movie scene.
The Final Frontier - a ridiculously over criticised film. Its reputation is totally unmerited.
I think that TSFS kind of has a bit of a bad reputation, when it is overall a decent film. Yes, it's an odd numbered film and not one of the best Trek films, but it is far from the worst. Maybe TSFS is not the best standalone Trek film, but it fits well between TWOK and TVH. It does an excellent job of continuing the story started in TWOK, while setting the stage for TVH. It's a good movie and features one of Uhura's best scenes (I absolutely love that Mr. Adventure bit).
I also vote for Star Trek III. It's pretty well put together and a hell of a lot better than the rubbish that came before it. It's not great, but it's fairly good. No, it's not TUC or FC, but it's worth the time to watch it, I'd say and worth more than the first two put together. Insurrection and TFF 100% deserve all the flak they get though, IMO.
Another vote for Star Trek III. There were a lot of cool moments in that movie and it really saw the TOS crew come together and defy Starfleet to save one of their own.
Definitely Star Trek 3 for all the reasons everyone who picked it listed.
Star trek V had a lot of good. It's problems were the special effects, of course, and the jokes that had been stuck into the script to make it funny,but didn't evolve naturally from the situations.
There were a lot of good character situations there, such as the "brainwashing" scene on the Enterprise, showing Spock's birth and Bones euthanizing his father.
It also did the best job, IMHO of spotlighting the relationship of the big three, Kirk/Spock/McCoy.
Far better than it's given credit for.
There were a lot of good character situations there, such as the "brainwashing" scene on the Enterprise, showing Spock's birth and Bones euthanizing his father.
It also did the best job, IMHO of spotlighting the relationship of the big three, Kirk/Spock/McCoy.
Far better than it's given credit for.
I'd go one further and say that I don't mind the jokes, nor do I mind the special effects that much. In fact I think the sub par effects in Insurrection do far more to bring that movie down than the effects in TFF do.
Yeah, ST III suffers from being the "middle child" between Khan and the whales, but it's still a fun movie in its own right. And, hey, it brought it back Mark Lenard as Sarek for the first time in the movie series.
Hmm, I'm suddenly envisioning ST III as Jan Brady: "All I ever hear all day is Khan, Khan, Khan!"
Hmm, I'm suddenly envisioning ST III as Jan Brady: "All I ever hear all day is Khan, Khan, Khan!"
I'll have to think about this one before I vote....
It's either TSFS, or Insurrection. I really, really like Insurrectin actually. A lot of people complain that it's more of a two-parter TNG episode then a movie, but I see that as a good thing. It had more of a Star Trek feel to it then First Contact. Then again, I could have really done without the silly boobjoke, or the kid.
TSFS, well the issues I have with it are mentioned already so I won't, and the pro's mentioned are my thoughts as well.
*EDIT* Oke, little later, and voted Insurrection
It's either TSFS, or Insurrection. I really, really like Insurrectin actually. A lot of people complain that it's more of a two-parter TNG episode then a movie, but I see that as a good thing. It had more of a Star Trek feel to it then First Contact. Then again, I could have really done without the silly boobjoke, or the kid.
TSFS, well the issues I have with it are mentioned already so I won't, and the pro's mentioned are my thoughts as well.
*EDIT* Oke, little later, and voted Insurrection
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Have to go with TSFS as well. It's not a bad film, it's just more of a transition film in the "trilogy."
I agree that Star Trek V actually does have some very effective character moments. It's mainly the awkward construction of the plot that keeps the film from being as good as it could have been.
I agree that Star Trek V actually does have some very effective character moments. It's mainly the awkward construction of the plot that keeps the film from being as good as it could have been.
TFF is fabulous, camp and like a bucket of candy. It also has some of the best Big Three scenes.
Knight Templar
Commodore
The Search For Spock I think is underrated because it gave us more new visual things to see (before CGI was used) than most other Star Trek movies.
TSFS introduced the Excelsior class starships, the Oberth class starships, the Klingon Bird of Prey, the Spacedock.
All of which would make many appearances in later Trek productions. Especially in the case of the Excelsior and Bird of Prey.
TSFS introduced the Excelsior class starships, the Oberth class starships, the Klingon Bird of Prey, the Spacedock.
All of which would make many appearances in later Trek productions. Especially in the case of the Excelsior and Bird of Prey.
I don't know, it is just a sorry excuse to bring back Spock, and it really is sooooooo slow. Except for some few good scenes (Enterprise at spacedock, selfdestruct), it really is very boring.
TSFS or Generations.
TSFS because it gets unfairly grouped in as part of the stupid "odd movie curse" thing, and GEN because most of the hate towards it has nothing to do with the quality of the movie and is more about the poor way the death of Kirk was handled.
honorary mention to Nemesis-not a great movie by any means, but not the awful one it's made out to be.
TSFS because it gets unfairly grouped in as part of the stupid "odd movie curse" thing, and GEN because most of the hate towards it has nothing to do with the quality of the movie and is more about the poor way the death of Kirk was handled.
honorary mention to Nemesis-not a great movie by any means, but not the awful one it's made out to be.
I vote for TFF. This has always been high on my list of great Star Trek movies. I think it most captures the feel of the original series of any of the movies. Great Kirk-Spock-McCoy stuff, and a great antagonist in the spirit of TOS. Sybok was a zealot who did some bad things but by the end, he realized he was wrong and sacrificed himself in attempt of redemption. This goes right alongside Charlie Evens, the Romulan Commander (BoT), the Horta, who all where multi-faceted characters who's "evil-ness" was questionable. (Unlike Kruge, or the Borg Queen, or the Sona guy (who's name I don't even remember, god, that movie really did suck) or Shinzon, or even to a degree, Kahn himself.) And "God" fits right in with Apollo, and Trelane. If you ask me, ST5 is the most TOS-like of the TOS movies.
I love it.
Also, I don't get the hate for TSFS. That is a great movie (in spite of Kruge). It also has so many great character moments and really expanded the Star Trek universe in interesting ways.
On the other hand, the TNG movies are all terrible. In response to sonak above, Generations was a train-wreck and the handling of the death of Kirk was the least of it's problems. The stuff with Enterprise-B was okay, but clearly written for Spock and McCoy, but shifted to Chekov and Scot since Nimoy and Kelly wouldn't get on board. The stuff with Worf's promotion on the holodeck was fun, even if it didn't quite make sense to the character of Worf (Why would a party for Worf be on a 19th Century sailing ship? Is he into early Earth wet-navy vessels or a big fan of the British Navy? Who of the crew said "Yeah, Worf's gonna love this!"?). Soran's whole plan about getting back to the Nexus is absurd, dispite the fact that ships are destroyed by it, who cares? Everyone on the ships are snatched up by the nexus, so screw the ship! Why wait 80 years to fulfill your greatest fantasy and kill billions of people when you actually can just fly the freakin' ship into it!?!?! And all the stuff with Lursa and Betor and the torture of Geordi just was poorly thought out and ultimately terribly done. Especially since stuff cut from the movie is still referred to (they put an implant that basically gave him heart attacks on command in order to extract information, but while that scene was cut, Soran still has the line "His heart just wasn't in it" which makes no sense without that scene).
First Contact, is the only watchable TNG movie and even then, it doesn't fit well with what came before it. (But I'm actually less of a continuity snob than I sometimes come across as, so no biggie.) But I will argue that the Borg are way scarier as a collective that has ultimately decided (as the ultimate democracy) to go out and do what they do than they are if controlled by one villainous leader than makes them go out and do evil. And most everything that happens on Earth in the 21st Century doesn't make sense if you really think about it, but it's much easier to gloss over the problems in First Contact than it is for Generations. Also, the movie's ending seems to establish that time travel can be preformed much too casually for my taste. At least in ST4 there was a sense of danger and that one false move could send you into the Sun (even if the clock-wise to the future and counter-clockwise to the past was a bit hard to swallow).
I won't even waste my time explaining the failings of Insurrection and Nemesis.
--Alex
I love it.
Also, I don't get the hate for TSFS. That is a great movie (in spite of Kruge). It also has so many great character moments and really expanded the Star Trek universe in interesting ways.
On the other hand, the TNG movies are all terrible. In response to sonak above, Generations was a train-wreck and the handling of the death of Kirk was the least of it's problems. The stuff with Enterprise-B was okay, but clearly written for Spock and McCoy, but shifted to Chekov and Scot since Nimoy and Kelly wouldn't get on board. The stuff with Worf's promotion on the holodeck was fun, even if it didn't quite make sense to the character of Worf (Why would a party for Worf be on a 19th Century sailing ship? Is he into early Earth wet-navy vessels or a big fan of the British Navy? Who of the crew said "Yeah, Worf's gonna love this!"?). Soran's whole plan about getting back to the Nexus is absurd, dispite the fact that ships are destroyed by it, who cares? Everyone on the ships are snatched up by the nexus, so screw the ship! Why wait 80 years to fulfill your greatest fantasy and kill billions of people when you actually can just fly the freakin' ship into it!?!?! And all the stuff with Lursa and Betor and the torture of Geordi just was poorly thought out and ultimately terribly done. Especially since stuff cut from the movie is still referred to (they put an implant that basically gave him heart attacks on command in order to extract information, but while that scene was cut, Soran still has the line "His heart just wasn't in it" which makes no sense without that scene).
First Contact, is the only watchable TNG movie and even then, it doesn't fit well with what came before it. (But I'm actually less of a continuity snob than I sometimes come across as, so no biggie.) But I will argue that the Borg are way scarier as a collective that has ultimately decided (as the ultimate democracy) to go out and do what they do than they are if controlled by one villainous leader than makes them go out and do evil. And most everything that happens on Earth in the 21st Century doesn't make sense if you really think about it, but it's much easier to gloss over the problems in First Contact than it is for Generations. Also, the movie's ending seems to establish that time travel can be preformed much too casually for my taste. At least in ST4 there was a sense of danger and that one false move could send you into the Sun (even if the clock-wise to the future and counter-clockwise to the past was a bit hard to swallow).
I won't even waste my time explaining the failings of Insurrection and Nemesis.
--Alex
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