Isn't possible to submit corrections for those kinds of errors, or does that not work too well? I only ask because I've never submitted one to Wiki, myself.
The Master
- Thread starter The
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Yes you can as long as the article in question isn't locked.
You can but then someone else can correct your corrections with more made up waffle, and if during that process someone reads something untrue and cites it as fact, well then they look foolish or inadvertently spread the lie. Because Wiki is some open to alteration it is unreliable, but still useful as a starting point for any research so long as you know what you are reading may well be utter cobblers. Academically speaking Wikipedia is akin to referencing your cat as a reliable source for political news..
Oh I know all about how Wiki is not exactly top shelf when it comes to academics. Lord knows I've seen that often enough from my kids teachers, not to mention drilling it in them myself. But still, this isn't exactly a deeply academic topic. Wouldn't it be worth the shot to clear up the confusion?
A close look at the ring I think it to be almost like the chameleon Arch as it appears to be some kind of Time Lord Tech. The pattern on the ring is like that on the Watch.
The Encyclopedia claims that he was only Yana for 17 years.
how do you define 'canonically'?
if you mean on-screen, no.
if you mean 'Rusty said it, so it must be true', yes. it was in the first Doctor Who annual in an article written by Rusty himself.
Well all we know for sure (I think might need to rewatch Utopia) is that Yana has existed for at least 15 years because that's how long Chan'tho(sp) had travelled with him.
Being found as a child by the silver devestation bothers me only insomuch as it implies that he had recently regenerated into a child, or the Chameleon arch had turned him into a child. Since our only other experience of the arch showed the 10th Doctor turned into a human who looked the same age as him, the former seems more likely, but I can't imagine a Time Lord would ever want to regenerate into a child, and we've seen no evidence to suggest this ever happens.
With that in mind, whilst I've no problem beleiving Yana has been around a long while, I don't beleive the story of him being found was anything other than the arch's fabrication (like John Smith's childhood in Nottingham)
From reading YuWanker's other posts, I get the feeling he's tried pushing something outlandish on wikipedia only to have it shot down in a flurry of [citation needed] tags.
For the purposes of pop culture, Wikipedia suffices. I mean, it's not like we're discussing DNA Repair
I was not aware of that
Though Craig Hinton was a friend, Time's Champion really doesn't count even within book 'canon/continuity/call it anything so long as we don't start off an argument about whether it counts in the series!'.
He hadn't finished it when he died, and nice though it is to have it available, it's not been published by the licenced publisher (ie, BBC/Ebury at that point, and earlier Virgin). It's like Jim Mortimore's Campaign, or the script book of The Masters of Luxor - a glimpse of something that might have been.
Also, Terrance Dicks' novels for Virgin (Exodus, initially) make it clear that the War Chief and the Master can't be the same person.
David McIntee's 'Basil Rathbone' Master appears only in First Frontier and Happy Endings, both Virgin books.
The Master who appears in the 8th Doctor comic strips is in-between the Eric Roberts incarnation and the Time Lords resurrecting him, in that he's again living on borrowed time in a stolen body (a dark-skinned street preacher/prophet of doom).
On trying to number the Master's incarnations... it's wild goose chase. There's no way of knowing whether the Deadly Assassin Master is the Delgado incarnation, unable to regenerate after a horrific maiming, or the result of a failed regeneration. Then the implication of the final shot of Assassin is that the Master is regenerating (that was the intention of the producer at the time), but it's not entirely successful (hence his slightly improved but still unhappy state in Keeper of Traken).
And then... David McIntee's Dark Path ends with the Delgado incarnation, before his TV debut, caught in a temporal trap which is forcing him to regenerate continuously without changing form as he tries to escape.
Add it all together, and all you can rally do is put them in order, no more. 1st known Master, etc, but don't try to connect them to the 12 regen cycle.
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But, that's half the fun!
So far...unless I missed some, and in no order at all:
('*' indicates unnatural regeneration/stolen body)
- War Chief (maybe?)
- Roger Delgado
- Geoffrey Beevers/Peter Pratt
- Anthony Ainley*
- Gordon Tipple* (maybe, he might be Ainley)
- The snake-creature* (tv movie/novel)
- Eric Roberts*
- Street Prophet version* (Doctor Who Monthly comic strip)
- The android Shalka version (webisode)
- 'Basil Rathbone' version (novel)
- Professor Yana incarnation
- Harold Saxon incarnation
Who else am I missing here? I think it's fascinating that, even if you don't count the War Chief, we've seen what appears to be only four natural incarnations of The Master. Everything else is just a vessel for his essence/spirit/genetics...
There's also Gatiss' Master from the audio "Sympathy for the Devil". He regenerated early in that story, so he could count as two incarnations.
But, that's half the fun!
So far...unless I missed some, and in no order at all:
('*' indicates unnatural regeneration/stolen body)
- War Chief (maybe?)
- Roger Delgado
- Geoffrey Beevers/Peter Pratt
- Anthony Ainley*
- Gordon Tipple* (maybe, he might be Ainley)
- The snake-creature* (tv movie/novel)
- Eric Roberts*
- Street Prophet version* (Doctor Who Monthly comic strip)
- The android Shalka version (webisode)
- 'Basil Rathbone' version (novel)
- Professor Yana incarnation
- Harold Saxon incarnation
Who else am I missing here? I think it's fascinating that, even if you don't count the War Chief, we've seen what appears to be only four natural incarnations of The Master. Everything else is just a vessel for his essence/spirit/genetics...
There's also Gatiss' Master from the audio "Sympathy for the Devil". He regenerated early in that story, so he could count as two incarnations.
But, that's half the fun!
So far...unless I missed some, and in no order at all:
('*' indicates unnatural regeneration/stolen body)
Who else am I missing here? I think it's fascinating that, even if you don't count the War Chief, we've seen what appears to be only four natural incarnations of The Master. Everything else is just a vessel for his essence/spirit/genetics...
- War Chief (maybe?)
- Roger Delgado
- Geoffrey Beevers/Peter Pratt
- Anthony Ainley*
- Gordon Tipple* (maybe, he might be Ainley)
- The snake-creature* (tv movie/novel)
- Eric Roberts*
- Street Prophet version* (Doctor Who Monthly comic strip)
- The android Shalka version (webisode)
- 'Basil Rathbone' version (novel)
- Professor Yana incarnation
- Harold Saxon incarnation
The orcer's roughly right, actually, but the 'Basil Rathbone' incarnation from the novels comes right after Ainley, so the simplest thing is to assume that he's the incarnation played by Gordon Tipple at the start of the TV movie.
Both the Shalka android and the Sympathy for the Devil incarnation appear in alternate timeline stories alongside alternate Doctors, so they don't belong in the main list (though you could argue that the Richard E Grant Doctor from Shalka is actually the 11th or later Doctor, as he's never stated to be the ninth within the drama, just the PR at the time. But the David Warner Doctor in Sympathy is definitely an alt-three).
From reading YuWanker's other posts, I get the feeling he's tried pushing something outlandish on wikipedia only to have it shot down in a flurry of [citation needed] tags.
For the purposes of pop culture, Wikipedia suffices. I mean, it's not like we're discussing DNA Repair
LOL quite the opposite actually, I just finished a 3 BA Hons Degree in Criminology and Social Policy (deeply dull) and I have been smacked with the Wiki line consistently for all of those years. I have also seen several blatent lies pop up regrading Dr Who on the Wiki, several of them have been exposed on Outpost IIRC. I have never editied anything on the Wikipedia, I dont see a point. It has it's uses but should never be considered difinitive or used as a primary scorce for anything thats all I am trying to get across.
Hmmm...I can see that. However, Tipple could also be the Ainley version for all we know. That's why I'd list someone like the War Chief, because it's "possible". But, I don't really disagree, either.
You're right here. I should have left Shalka out of it, based exactly for the same reason I left out Gatiss' version.
So, then, the revised list would be...
('*' indicates unnatural regeneration/stolen body)
- War Chief (maybe?)
- Roger Delgado
- Geoffrey Beevers/Peter Pratt
- Anthony Ainley*
- 'Basil Rathbone' version (novel)
- Gordon Tipple* (maybe, he might be Ainley)
- The snake-creature* (tv movie/novel)
- Eric Roberts*
- Street Prophet version* (Doctor Who Monthly comic strip)
- Professor Yana incarnation
- Harold Saxon incarnation
The eighth Doctor novels have a "ghostly" version of the Master who appears on monitor screens and such, in what was originally intended to lead into Scream of the Shalka.
There's also a fellow referred to as "the Man with the Rosette" in The Adventuress of Henrietta Street who is pretty clearly intended to be the Master, but this is never explicitly stated.
There's also a fellow referred to as "the Man with the Rosette" in The Adventuress of Henrietta Street who is pretty clearly intended to be the Master, but this is never explicitly stated.
The offer of a new set of regenerations came in The 5 Doctors not in TotTL.
In TotTL they were going to take away The Doctor's remaining regenerations and give them to the Valliard.
I stand corrected, however even that is deceptive when you consider that the Valeyard was the Dark side of Dr between regen 12-13. I always wondered how exactly they would pull that off. And again as for the Master he was trapped in the Matrix with the Valeyard IIRC.
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