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The Five Doctors (Spoilers)

Admiral_Young

Admiral_Young

Fleet Admiral
Admiral
Well I just finished watching The Five Doctors and continue to be impressed by the old series. I so want another multi-Doctor episode...this one was so much fun!!! Anthony Ainley's Master was terrific, the Cybermen were not as lame as I thought they would be, seeing all Five Doctors (even though there was a brief cameo by Tom Baker...I understand that he was demanding too much money to be in it properly) was very cool along with their companions. It was great to see Gallifrey...and the Doctor running from his responsibities, always running, Rassilon was pretty cool. Elizabeth Sladen with her poofy hair was hot...so was Teegan and Susan lol! This might be a stupid question but when the First Doctor encounters The Master in the Tor why didn't he recognize him? Was it because of the Master regenerating? The Master seemed to recognize all the previous incarnations.
 
Admiral_Young said:
even though there was a brief cameo by Tom Baker...I understand that he was demanding too much money to be in it properly
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Money had nothing to do with it. The reason he cited for not appearing was that he hadn't been gone long enough for a return to be worthwhile.
This might be a stupid question but when the First Doctor encounters The Master in the Tor why didn't he recognize him? Was it because of the Master regenerating?
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Yes. The first Doctor had never previously met the Ainley version of the Master. He would presumably have recognized whichever incarnation he knew when they were at the Academy together.
The Master seemed to recognize all the previous incarnations.
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Because he had met them all in his personal past. It's the same reason the Doctors recognize their past companions but not their future ones.
 
But what about other Time Lords recognizing The Doctor who had never meet that regeneration, like Drax or Runcible?

I always figured The First Doctor was just being forgetful (which has done in the past).
 
I realized that I also left out the Brigider and K-9...I loved Sarah Jane's line where she realizes she should've listened to the dog!!! The Dalek appearence was pretty lame but funny. The Time Lords who recognzied the Doctor's previous incarnations were High Council members who already regenerated themselves so I assumed they'd previously encountered those incarnations before.
 
Emh said:
But what about other Time Lords recognizing The Doctor who had never meet that regeneration, like Drax or Runcible?
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Well, obviously different stories might have a different logic; certainly "The Sound of Drums" suggests that the Doctor will know the Master despite never having seen the Simm incarnation, for instance. And even in "The Five Doctors," the first Doctor recognizes the Master quickly and accurately once he knows it's someone he should know. It's possible that the first Doctor wasn't as familiar with the Master as Drax and Runcible were with the fourth Doctor, so whatever signals Time Lords use to recognize each other across regenerations may have taken longer or worked less easily.

Or it could be a TV show where the writers did whatever they fancied on the day...
 
Gentlemen!!

The Master's Timelord Body was dead. He was using Nyssa's father's body as a Taxi. What ever psychic mentality he was broadcasting, the brain he was using wasn't made from Gallifrean DNA... If they have DNA. :)

Y'Know in retrospect, that Nyssa never said much anything like "get the hell out of my father" or the such what indicates positively Victorian marrers and repression. Though i do wonder if she ended up pairing up romantically with that Dog on terminus? Spend enough time with some one and you soon get over most any superficial unattractiveness.
 
Guy Gardener said:
The Master's Timelord Body was dead. He was using Nyssa's father's body as a Taxi. What ever psychic mentality he was broadcasting, the brain he was using wasn't made from Gallifrean DNA... If they have DNA. :)
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Well, I could quibble that the Master's Time Lord body was integrated into Tremas' form rather than a simple body hop, but either way the third Doctor recognizes the Ainley Master pretty quickly as well.

Of course, all this could also be down to the Doctor only knowing one bearded guy who likes to dress in black and sneer.
 
Brendan Moody said:
Guy Gardener said:
The Master's Timelord Body was dead. He was using Nyssa's father's body as a Taxi. What ever psychic mentality he was broadcasting, the brain he was using wasn't made from Gallifrean DNA... If they have DNA. :)
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Well, I could quibble that the Master's Time Lord body was integrated into Tremas' form rather than a simple body hop, but either way the third Doctor recognizes the Ainley Master pretty quickly as well.

Of course, all this could also be down to the Doctor only knowing one bearded guy who likes to dress in black and sneer.
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Or just that the third Doctor was running into the Master fairly regularly, whereas (as far as we know) the first might not have seen him since leaving Gallifrey, decades or centuries ago. It's the difference between recognising someone you work with every day, and someone you last saw back at junior school.
 
diankra said:
Or just that the third Doctor was running into the Master fairly regularly, whereas (as far as we know) the first might not have seen him since leaving Gallifrey, decades or centuries ago. It's the difference between recognising someone you work with every day, and someone you last saw back at junior school.
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That's pretty much the kind of thing I meant in post #5, yeah. Although this bit:
And even in "The Five Doctors," the first Doctor recognizes the Master quickly and accurately once he knows it's someone he should know.
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Is not right. I was misremembering the scene. Looking at it again (thank goodness for YouTube), it's ambiguous as to whether the first recognizes the Master at all, though his demeanor strongly suggests he doesn't. Either way, this explanation works.
 
Also, it's possible that the Master hadn't actually become the Master in the First Doctor's era. Lonemagpie's The Dark Path is an origin story for Delgado's Master, set in the Second Doctor's era. Combined with the fact that Ainley's Master is not a pure Time Lord, this might explain why the First Doctor didn't recognize him.
 
Yummy.

I picked up the Five Doctors 25th anniversary dvd on Friday and went through most of the bonus features over the weekend, as well as the new companion's commentary and text commentary on the first disc.

I know the plot is contrived. I know the story is about as weak as they come. But I don't care. The whole point isn't plot at all here, it's seeing the various Doctors and companions coming together. I love it.

I really do wish Tom Baker would have appeared. But in a slightly different way. I wish he'd appeared with Adric. It would have added something to the story, for Tegan at least, to see someone she knows to be dead, but from his perspective very much alive.

Plus, as they said in the features, it would have been Tom who went back with the Master's transportermobopperthingy and found the President. That might have been a fun, juicy story.

They could easily have expanded it another half hour to add more time for the Doctors to be together in the end. As it is, we get about 3 minutes of the four together and then it's time for them to leave again. But what we get is awesome. "Where's the little one" and such. lol
 
It really is too bad that Tom didn't appear. It was our last chance for a recognizable 4th Doctor. Would've been very cool. Alas, that chance was blown.

Mr Awe
 
Mr Awe said:
It really is too bad that Tom didn't appear. It was our last chance for a recognizable 4th Doctor. Would've been very cool. Alas, that chance was blown.

Mr Awe
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Blown by Tom himself. John Nathan-Turner asked him to appear, but he turned the offer down.
 
The Gill-Man said:
Yummy.

I picked up the Five Doctors 25th anniversary dvd on Friday and went through most of the bonus features over the weekend, as well as the new companion's commentary and text commentary on the first disc.

I know the plot is contrived. I know the story is about as weak as they come. But I don't care. The whole point isn't plot at all here, it's seeing the various Doctors and companions coming together. I love it.

I really do wish Tom Baker would have appeared. But in a slightly different way. I wish he'd appeared with Adric. It would have added something to the story, for Tegan at least, to see someone she knows to be dead, but from his perspective very much alive.

Plus, as they said in the features, it would have been Tom who went back with the Master's transportermobopperthingy and found the President. That might have been a fun, juicy story.

They could easily have expanded it another half hour to add more time for the Doctors to be together in the end. As it is, we get about 3 minutes of the four together and then it's time for them to leave again. But what we get is awesome. "Where's the little one" and such. lol
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Having them together for so little time was a deliberate decision, part of the brief John Nathan-Turner gave to Terrance Dicks, in case there were any personality/ego clashes. (I suspect that might have been more of an issue when they were still hoping Tom Baker would be involved, because he had been very moody duringhis last year on the show).
 
I quite enjoy the Five Doctors as an anniversary treat. Looking too long at all the plot holes... you just can't do it. And it is a shame about Tom, but at the time, his feelings were understandable.
 
Why did Tom turn it down? I've heard several rumours but would be nice to know his reasoning.

At the end of the day there was a lot crammed in with just four Doctors, so I'm sure we'd have ended up with less of the others if he had showed up...and who'd he have teamed up with also?
 
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