'The Enemy', was Picard or Tomalak right?

[JesterFace]

I tried a quick searck (too quick?) for the old thread, no luck with that, got to to start a new one.
This really bothers me because I want to or almost need to watch 'The Enemy'. I did watch it today.... and the same things popped up in my head. I think it would be smart to see this one before going into 'The Defector'.

In 'The Enemy' a romulan officers life is in danger because there's no cure for him on the Enterprise, except reluctant Worf. The Romulans could help him but are on the other side of the Neutral Zone.

Here's the question:

Did Picard do the right thing when he didn't allow the Romulan ship to enter the Neurtal Zone to help their officer?

Like Tomalak said: ”You would place territory over a man's life?”
Was it really worth a life to prevent Romulans to help their officer?

I think Picard should have allowed the Romulans to help their officer even if they had broken some borders. That officer only had one life.

Maybe Picard assumed all the time he could convince Worf to the transfusion?
Did Federation have such strick rules that there was no way Picard could allow the Romulans to reach them?

What about shuttles?

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

IIRC, the Romulan was already dead by the time Tomalak's ship was in transporter range of the Enterprise.

I mean, from the time we heard Tomalak's initial message, we already knew he was within the neutral zone, but it wasn't until much later that his ship actually got close enough for transport. I'm fairly sure the Romulan had already passed by that time.

 

[flandry84]

Leaving aside the whole Worf subplot (I always hated Worf,this episode vindicated that)
Picard was dead right to deny the Romulans any access to the neutral zone until he could determine exactly what they were up to there...Romulans always being up to something.

 

[Mojochi]

Given that Tomalak was actively lying to Picard about the number of trespassers, most likely because they were secretly engaged in some nefarious undertaking in Federation space? No, Tomalak isn't in the right about anything he's proclaiming, all of which was less about lives saved & more likely only situational positioning against an adversary anyhow, & if his people's lives are in jeopardy because of what they were doing, they are so of their own volition.

Frankly, Picard was obscenely & detrimentally generous to even offer to return the guy at all, or bother telling Tomalak anything about it either. I'm with Riker & Worf on this one. I'd have just stayed silent about having the guy, & about intercepting Tomalak's message to them, & then waited to see if he would cross the border to retrieve them, & gathered as many ships as I could get to greet him, with a "Just WTF are you doing here?"

And if they wanted to know if we'd found any of their spies, I might tell them in that scenario, & if their guy had died by then, they'd get told we found him that way, or found him almost dead & there was nothing we could do. I certainly wouldn't open a dialog about it, when not only is the guy's life hanging in the balance, thereby publicly declaring us responsible for whatever happens to it, I definitely wouldn't do so while one of my own people's lives is still in jeopardy on the surface. F$#% that guy. He's lucky we even tried to save his life, after his dirty business.

 

[JesterFace]

IIRC, the Romulan was already dead by the time Tomalak's ship was in transporter range of the Enterprise.

As I understood it the Romulan ship could've reached the Enterprise in time had it been given the permission to meet with the Enterprise.

Leaving aside the whole Worf subplot (I always hated Worf,this episode vindicated that)
Picard was dead right to deny the Romulans any access to the neutral zone until he could determine exactly what they were up to there...Romulans always being up to something.

Picard was right in not letting the Romulans cross the Neutral Zone (which they eventually did anyway) but once again I want to mention this. That Romulan officer had only one life. Why not let a ship or a shuttle to meet with the Enterprise? What is gained by letting him die?

 

[Mojochi]

What is gained by letting him die?

Stopping further incursion. We don't even know what they were doing there yet, unless you just want to take Tomalak's explanation at face value. These are non-friendlies meddling around in your territory for unknown reasons. You want to let in more of them, without knowing what's going on? and while your own man is still at risk?

And here's how I would've dealt with Worf. "I know you don't trust him. I don't trust him either. I know you don't want to help him. Neither do I.... BUT we need him alive to know just WTF is going on here. You're not helping him. You're helping US, by keeping him alive. Hell, he'd probably rather die than let us keep him alive right now. Don't let him get out of it that easy dumbA$$!" I bet Worf would understand THAT lol

 

[flandry84]

Not to go into details but the issue of a life saving blood transfusion has relevance to my family.
I will hate Worf til’ the day I die.

 

[Mojochi]

You know... I'm with Riker & Worf's initial suggestion about how to deal with the Romulans, but I'm not with Worf's refusal to be a donor. In fact, it goes beyond just the ethical issue of the one Romulan's life

It's a deliberate refusal to act in the best interest of his crew's safety & security... & he is the SECURITY chief! They could've ended up in serious danger because he wouldn't act. Now, it's Picard's prerogative to not order him to submit to the donor process, & I sort of understand his thinking, even if I myself might not do the same.

However, if Worf isn't going to volunteer, as the captain, that's a character assessment issue. He replaced numerous chief engineers for untold reasons in season 1. Having someone in the post of security chief, who lacks the character to act toward everyone's security, over personal prejudices, is certainly cause to reevaluate having him in that post.

I'd have replaced him as security chief, after that, especially after explaining the reason to him in the scene where he begged. You're supposed to choose to do the right thing if you're going to be a leader here.

That said... this is one of my favorite episodes, & I love talking about it... obviously lol

 

[Spock .]

I think that Picard was right to not allow the Romulans to cross over in Federation space. As has been said before, no one should ever trust a Romulan. Even if all they planned to do was come over, get the Romulan, and go home, they still would have been able to get valuable information about the layout of Federation space and, possibly, the Enterprise. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few or the one.

 

[DonIago]

It amuses me to see Spock quoted at the same time as advocating to never trust a member of a given race.

 

[Spock .]

It amuses me to see Spock quoted at the same time as advocating to never trust a member of a given race.

What can I say? Romulans are totally untrustworthy .

 

[The Wormhole]

And here's how I would've dealt with Worf. "I know you don't trust him. I don't trust him either. I know you don't want to help him. Neither do I.... BUT we need him alive to know just WTF is going on here. You're not helping him. You're helping US, by keeping him alive. Hell, he'd probably rather die than let us keep him alive right now. Don't let him get out of it that easy dumbA$$!" I bet Worf would understand THAT lol

The thing is, Worf did speak with the Romulan, and the Romulan said he didn't want Klingon blood "polluting his veins." At that point, it's useless to continue trying to convince Worf, because even if he did consent to giving his blood, the Romulan doesn't want it, and medical ethics prevent Dr. Crusher from providing aid a patient specifically says he doesn't want. Granted, the episode conveniently ignores this with Crusher and Picard continuing to try and talk Worf into the transfusion even after his conversation with the Romulan, but at that point Worf is off the hook and no longer responsible for the Romulan's health/death.

 

[Mojochi]

The thing is, Worf did speak with the Romulan, and the Romulan said he didn't want Klingon blood "polluting his veins." At that point, it's useless to continue trying to convince Worf, because even if he did consent to giving his blood, the Romulan doesn't want it, and medical ethics prevent Dr. Crusher from providing aid a patient specifically says he doesn't want. Granted, the episode conveniently ignores this with Crusher and Picard continuing to try and talk Worf into the transfusion even after his conversation with the Romulan, but at that point Worf is off the hook and no longer responsible for the Romulan's health/death.

The Romulan, who was caught engaged in suspicious incursion, is an officer of the Romulan fleet, & his superior officer has negated his personal desire to die, by posing a threat if he does. Now even though I'm not suggesting that this fully forces Picard's hand to keep him alive, it does suggest that letting him die is more trouble than making him live against his wishes.

Dr. Crusher's medical ethics are superseded by her enlistment in this fleet, in this instance. She is Commander Doctor Beverly Crusher. She has a duty to serve Starfleet's interests, to preserve life and to respect the patient's wishes. In a case of conflict of interest, like the patient wishing to die, even though that's part of her ethical duty, she has other more prominent concerns, for instance the well being of her entire crew, if an altercation breaks out because he dies.

That guy's desire to die by refusing treatment is of no consequence, especially since he's suspected of criminal activity. He doesn't get the luxury of a right to die on their ship, & endanger all the lives aboard. That treatment poses no threat to him. He probably would've preferred to not have been brought there at all, but since they did, they have obligations to preserve his life, not the least of which is their own safety.

I don't even think Dr. Crusher should've been allowed to endanger everyone by bringing Hugh aboard to treat him. In that case, she should've been told & made to leave him for dead. So I certainly don't think she should have to let someone die at everyone's risk of threat either. She is an officer & then a doctor. If she didn't want that arrangement, she should've brought her doctoring somewhere else.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

They had stasis for centuries by TNG. They couldn't have put him in stasis? I know, the plot device only works if he dies.

 

[DonIago]

The stasis chambers were in the process of being upgraded. They were scheduled to be up and running next Tuesday, sadly. :/

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

The stasis chambers were in the process of being upgraded. They were scheduled to be up and running next Tuesday, sadly. :/

It's always some damn thing or another.

 

[Mojochi]

Yeah, shuttles, stasis units, other plot dependent conveniences... temporarily offline lol

 

[The Wormhole]

Dr. Crusher's medical ethics are superseded by her enlistment in this fleet,

Actually, no. The Hippocratic Oath and medical ethics supersede everything else, including oaths of allegiance and service.

 

[Mojochi]

It's not just an oath of allegiance though. It's an oath to protect the safety of her own crew, which certainly supersedes someone else's wish to refuse life saving treatment & die under their care, when doing so endangers them all. Maybe the doctor's ethics require that, but the doctor's ethics are not the only consideration. Plus, even within medical ethics there are times when the patient's judgement is deemed compromised enough to dismiss. When the patient's refusal is simple bigotry, & the patient is a member of a hostile entity, caught engaged in suspicious actions, they are essentially in criminal custody, & their judgement is questionable.

Of course that guy would rather die than remain in their custody. Who knows what he was up to. Not everything is black & white, you always do what the patient says. If a patient came in with an unexploded timebomb embedded in them & refused treatment for its removal, the doctors would not have a duty to respect that refusal & let everyone else die in the explosion. The patient's judgement is suspect.

 

[JesterFace]

That said... this is one of my favorite episodes, & I love talking about it...

It is really interesting episode and I'd like to like it.
But, like Tomalak said: "You would put terrirory over a man's life". Hard to get past that even if the Romulans are deceitful baddies. That Romulan only had one life. Let the Warbird get him and then escort the Romulans out of Federation territory. How much damage would be done? It would make more sense to allow the Romulans to save their officer, It would be beneficial with Federation and Romulan relations. Perhaps Picard thought he could convince Worf.

Then there's the statis thing.... He could not be put into stasis because the effects the planet had done to him? I don't want to ruin this episode for anyone, these thoughts just return after every rewatch.