The Comparisons between STXI and "Batman Begins"/Casino Royale

[TrekLost]

A bunch of people have compared STXI to "Batman Begins" and "Casino Royale". So I thought I'd see how similar they are (spoilers for all... although seriously, if you haven't seen all three, please hand in your geek card):

State of the Franchise before the movie came along:
Batman Begins: Although the movie franchise was dead as a doornail, Batman still was popular in the comics and TV Cartoons.
Casino Royale: Was still profitable, but had gotten very stale.
STXI: On life support, with the previous movie flopping and the Enterprise having been cancelled.

Parents of our main Hero:
Batman Begins: Bruce Wayne's Parents are dead
Casino Royale: James Bond's parents are long-dead
STXI: Jim Kirk's Dad is dead, having given up his life so that his family can live.

What drives our Hero to action:
Batman Begins: Vengeance.
Casino Royale: Duty- it's his job.
STXI: Captain Pike asking him if he will settle for an ordinary life, or if he wants to be something more, some special.

Cast:
Batman Begins: Most of the cast was either highly respected or had some previous critical or commercial success
Casino Royale: James Bond is BLONDE?!?! Are they NUTS?!?! Well, at least Judi Dench is still around.
STXI: Generally either unknowns or people who had not done many "big" mainstream dramatic movies (with some exceptions, like Karl Urban in LOTR). Supporting cast (Bana, Greenwood, Nimoy, Cross, Ryder) was pretty well-known though.

Nods to previous canon:
Batman Begins: None. Thank god.
Casino Royale: Some in-jokes.
STXI: Previous Canon is integrated into the story.

Confidants:
BB: Alfred. Lucius Fox. Jim Gordon.
CR: Vesper Lynd. Felix Leiter.
STXI: Bones. Scotty. Eventually Spock.

Villain:
Batman Begins: Ra's Al Ghul wants to destroy Gotham City
Casino Royale: Le Chiffre wants to pay off debts to Terrorists
STXI: Nero wants to destroy everything in the Federation

Theme music (by which I mean the score theme music):
Batman Begins: Not heard in full until the end.
Casino Royale: Is heard in snippets, but isn't heard fully until the end
STXI: Not heard until the end

Torture Scene:
BB: Hallucinogens that make you see what you fear
CR: Testicles get beaten
STXI: Centauri Slugs

Villain dies by:
Batman Begins: Explosion in a runaway elevated train-crash. Batman wouldn't kill him, but he didn't have to save him.
Casino Royale: Shot by enforcer for larger organization (revealed in sequel to be QUANTUM)
STXI: In a black hole, after refusing Kirk's offer of help.


Sequel hook:
BB: The Joker's calling card
CR: "The name's Bond, James Bond"
STXI: None.

Hmmmm

 

[DiSiLLUSiON]

I have seen neither "Batman Begins" nor "Casino Royale". *hands in geek card*

 

[GNDN]

Sequel hook:
STX!: Spock as willing XO, Kirk "Take us out" in gold shirt, Spock Classic "Space, the final frontier..."

Take your pick, all the pieces are in place now for and the Enterprise is fully manned (personned?) and ready for the next adventure. Not a cliffhanger, but clearly primed for ST XII

 

[24thcenstfan]

Good comparison. Some similarities, some differences. The biggest difference for me is I loved the Star Trek reboot. Star Trek feels like Trek to me despite the revamp. Abrams and Co. were able to maintain that hard to describe "it factor" that makes Trek, Trek.

With Casino Royale (and Quantum of Solace), I did not like that reboot. Neither feel like Bond to me. Too much of a radical departure from the Bond characters that came before. While QoS was somewhat enjoyable as a movie, it was not Bond (IMO). The "feel" was not there for me. Just some character running around with the same name. I was afraid that would happen in Trek, but thankfully it didn't.

With Batman Begins, I think they captured the Batman essence somewhat. The Batman franchise always had a dark feel to it for the most part anyway. So it wasn't totally out in left field for me. I do think some of the characters were miscast (characters – Rachel Dawes and Scarecrow). Again, thankfully they did a great job casting for XI.

 

[wekkuli]

Theme music (by which I mean the score theme music):
STXI: Not heard until the end

The new theme music is played many times during the film (Main titles, when Enterprise is revealed and Nero's ship gets destroyed etc). The old theme song from the 60's is played during the closing credits.

 

[barnaclelapse]

Good comparison. Some similarities, some differences. The biggest difference for me is I loved the Star Trek reboot. Star Trek feels like Trek to me despite the revamp. Abrams and Co. were able to maintain that hard to describe "it factor" that makes Trek, Trek.

With Casino Royale (and Quantum of Solace), I did not like that reboot. Neither feel like Bond to me. Too much of a radical departure from the Bond characters that came before. While QoS was somewhat enjoyable as a movie, it was not Bond (IMO). The "feel" was not there for me. Just some character running around with the same name. I was afraid that would happen in Trek, but thankfully it didn't.

With Batman Begins, I think they captured the Batman essence somewhat. The Batman franchise always had a dark feel to it for the most part anyway. So it wasn't totally out in left field for me. I do think some of the characters were miscast (characters – Rachel Dawes and Scarecrow). Again, thankfully they did a great job casting for XI.

Definitely agree with you for Bond and Batman, and I think Bond's momentum took a decent hit from Quantum, which didn't seem to do as well as Casino. I think it proved that it's one thing to give a shot in the arm to an ailing franchise, but it's another thing entirely to keep that momentum going. To me, the second film is almost more important than the first one. The right combination of filmmaking elements can establish a strong reboot, but it's often very, very hard to get lightning to strike twice, if I can use an absolutely exhausted cliche.

Batman proved it's possible though.

As for the overall comparisons, some interesting points made.

 

[DigificWriter]

Personally, I don't see anything at all in common between ST and BB other than that they are both franchise reboot projects. ST is an entirely different animal than BB, because it (ST) doesn't completely disregard the previous entries in the franchise the way that BB does and did. ST has much more in common with Casino Royale and Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles than it does BB, particularly TSCC, because they are all what I have come to call 'derivative reboots', as opposed to the 'total reboot' that is Batman Begins (The Incredible Hulk is another recent example of a 'total reboot'). ST also has much in common with TSCC because, like TSCC, it creates an alternate timeline for itself that diverges from an existing timeline.

 

[Islander]

We just have to accept that it is the time of reboots in Holywood. Either writters are out of new idea or the public doesn't accept them, but expect other franchises shortly. Anybody for a Space:1999 reboot? My lawn furnitures needs renewal...

 

[Cakes488]

I have seen neither "Batman Begins" nor "Casino Royale". *hands in geek card*

Me neither...and I've never even been issued this geek card...where can I get one and does it offer any discounts to comic shops...LOL.

 

[Greg Cox]

Actually, the new movie reminds me most of the new DOCTOR WHO. There are plenty of easter eggs acknowledging the series's storied past, but it's spruced up and made accessible for newcomers as well.

Hey, how about Billie Piper as Yeoman Rand?

 

[Ovation]

Actually, the new movie reminds me most of the new DOCTOR WHO. There are plenty of easter eggs acknowledging the series's storied past, but it's spruced up and made accessible for newcomers as well.

Hey, how about Billie Piper as Yeoman Rand?

I agree (on both counts). I would have been happy with Freema Agyeman as Uhura as well (though Zoe Saldana was fine).

 

[MostlyHarmless1]

I think you should quite rightly add "Doctor Who" to the thread and I'll tell you whyfore:

State of the Franchise before the reboot came along:
STXI: On life support, with the previous movie flopping and the Enterprise having been cancelled.
DW: Canceled in 1989 due to horrendous ratings and lack of budget, it became something of a national joke in the mainstream media. Failed american reboot of 1996 barely bliped on the radar.

Parents of our main Hero:
STXI: Jim Kirk's Dad is dead, having given up his life so that his family can live.
DW: Presumed dead; never mentioned.

New section: Status of planet of a major character:
STXI: Spock's Homeworld is destroyed in front of his own eyes leading to much angryness.
DW: The Doctor's Homeworld is destroyed by his arch-enemies in front of his eyes...much angryness and lonliness therein.

What drives our Hero to action:
STXI: Captain Pike asking him if he will settle for an ordinary life, or if he wants to be something more, some special.
DW: Lonliness, adventure.

Cast:
STXI: Generally either unknowns or people who had not done many "big" mainstream dramatic movies (with some exceptions, like Karl Urban in LOTR). Supporting cast (Bana, Greenwood, Nimoy, Cross, Ryder) was pretty well-known though.
DW: A Northern, leather-jacketted, intense Christopher Esccleston trumps everyones perceptions just like the Trek cast and David Tennant and John Barrowman ensure the show becomes a respected national icon again. Billie Piper also proves she isn't a bit of stunt casting (like Pegg)

Nods to previous canon:

Casino Royale: Some in-jokes.
STXI: Previous Canon is integrated into the story.
DW: Just like STXI has its Nero intervention to explain away all the differences so too does Doctor Who has the fabled "Time War" between the TimeLords and the Daleks which eradicated both species and changed much of established history (the ship's interior for one) Many recurring villains and in-jokes.

Confidants:
STXI: Bones. Scotty. Eventually Spock.
DW: Rose, Jack, Martha, Harriet Jones...et al.

Villain:
STXI: Nero wants to destroy everything in the Federation
DW: Just as Nero killed Kirk's dad and destroyed Spock's planet, the Daleks are responsible for everything the Doctor has lost...

Theme music (by which I mean the score theme music):
Batman Begins: Not heard in full until the end.
Casino Royale: Is heard in snippets, but isn't heard fully until the end
STXI: Not heard until the end
DW: Loud and proud from the start! But also the theme is subtly worked in to the episodes by Murray Gold.

Torture Scene:
BB: Hallucinogens that make you see what you fear
CR: Testicles get beaten
STXI: Centauri Slugs
DW: S1 EP6 "Dalek" - in which the Doctor is held captive by an alien collector.

Villain dies by:
STXI: In a black hole, after refusing Kirk's offer of help.
DW: Rose opens the heart of the Doctor's Timeship and, infused with power, obliterates the Daleks atom by atom (of course many of them have hidden in the void between realities...they always survive awkward so and sos)

Sequel hook:
BB: The Joker's calling card
CR: "The name's Bond, James Bond"
STXI: "Space, the Final Frontier..."
DW: The Doctor is dying, but uses a TimeLord trick to regenerate every cell in his body. He explodes with light and emerges a different man...
"Ooh new teeth. That's weird. Now where was I? Oh that's right. Barcelona!"

 

[RoJoHen]

I only compared this movie to Batman Begins on a very basic level. And what I mean by that is: This new Star Trek movie was a good film that established a universe. It wasn't a perfect movie, but it got the job done, and it was a fun ride, and it has laid the groundwork for a truly outstanding sequel.

 

[Carpe Occasio]

"Holy reboot Batman, what now?!"

"To the Paramount backlot Robin!"

---------------------------------

"I'll have a Cardassian Sunrise... shaken, not stirred."