The Classic/Retro Pop Culture Thread

Discussion in 'TV & Media' started by The Old Mixer, Jan 11, 2016.

  1. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk A Spock and a smile Premium Member

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    I love the Who. After the Beatles, my favorite band. Yeah they didn't really "hit it big" till the end of the Sixties, but it wasn't from lack of trying. Their mid Sixties output stands with the best of that time even if the US charts don't reflect it. It's been said they founded both Heavy Metal and Punk. Quadrophenia is a masterpiece. My first wife was part of the Mod revival of the 80's and really got me into that part of the Who's legacy.
     
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  2. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Wonderful song. You call it "sunshine pop" but its rather moody in places, especially with the string section.


    Solid end to season two with a fascinating character in Gary Seven.


    One wonders why Get Smart did not spoof its network-mate earlier in its run, as "Die, Spy" premiered a little over two weeks before I Spy aired its final, first-run episode on April 15, 1968.

    Never fond of this song.

    As far as rock bands go, I see no reason why they would not rank at #3 in terms of growth / innovation (already covered), landmark tracks that not only helped establish the "British Invasion" as a serious musical force, created songs that gave a voice to teenagers and social / personal problems few to none covered (e.g., "My Generation", "Substitute", etc.). While other acts either sparked, then quickly faded (Cream), were always climbing, but never reaching a consistent high level (The Animals), or were hit and miss (The Kinks), The Who--despite internal issues--not only soldiered on, but were changing the genre along the way. That is a significant set of credits.


    Well, if you're going by sales, you could place The Monkees up there, since there were a couple of years where they were outselling The Beatles and the Stones. The point being that ranking includes several factors, not just checking the box next to commercial appeal; The Who's overall feat in such a loaded, competitive decade left them soaring above innumerable acts.
     
  3. RJDiogenes

    RJDiogenes Idealistic Cynic and Canon Champion Premium Member

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    Not one of their most memorable songs, but that's definitely the sound of my 60s.

    Another strong element of my internal 60s soundtrack. A very easygoing sound and sentiment.

    Reminds me of Willie Whistle. :rommie:

    That's a nice, and long, performance. I love "Honeysuckle Rose."

    Very nice, and appropriately surreal.

    Well, the producers had probably seen it or seen parts of it, or at least stills from it.

    Tara was fine. Her only problem was that she was not Emma Peel. But nobody is Emma Peel.

    I watched Ironside hardly at all back in the day and Raymond Burr seems so stuffy that it's funny to think his show was so groovy. :rommie:

    Oooh, I love Michael Dunn.

    It does seem pretty entertaining. I'll have to pay more attention if it ever shows up on one of my channels.

    There's the Third Spy Network. I remember getting a big kick out of that.

    I don't remember this one. Easy to listen to, but nothing special.

    I had forgotten about this one, but I like it. Definitely the sound o' the times.

    Not exactly one of Stevie's best.

    Nice party song. They've done better, but it's also part of my internal soundtrack. I somehow connect to the theme from the Saturday-morning Hardy Boys cartoon.

    Oh, yeah, you must see both of these. Both are amazing classics.
     
  4. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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    Not
    just
    me.

    See, that's why I used the term "critical hindsight" several posts back on this subject. The Who barely made a blip on the American radar during the British Invasion period. It's easy to retroactively insert them as a major force in that part of the decade after they've done something like Tommy, but by that point the British Invasion was a major musical movement or three in the past. The Who simply were not playing on the same field as the Beatles or the Stones for the bulk of the decade.

    To look at how the Rolling Stone 100 Greatest Artists list ranks some acts known largely for their work in the mid-to-late '60s:

    1) The Beatles
    2) Bob Dylan

    4) The Rolling Stones

    6) Jimi Hendrix (Hello, innovation and influence!)
    7) James Brown

    9) Aretha Franklin

    12) The Beach Boys (Oh yeah, remember them? Pet Sounds, anyone? A far more natural third to the Beatles and Stones as '60s pop bands go.)

    21) Otis Redding

    29) The Who​

    If that's the case, it would explain why they specifically look like pilot-era Trek, since there were a lot of promotional photos with those uniforms.

    It was dealing with issues of its time, in an arguably less reactionary manner than Dragnet.

    Hasn't made much of an impression on me yet. It's a charting B-side, and it sounds like one.

    Definitely an obscuro and one-hit wonder, but yeah. And here's a fun fact that I just stumbled across: It was a cover of a Zombies song!



    Not by his own high bar, but a perfectly enjoyable single.

    Definitely a stone-cold classic of the period.

    I have seen both...I own 2001. I'm just planning to give each a proper 50th anniversary watch and review.

    Almost forgot to include: In my additional layering in of songs at the Top 30 level, we have a couple more odd things in the weekly selections list that didn't get covered on their debut weeks.

    "I'm Gonna Make You Love Me," Madeline Bell

    (Charted Feb. 10, 1968; #26 US; #32 R&B; an earlier and more modestly charting version of the song that Diana Ross & the Supremes and the Temptations will team up to take to #2 on both charts in late '68 / early '69)

    "Soul Serenade," Willie Mitchell

    (Charted Mar. 9, 1968; #23 US; #32 AC; #10 R&B)
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2018
  5. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    As I said, contrary to popular belief, creators usually try to avoid copying what other people have done recently, so that kind of similarity is usually evidence that they weren't aware of each other. But contemporary creators are all swimming in the same pool of cultural influences, so similarities are hard to avoid. After all, there must've been some prior cultural precedent that led Bill Theiss to think that turtleneck jerseys and black trousers would read as military uniforms to the audience. So the Avengers designers were probably influenced by the same precedent.
     
  6. RJDiogenes

    RJDiogenes Idealistic Cynic and Canon Champion Premium Member

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    Interesting thought. You're right that their later careers influenced the perspective on their early careers.

    That wouldn't take much arguing. :D

    Wow, interesting indeed. Even more interesting is that there are (at least) three volumes of Zombies recordings....

    That's a fine version of the song, it's just that there's no comparing anyone to Diana Ross.

    Pleasant, but all intro. :rommie:
     
  7. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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    I think it sounds good enough that it deserved to do better before the Supremes and Temptations got ahold of it.

    This one hasn't really caught on with me yet. These are the peak hits by both artists, so we likely won't be hearing anything else from them in these parts.

    You'll be happy to know that "Soul Serenade" does have a version with words:



    ETA:
    I'm not denying that the Who were one of the more important and influential groups in their own time, but lumping them in with the British Invasion is chronologically off. Their first album was released in the UK in Dec. '65, and in slightly altered form in the US (where it didn't chart) in Apr. '66. The "My Generation" single was released in the US in Nov. '65, and only got to #74 on the Hot 100 in early '66. By that point, we were well into the Folk Rock era and fast approaching psychedelia; the Beatles had done Rubber Soul and were making Revolver. The "British Invasion" period was over, British bands were established and had already transformed the American music scene. The Who were simply not a factor in that earlier phase when British groups were taking America by storm...they were still playing clubs in London. Throwing a video of the Who performing "My Generation" into a documentary about the British Invasion ca. 1964 is pure retconning. They made their mark in the post-psychedelic era.

    They weren't part of the Invasion. They were part of the Occupation.

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    12 O'Clock High
    "Back to the Drawing Board"
    Originally aired February 7, 1966
    ...and he's going to use it to rob the Gotham Mint! WAUGHK! WAUGHK! WAUGHK!

    Britt is back, and Stovall gets some more time in the cockpit.

    This episode features enemy-side scenes with a German colonel played by Alf Kjellin, who must have been typecast, because he was also on Tarzan as a Na...er, person who did some very bad things a long time ago.

    A trope I've noticed on this show...if there's a major mission that Gallagher doesn't go on in the middle of the episode, it's gonna go horribly wrong as a plot complication. "No, I'm not going up today...it's Act II, that'd be suicide."

    The Germans figure out how to triangulate on the emissions from the radar-equipped bomber, and as a countermeasure Meredith's Dr. Rink invents chaff.

    _______

    51st Anniversary Viewing

    _______

    Selections from Billboard's Hot 100 for the week that the episodes aired:
    _______

    The Monkees
    "Monkees on the Line"
    Originally aired March 27, 1967
    Nothing much to see here. Put in charge of an answering service unsupervised and with no training, the boys get involved with a girl threatening suicide who turns out to be an actress and a booking operation that surrepitiously places bets through the service. Perhaps noteworthy for having the least threatening use of the "red button" gag ever (it causes a bed to come out of the wall).

    Look out, here comes one of the previous week's songs (and I couldn't find an episode-specific clip):



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    The Rat Patrol
    "The Double or Nothing Raid"
    Originally aired March 27, 1967
    Subbing for Dietrich in scheming against the Patrol is Ben Wright as Colonel Voss.

    Moffitt gets captured while trying to conduct an operation dressed as a German officer at a German field camp on the desert set. His getaway is foiled by not having much room to drive the vehicle, so he quickly crashes. His would-be execution takes place on location, giving the Patrol plenty of room for their Jeeps to come barrelling in for an unsuccessful initial rescue attempt. After that, it's back and forth between the set and location for the entire episode, as the Germans try to keep Moffitt disoriented as to where he's being held.

    The Patrol loses their prisoner, so Troy dresses as a German officer for the exchange.

    They give us a specific date in this one, FWIW...March 7, 1942.

    TV Fu seems to be standard German soldier training.

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    TGs1e29.jpg
    "Author, Author"
    Originally aired March 30, 1967
    That...pretty much covers the entire episode premise. I suppose it's noteworthy that the humor of the badly written humor in the episode relies on the audience never hearing a full example of either writer's material, just out-of-context hints that are meant to convey how bad it is.

    In the climax, when Ann does her impromptu run-on story about everything she's been through in the episode (a standard bit of business for her), I thought that the people running the audition were going to think that was her original comedy material.

    This episode is the last appearance of Bonnie Scott as Judy Bessemer.

    "Oh, Donald" count: 4

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    Last edited: Apr 5, 2018
  8. RJDiogenes

    RJDiogenes Idealistic Cynic and Canon Champion Premium Member

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    Yeah, it's funny that it didn't do better. Madeline Bell might have had a different career.

    Now that's more like it.

    :rommie: At least they didn't shoot a bunch of Bostonians over on State Street.....

    He's actually a stranded Vulcan. He went on to invent Velcro.

    That's kind of heavy.

    Deja vu all over again.

    :rommie:

    You'd think they wouldn't have any trouble coming up with bad jokes. Or maybe they were afraid it would be too similar to the good jokes. :rommie:
     
  9. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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  10. RJDiogenes

    RJDiogenes Idealistic Cynic and Canon Champion Premium Member

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    Ah, I misunderstood. She was just acting suicidal. Got it now. :rommie:
     
  11. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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    I recognized an ambiguity in my laziness typing that up.

    _______

    Selections from Billboard's Hot 100 for 55 years ago this week:
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    12 O'Clock High
    "Twenty-Fifth Mission"
    Originally aired February 14, 1966
    This premise sounds very familiar. This is one of those stories that I'd swear they already did a time or three.

    12och29.jpg
    Future Hulk-hunter...

    12och30.jpg
    ...Ed from Ironside...

    ...Antoinette Bower...

    ...and Messerschmitts! Though we only see them in a bit of footage being viewed at Allied HQ. Their manufacturers are the target this week.

    Britt plays tough with Dillman's major and decides that one of his missions doesn't qualify on the basis that all of his missions were milk runs or aborted. Dillman ultimately gets on the pathfinder mission and gives it his all, and proves his anxieties wrong by managing to survive despite his bomber being shot down. What I didn't catch was how Dillman managed to establish a reputation as being the only pilot in the group skilled enough at low-level flying to perform that risky mission while establishing a long record of having avoided danger.

    This week we get a base doc who isn't Barney Phillips.

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    Last edited: Apr 7, 2018
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  12. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Still, "sunshine" anything attached to that song is misplaced.

    I look at history from the perspective of when/how it happened first, not as it would be seen in the years to follow. A band's influence on a musical movement of its time often predates chart listings, as seen with The Who, the early Rolling Stones, et al. You have to look at actual events on the ground, and how it fueled and threaded through movements, not end results (i.e. chart listings) which do not paint the full picture. On that charting note, chart listing is no hard measure of the influence of the artist or work, otherwise songs such as "Winchester Cathedral" (US #1 & UK #4 in 1966) "The Ballad of the Green Berets" (US #1 in 1966) or "Mony Mony" (UK #1 in 1968) would be considered significant to the progression of culture & music at time released. They were not.

    On the other hand, The Who were not only a known band in Europe, with one of the busiest touring schedules (and exposure) of any 60s band, but were one the few white rock groups to first and successfully appeal to the growing, increasingly vocal counterculture / disaffected youth long before acts like The Beatles decided to full on move from their "yeah, yeah, yeah" period and play with experimentation. That cannot be brushed aside or underestimated in the changes affecting European youth culture, and the type of music they played at a time that what would later be called "hard rock", metal not to mention an innovative weaving of jazz chord progressions (likely an orbiting influence from Townshend's father) to pretty much create their own sub-genre of music. This happened in the 60s--it was not some dreamy look back at the period.

    The Who were having an impact in the U.S. as well, not only with audiences, but the often-jagged edged news media, with a 1967 article from the San Francisco Examiner going as far to say:

    This is 1967. Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Heart's Club Band was already on the market, The Rolling Stones had a string of strong LP's up to that point (including 1966's Aftermath, arguably tied for the group's best album of the 60s), Cream's Fresh Cream made their presence more than known at the end of '66, yet the Examiner (who were not alone) rated The Who as the most impressive. This debate could go on and on, and I can certainly post endless period reports similar to the one above, but any objective analysis of the British Invasion does not exist sans the impact of The Who--a group that continued to innovate for the rest of the 60s, and was one of its very few survivors to become a greater act after their decade of origin (incredibly rare) in both production & performance (studio and live) in the 70s. By any measure, they were one of the great 60s acts, easily earning that bronze medal, if not deserving more in some ways.


    ...well, there's a few significant production / behind-the-scenes details related to this episode:
    • This was the last episode to feature Don Kirshner's "Music Supervisor" title in the credits. By the time this episode was in post-production, Kirshner had been fired.
    • Although aired a month before the end of the season, "The Monkees on the Line" was the final episode shot for that debut season.
    • One day after this episode's first run airing, The Monkees completed recording Headquarters.
     
  13. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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    Yet you described them as part of the British Invasion. The Invasion had moved to Occupation by the time their first album came out on either side of the pond.
    Bullshit. The Who's first album came out the same day as Rubber Soul in the UK. The Byrds had invented Folk Rock with Mr. Tambourine Man, Dylan had plugged in and released Highway 61 Revisited, and Brian Wilson was working on Pet Sounds by that point. Your chronology is skewed and you're way oversimplifying what else was going on in music while the Who were still playing London clubs. The story of the Who's influence as you tell it relies on reducing everyone who preceded them to insignificance.

    But the fact that their first album didn't chart at all in the States tells a story...that they were still relatively unknown in the States at that point. It's hard to be influential when nobody's heard of you. Never mind "help[] establish the 'British Invasion' as a serious musical force," as you put it upthread. Citing them as a serious musical force in the British Invasion refers to their influence on this side of the pond, not in the London club scene; and earlier than anyone would have had reason to have heard of them in the States.

    And nobody's debating that they'd started to become a known force in the States by that point. They were on their second album (which did chart) and had done the Monterey Pop Festival.
    And for clarity, Happy Jack (the US version of their second album) reached its peak position of #67 in the aftermath of Monterey.

    Their impact was after the Invasion. The Beatles, Dylan, the Byrds, and the Beach Boys had already changed the American music scene in huge ways by the time of the Who's "coming out" on this side of the pond at Monterey in mid-1967.
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2018
  14. RJDiogenes

    RJDiogenes Idealistic Cynic and Canon Champion Premium Member

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    I'm finding the Who discussion fascinating. I envision a day when the major political parties are defined by their stance on the nature of the Who's influence in the 60s. :D
     
  15. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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    Little girl in political ad: Thank you, the Who, for the British Invasion.

    _______

    50th Anniversary Viewing

    _______

    The Ed Sullivan Show
    Season 20, episode 30
    Originally aired March 31, 1968
    As represented in The Best of the Ed Sullivan Show

    This week's acts come to us from two different mixed installments of Best of.

    Smokey Robinson & the Miracles perform a medley of their previous hit, "I Second That Emotion"; their current hit, "If You Can Want," which is at #16 this week and still on the rise to its peak position of #11 (and has caught on with me in the weekly playlist listening); and 1965's "Going to a Go-Go" (#11 US; #2 R&B; #44 UK), which includes getting the audience involved in a brief singalong. Here's a too-short clip of the first part of the medley:



    In their follow-up, the Miracles contribute to "Yesterday"'s status as one of the most covered songs in the history of recorded music, with a very intimate, soft-gospel-style vocal rendition accompanied by a gentle, somewhat Spanish-sounding guitar. I used to be fond of saying that I never heard a Beatles cover that I liked, but...well, judge for yourself:


    (Just close your eyes and listen if you find the squished aspect ratio in the video as distracting as I do.)

    Listenable but much less up my alley is Frankie Laine performing his previous Easy Listening hit, "To Each His Own" (charted Jan 20, 1968; #82 US; #2 AC). tv.com indicates that he also plugged his newest hit, "I Found You" (charted the week of this episode; #118 US; #19 AC).

    Also in the original episode according to tv.com:
    A very brief bit of one interesting-sounding piece of business there can be found at 0:53 of this video:



    _______

    Rowan & Martin's Laugh-In
    Season 1, episode 10
    Originally aired April 1, 1968
    Sign o' behind the times: Jokes in the party sketch that would have been filmed when Johnson was still in the race. He'd just announced that he wasn't running the night before.

    In his usual crack about the horn players in the New Talent intro, Dick describes them as "The Band from Hunger".

    In the news skit, Johnny Carson does the "Heeeeere's Dicky!"

    I had to dig a bit to identify the song in the Bee Gees video as "Lemons Never Forget," from their then-current album, Horizontal.



    Mod, Mod World looks at communications.



    _______

    Ironside
    "Return of the Hero"
    Originally aired April 4, 1968
    The episode opens with a spinning newspaper and the voice of a newsvendor reading it to us--How extra! extra! quaint. Cut to Ironside testifying in court...well, that's a natural enough fit, though he's on the other side of the questioning in this series. The titular hero on trial for shooting his wife, Capt. Larkin, is played by Gary Collins. One of the war buddies is Ned Romero. Another is Charles Wood, whom I recognized from multiple roles on Tarzan. Gavin MacLeod, who seems to have been typecast as slimeballs in this decade, plays a witness who'd been paid to give false testimony and gets killed by a booby-trapped shower handle.

    It turns out there are two independent parties behind the series of death threats, intimidations, and bombings...the party responsible for killing Larkin's wife and her lover is making the phone calls and planting the bombs; while the other, consisting of the war buddies, is trying to get witnesses to retract their false testimonies. Larkin's wife was only killed to frame Larkin; the man she was having an affair with was the real target.

    And that's the first season of Ironside. This one's still on the bubble for me should new show recording opportunities make DVR space an issue, but it's not currently in danger.

    _______

    Get Smart
    "The Reluctant Redhead"
    Originally aired April 6, 1968
    Another Saint-style title, though I don't remember which show did one before.

    :eek:

    The book that Mimsi's currently working on is Seymour the Psychedelic Mouse.

    99 makes a THRUSH reference...that might have slipped by me if I hadn't read it first. The premise strikes me as being TMFU-ish, though I don't know if that was deliberate...recruiting the female guest of the week, (seemingly) an ordinary civilian, to help in a spy operation.

    IMDb tells me that the "puzzle piece" commercial transitions used in this episode will become standard in the coming seasons.

    Good twist at the end with Mimsi's true identity. And while I spotted one of the people made up like a statue early, the gag about so many of the statues being both CONTROL agents and Krispin's men in disguise was pretty good. I had to go back and take another look at the set-up...in the transition back from commercial, you can see 99 wobbling a bit.

    And that's my first full season of Get Smart. I'm still not finding the show knee-slappingly hilarious for the most part, but it's a pleasant enough sign o' the times viewing experience.

    _______
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2018
  16. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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    _______

    50 Years Ago This Week

    In Beatle news, John, George, and wives return from Rishikesh on April 12.

    Selections from Billboard's Hot 100 for the week:

    Disavowed by the Secretary:
    • "I'm Gonna Make You Love Me," Madeline Bell
    • "Mission: Impossible," Lalo Schifrin :sigh:
    • "Up from the Skies," The Jimi Hendrix Experience

    New on the chart:

    "(You Keep Me) Hangin' On," Joe Simon

    (#25 US; #11 R&B; not the same song as the the Supremes hit)

    "She's Lookin' Good," Wilson Pickett

    (#15 US; #7 R&B)

    "Do You Know the Way to San Jose," Dionne Warwick

    (#10 US; #4 AC; #23 R&B; #8 UK)

    "Ain't Nothing Like the Real Thing," Marvin Gaye & Tammi Terrell

    (#8 US; #1 R&B; #34 UK)

    "A Beautiful Morning," The Rascals

    (#3 US; #36 R&B)


    And new on the boob tube:
    • Rowan & Martin's Laugh-In, Season 1, episode 11
    • The Avengers, "Split!"
    • That Girl, "The Beard"
    • The Saint, "The House on Dragon's Rock"
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    Last edited: Apr 8, 2018
  17. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Nonsense. There's no such thing as an "occupation" where The Who is concerned. Further, the Invasion is not strictly limited to album releases or charts. Its about the creative/social movement in music which organically grew in influence & popularity. The Who had been part of this movement as early as 1963 under the Detours/High Numbers line-ups. Like every other early version of important groups, they were one of the foundations of the revolution, which does not snap into existence/prominence like magic, and always predates a chart listing.

    Where on earth are you getting that fantasy?? Long before the Byrds were even a thought, acts such as The Kingston Trio had been at the forefront of folk-infused rock/pop in the late 1950s, and certainly influenced acts who would adopt that sub-genre in the decade to follow--including the Byrds.

    My chronology is accurate, which means referring to the sources who were there to see it unfold, instead of the myopic ramblings of certain magazines. To the point: while Dylan released Highway 61...in August of '65, the rock/pop musical landscape had well traveled the road of being upended in the UK, with The Who already recording "I Can't Explain" (9/1964), "Anyway, Anyhow, Anywhere" (4/1965) and other notable tracks, but their rise as a group seen as speaking to the exploding music/youth culture of the UK had been well on its way in their Detours/High Numbers periods, which you completely ignore.

    Say hello to the mirror, as you have tried undervalue, if not erase The Who's place and influence as part of the musical movement in question, which most reputable names from the period and historians have never tried to separate them from said movement.

    Early on, the insightful Brian Jones had this to say:
    Prophetically adding...
    [SIZE=4][COLOR=rgb(20, 20, 20)]
    [/COLOR][/SIZE]
    [LEFT][SIZE=4][COLOR=rgb(20, 20, 20)]
    What did a certain Beatle named McCartney say about The Who in '64?

    McCartney was well acquainted with most of the important UK bands of the era, and their various talents, but he clearly realized their undeniable value to the music scene.

    Again, this can go on and on, with historically accurate notes, quotes and other details stating the facts, but if you're convinced to reduce The Who to a footnote, or an act that "blossomed" late in the 60s, then there's no point in continuing this specific exchange.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/LEFT]
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2018
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  18. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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    No, that was just Folk, or maybe "Folk Pop" if one is subgenrizing to that extent. Folk Rock was a distinct new phase when people performing folk music "plugged in," using electric/rock instrumentation rather than the traditional acoustic arrangements. The Byrds are credited for having gotten this going by fusing the styles of the two most influential acts of the era, the Beatles and Bob Dylan.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folk_rock
    Dylan plugging in after hearing how the Byrds successfully arranged his music with rock instrumentation was a legendarily scandalous moment in the folk world of the era. "Positively 4th Street" is believed to be his answer to the critics who turned on him over that development.

    No, I'm just trying to put them in their proper historical context. There's no shame in their having emerged as an influential group in a later period of the decade than the Beatles and the Stones did. I'm not an aficionado of the UK-specific music scene of the period, so I can't speak to that. If the Who were creating some sort of stirring in the British music scene as early as '64, I'll take your word for it. But that's a different thing from having been an integral part of the British Invasion in America.
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2018
  19. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2002
    Location:
    The Old Mixer, Somewhere in Connecticut
    Aight, I have a concession to make that undermines the main gist of my argument...I've been overlooking that the Who did indeed have what I would consider to be a late and underwhelming toehold in the British Invasion proper:


    (US release: Dec. 1964; Charted Mar. 27, 1965; #93 US; #8 UK; #371 on Rolling Stone's 500 Greatest Songs of All Time)

    So I concede, the Who were legitimately part of the British Invasion. How big a part is debatable and more a matter of opinion than fact. The songwriter himself dismisses the originality of that particular release:
    I also maintain that Monterey in '67 is considered their breakout moment on this side of the pond. And would encourage enthusiastic Who fans not to sing the band's praises at the expense of ignoring or dismissing every other major breakthrough that was happening in music at the time.
     
  20. RJDiogenes

    RJDiogenes Idealistic Cynic and Canon Champion Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2003
    Location:
    RJDiogenes of Boston
    "El Condor Yesterday." I've never given much thought to Beatles covers, but this is certainly a good fit for Smokey.

    Interesting indeed. I'd love to see more of the readings and poetry that were on the show.

    Oops. The pitfalls of being topical. :rommie:

    I don't remember that one at all. Pleasant, but doesn't hold up to their other stuff of the period.

    I love that stuff. :rommie:

    It's a shame they never did a Perry Mason/Ironside crossover. That would have been the best spin on the twin-split screen gimmick ever. :rommie:

    Your capsule descriptions make it sound pretty good.

    I wonder if the censors just didn't get it.

    Oh, yeah, I remember that, along with the new "more exciting" intro that came later.

    I don't remember this one. Kind of ordinary.

    I don't remember this one either, but it's toe-tappin.'

    Ah, now this is a stone-cold time-travel classic for me. I'm in Dorchester, sitting on the piazza, eating a spucky and drinking a can of tonic....

    Another classic.

    Another favorite, happy 60s classic.

    And I love this, too, as I love most Who songs.