Please don't diss me because I did do a preliminary search to figure out why and got no satisfactory answers, but an episode of TNG I have never seen before "The Chase" was on the other day and it messed me up.....I was under the impression that Vulcans were related to Romulans, and by default and distantly related to Klingons. What I don't get is this episode of TNG whereby it relates the Cardassians, Romulans and Klingons in some Rosetta stone DNA scramble, but no mention of Vulcans anywhere....or was I supposed to just know by osmosis and watching of Kirk and Spock that was the case?
"The Chase"
- Thread starter The Katatonic
- Start date
I think the point of that episode was that the majority of humanoid species in the galaxy were related to the hologram lady’s species. That includes the Vulcans, most of the alpha and beta quadrant species, the Vorta, the Hirogen, the Talaxians, the Kazon - any one head two armed two legged species you can shake a stick at all descended from the DNA of the lady who looked like the female changeling from DS9.
It’s a nice idea that explains something that is basically a budget limitation of the show - although those kinds of explanations are fraught with problems as some fans’ suspension of disbelief is shattered when real world issues (c.f. Klingon appearance) are explicitly addressed on the show. I quite like the episode and the explanation, but everyone’s mileage varies.
I always liked that episode, and its explanation of why all the aliens looked so similar.
I think the reason the lady looked like one of the Founders from DS9 is because it was the same actress? 
JB
JB
It's one of the best TNG episodes IMO, but it's so strange to me to have basically the origin of all life revealed in a single one-off TNG episode. That's like something that could kick off an entirely new series or been the focus of a movie or atleast a 2-parter.
When the ancient alien lady hologram revealed the information about different species being originated from the same source, there should've been more species around to listen, now there were only few.
I liked the journey this episode went on more than the explanation itself. The scene with the Klingon and Data was a highlight.
Can anyone recall when this issue came up in TOS? Kirk and Spock were discussing why so many species throughout the galaxy share a similar experience. Something in a TOS episode explained it. Some earlier species, maybe the one The Chase, seeded the galaxy with life that would develop similarly.
It's driving me crazy that I cannot remember or find it in a search.
It's driving me crazy that I cannot remember or find it in a search.
Maybe what you have in mind are the Preservers. The Preservers were mentioned in "The Paradise Syndrome" (TOS). They were supposedly a species that rescued primitive peoples that were in danger of extinction and then spread those peoples around the galaxy. Presumably they were spreading humanoid type species - you know the type, a head, a body, two arms and two legs.
However I don't think the Preservers are the same species as the changeling lady in "The Chase".
For what it's worth, "The Chase" was a much more entertaining episode than "The Paradise Syndrome" imho. Not because of the explanation of humanoids that it offered. The story in "The Chase" had a more epic quality to it. I felt that the story was worthy enough that the producers should have used it as a basis for one of the TNG movies.
However I don't think the Preservers are the same species as the changeling lady in "The Chase".
For what it's worth, "The Chase" was a much more entertaining episode than "The Paradise Syndrome" imho. Not because of the explanation of humanoids that it offered. The story in "The Chase" had a more epic quality to it. I felt that the story was worthy enough that the producers should have used it as a basis for one of the TNG movies.
More like they are the artificial product of the engineering efforts of the hologram's species, not necessarily directly biologically related.
And it may well be that "natural evolution" exists in the Trek universe just as apparently in ours - it's just that this megaengineering project by these Ancients rides along that evolution, and then at the right moment grabs and perverts a suitable species into a sapient biped, the type favored by the Ancients. On Earth, it grabbed some dinosaurs and then, after they left, some apes. On other planets, it did its thing on different species, ranging from lizard-lookalikes to fish-lookalikes and no doubt beyond.
Now that would have ruined this religious-level revelation: you always have to choose whether to trust the word of a select few prophets or witnesses.
These early heroes had all sorts of theories. In "Bread and Circuses", Spock quoted a "Hodgin's Law" on parallel development, but that appeared to refer to cultures rather than biology. In "Return to Tomorrow", Spock said that Sargon's tall tales about their culture having seeded life 600,000 years ago might explain certain elements of Vulcan prehistory, while Dr. Mulhall hotly insisted humans on Earth evolved independently.
The heroes probably were wrong on all their assumptions, and the claims from "The Chase" take precedence in modern thinking. Although the holographic Ancient is as dubious a source as any, at least her story about extensive genetic engineering across the galaxy must be true, as it is through this engineering that the hologram was made visible in the first place.
Their only claim to fame is the transplanting of some North Americans around the 1700s. Nothing suggests they would have done much to affect the spreading of sapient humanoids to the galaxy millions or billions of years ago.
The hologram explained that their genetic engineering megaproject came to be because the culture knew that one day they would be gone. No doubt they are - the project dates back four billion years! The Preservers are contemporaries to our heroes.
Timo Saloniemi
I’m basing my point on the fact that the hologram says they seeded the primordial soup of many different worlds with *their* genetic material. So they are biologically related but only on the level of their DNA. Humans and apes have extremely similar DNA which means we’re biologically related - but that’s to be expected since both species evolved on the same planet. The DNA relationship referenced in the episode has to do with a few bits of common DNA sequences between species - those sequences came from the hologram lady species. So in that sense the galactic species are related to the hologram, and it was *also* a genetic engineering exercise.
Agreed. It’s a nice explanation for how all the different species can look so different yet so similar - while at the same time being directly motivated by real-world concerns (I.e. that TNG didn’t have the CG budget or sophistication to create truly alien, non-humanoid races at the time). It’s a great episode
My gripe with the episode was how Picard treated the Enterprise as he personal taxi. I mean he whisked the ship to the various planets and no communication with "higher headquarters". I mean, I'm sure the Ent was scheduled to pick up supplies, crew, new mission, etc. Or did it just happen to have nothing on the agenda that week.
Yeah, I know, for drama purposes no one wants to see Picard chat and ask for permission, and I know Picard has some sort of leeway, but I thought it was bit over the limit.
But the premise how all the 1 headed, 2 armed, 2 legged creatures are related, I thought was cool.
I just annoyed how Picard treats the ship as his personal taxi and no one else on ship can get away with that.
Yeah, I know, for drama purposes no one wants to see Picard chat and ask for permission, and I know Picard has some sort of leeway, but I thought it was bit over the limit.
But the premise how all the 1 headed, 2 armed, 2 legged creatures are related, I thought was cool.
I just annoyed how Picard treats the ship as his personal taxi and no one else on ship can get away with that.
^^this
Agreed
I liked both. "Paradise" had a much more shocking ending that delivered a greater impact, though.
The attempt was there, but you nailed it with it needing to be the basis of a TNG movie. Twice the episode length, bigger budget, all the shiny space battles though a personality-led space dogfight (e.g. Khan vs Kirk, Chang vs Kirk) would be more gripping than seeing a thousand shapeships going "pew pew" against a giant geometric primitive - like a big sugar cube painted gray or a ginormous sphere that doesn't even rotate on an axis! It's sad when 90s and today's Star Trek try to do Star Wars then comes TLJ, which tried to be more like Star Trek...
It's not clear whether every starship captain is entitled to that sort of stuff. But every captain of a Galaxy class ship certainly seems to be. The sister ship Yamato appeared twice, and in both cases, it was made clear that Starfleet Command had no idea of the ship's whereabouts and did not care.
The first time around, the (fake) ship appears at spot X, and nothing suggests she couldn't be exactly there, but no means exists of deciding whether she really should be there or not. This is not a situation the heroes would consider in any way exceptional. The second time around, Captain Varley has been AWOL for an unknown length of time, in the RNZ to boot, and Picard subsequently does the same at the drop of a hat.
In Kirk's time, ships could go missing for half a year without warranting searches or other anxiety. Entire planets could fall silent for a full year, too. Perhaps Starfleet just didn't have the resources to do anything about such things back then, hence the built-in leeway, and some of it lingers in the 24th century still.
Timo Saloniemi
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