Tarsus IV

[Admiral_Young]

So my friend and I have been wondering something and forgive me if this has already been brought up in the forum already, but does Tarsus IV happen in Star Trek 09? I'm curious...the trailers show Kirk at various points during his early life, the kid who steals the car, then the teenager who stares up at the Enterprise being built and then the Academy cadet who seemingly takes command of the Enterprise. I would assume that if included in this movie that his time on Tarsus (which in my opinion had a profound impact on our Kirk and shaped his later life) would happen after the incident with the car and just before the bar fight scenes. What does everyone else think?

 

[Gojira]

If it doesn't fit in with the story they are trying to tell then I'm sure it won't be mentioned. I think we really have to wait and see. But since this is an alternate time line I'm not really expecting things to be as they were.

 

[The Academic]

So my friend and I have been wondering something and forgive me if this has already been brought up in the forum already, but does Tarsus IV happen in Star Trek 09? I'm curious... the trailers show Kirk at various points during his early life, the kid who steals the car, then the teenager who stares up at the Enterprise being built and then the Academy cadet who seemingly takes command of the Enterprise. I would assume that if included in this movie that his time on Tarsus (which in my opinion had a profound impact on our Kirk and shaped his later life) would happen after the incident with the car and just before the bar fight scenes. What does everyone else think?

The nuTrek Kirk looks like he never left Earth's gravity field until the very moment he enters the shuttle and gives Uhura this more-than-cool/cocky/nonchalant (pick one) hand wave. As for Kirk staring up at the Enterprise being built, this seems to me like one of those classic Luke-Skywalker-watches-the-twin-suns-of-Tatooine-set-moments...

 

[The Academic]

The nuTrek Kirk looks like he never left Earth's gravity field...

... after he was brought back home to Iowa after this traumatic space battle birth, that is.

 

[Dane_Whitman]

I expect the Tarsus IV element was dropped for this story.

 

[section9]

I expect the Tarsus IV element was dropped for this story.

That's actually a shame. It would have been an interesting plot point to have Pine being chased through the galaxy by Karidian's Lunatic Daughter played by a "Dumb As A Box Of Rocks" Jessica Simpson.

 

[M'Sharak]

I expect the Tarsus IV element was dropped for this story.

That's actually a shame. It would have been an interesting plot point to have Pine being chased through the galaxy by Karidian's Lunatic Daughter played by a "Dumb As A Box Of Rocks" Jessica Simpson.

I also suspect that it won't be shown in this movie. However, just as an exercise, using dates taken from Memory Alpha:

James Kirk Born: March 22nd, 2233
Famine occurs on Tarsus IV: 2246 (making Kirk 12 or 13 at the time)
Age of Young Kirk actor Jimmy Bennett at time of filming: 12 or just turned 13
​

Which means that the Corvette-into-the-quarry escapade could conceivably take place just prior to Kirk's leaving for Tarsus VI or just after his return to Earth from there. I'm not saying that's what the filmmakers will present (or whether they'll mention it at all) but an allusion in passing would qualify as one of those winks to longtime Trek fans which have been said by them to be scattered throughout the movie.

Not going to be a big deal for me, one way or the other, but it's a fun thought.

Edit:

Jessica Simpson... *snerf* If I thought she had anything near the acting chops to play as crazy as Barbara Anderson did back when, I wouldn't mind seeing that.

 

[miraclefan]

I wasn't heavily involved with ''Classic Trek'' so I don't mind if they leave this ''Historic Factoid'' out or not!

 

[Michael]

(which in my opinion had a profound impact on our Kirk and shaped his later life)

A profound impact? In what way?

 

[Admiral_Young]

In the original series episode that deals with Tarsus...he talks with Bones and Spock about his experience on Tarsus IV and that he has effected him. Remember too that he also saved the life of young Kevin O'Reily. It seemed that such a traumatic event to happen at a young age would have a profound effect on someone like Jim Kirk. Shape him to who he becomes. I can't really give a specific example but just in general.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

(which in my opinion had a profound impact on our Kirk and shaped his later life)

Not really. The personality and character of Kirk was already pretty well established by twelve previous episodes when the Tarsus backstory was invented for "Conscience Of The King."

 

[Admiral_Young]

I know that in the context of the series it doesn't really have much impact on his established character but it IMO is still an important part of his backstory. I'm also thinking of the excellent novel Best Destiny which touches on the subject...I'm okay if it isn't included in the new movie but it was just something I'd been wondering.

 

[Jackson_Roykirk]

I suppose this film could never mention Tarsus IV...but that doesn't mean it never happens; this film may just choose not to cover that portion of Kirk's life.

 

[Thomas Riker]

In the 23rd Century kids prabably go off-world all the time, its totally logical. Kirk probably joined the boy scouts and headed for Tarsus IV. but back on thread i would prefer they either explain tarsus iv in this movie or don't mention it at all. I'd really like canon to remain intact here.

 

[pookha]

In the original series episode that deals with Tarsus...he talks with Bones and Spock about his experience on Tarsus IV and that he has effected him. Remember too that he also saved the life of young Kevin O'Reily. It seemed that such a traumatic event to happen at a young age would have a profound effect on someone like Jim Kirk. Shape him to who he becomes. I can't really give a specific example but just in general.

i dont think anything was said about kirk saving riley.
he dosnt even make the connection until he checks with the computer/

 

[Canadave]

So my friend and I have been wondering something and forgive me if this has already been brought up in the forum already, but does Tarsus IV happen in Star Trek 09? I'm curious... the trailers show Kirk at various points during his early life, the kid who steals the car, then the teenager who stares up at the Enterprise being built and then the Academy cadet who seemingly takes command of the Enterprise. I would assume that if included in this movie that his time on Tarsus (which in my opinion had a profound impact on our Kirk and shaped his later life) would happen after the incident with the car and just before the bar fight scenes. What does everyone else think?

The nuTrek Kirk looks like he never left Earth's gravity field until the very moment he enters the shuttle and gives Uhura this more-than-cool/cocky/nonchalant (pick one) hand wave.

I get the impression that moment may come after the ice planet bit. More of a "Look, I made it out" thing than anything else.

 

[section9]

I expect the Tarsus IV element was dropped for this story.

That's actually a shame. It would have been an interesting plot point to have Pine being chased through the galaxy by Karidian's Lunatic Daughter played by a "Dumb As A Box Of Rocks" Jessica Simpson.

I also suspect that it won't be shown in this movie. However, just as an exercise, using dates taken from Memory Alpha:

James Kirk Born: March 22nd, 2233
Famine occurs on Tarsus IV: 2246 (making Kirk 12 or 13 at the time)
Age of Young Kirk actor Jimmy Bennett at time of filming: 12 or just turned 13
​

Which means that the Corvette-into-the-quarry escapade could conceivably take place just prior to Kirk's leaving for Tarsus VI or just after his return to Earth from there. I'm not saying that's what the filmmakers will present (or whether they'll mention it at all) but an allusion in passing would qualify as one of those winks to longtime Trek fans which have been said by them to be scattered throughout the movie.

Not going to be a big deal for me, one way or the other, but it's a fun thought.

Edit:

Jessica Simpson... *snerf* If I thought she had anything near the acting chops to play as crazy as Barbara Anderson did back when, I wouldn't mind seeing that.

Dude, look at it this way. You're Uncle Wino. You've always resented the fact that you didn't measure up to your brother George, who was a Starship Captain.

But the one thing you had that that sumbitch George didn't have before that fool got his ship shot out from under him was a genuine, 250 year old Corvette!!!!

You loved that car. You loved that car more than your three ex-wives and you didn't care about your three ex-wives since the United States Government, by treaty with the United Earth Government and the Federation, outlawed alimony and child support as sexist. Good! More Saurian Brandy and Bootleg Romulan Ale for you!

So what happens? Because life sucks and you can't quite beat that erectile dysfunction of yours, you come home one day and find one of them robot cops with George's little urchin, James T..

He's driven your precious, 250 year old Vette into the Xindi Trench.

What do you do? Do you beat him? Do you hit him over the head with the bottle of Black Jack like you did when he left the hot dogs out in the rain last month? Nope!!!!

You swear that you'll make a man out of the little no-good runt, who doesn't appreciate all that his uncle has done for him.

You'll send him to that fine Military School on Tarsus IV, that's what you'll do!

That will straighten out the little brat! Maybe he'll grow up and meet a nice, cute blonde or something!

 

[Praetor]

I think that while it's possible the Taursus incident did have an important effect on Kirk, since it wasn't an original part of the character it's something of a retcon to make it so important. He could still conceivably end up roughly the same Kirk if they don't include it, which I don't think they will.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Here is the sum total of what is canonically known about Kirk and the Tarsus massacre:

1) The massacre occurred twenty years ago - "twenty years" is mentioned several times in "Conscience Of The King," including in Kirk's recall of the incident: "I saw him once, twenty years ago." The Enterprise library computer also describes Kodos The Executioner as "governor of Tarsus IV, 20 Earth years ago"

2) Kirk is one of nine survivors of the massacre who could identify Kodos. Again, the library computer mentions this, and it's reiterated later in the show: "There were nine eye witnesses who survived the massacre who'd actually seen Kodos with their own eyes. Jim Kirk was one of them."

So, that's it - two facts. Kirk's age at the time of the events isn't established (there are contradictory indications about Kirk's exact age during TOS; a consensus has been reached since but does not exist based upon TOS alone). Why he was on Tarsus was not established. His role in any of these events - not established.

There's nothing in TOS or any later canonical appearence of Kirk that establishes the importance of the Tarsus situation to him other than his drive to see justice done in "The Conscience Of The King" and a little common sense suggesting that it would have been a traumatic event.

 

[TK421]

Here is the sum total of what is canonically known about Kirk and the Tarsus massacre:

1) The massacre occurred twenty years ago - "twenty years" is mentioned several times in "Conscience Of The King," including in Kirk's recall of the incident: "I saw him once, twenty years ago." The Enterprise library computer also describes Kodos The Executioner as "governor of Tarsus IV, 20 Earth years ago"

2) Kirk is one of nine survivors of the massacre who could identify Kodos. Again, the library computer mentions this, and it's reiterated later in the show: "There were nine eye witnesses who survived the massacre who'd actually seen Kodos with their own eyes. Jim Kirk was one of them."

So, that's it - two facts. Kirk's age at the time of the events isn't established (there are contradictory indications about Kirk's exact age during TOS; a consensus has been reached since but does not exist based upon TOS alone). Why he was on Tarsus was not established. His role in any of these events - not established.

There's nothing in TOS or any late canonical appearence of Kirk that establishes the importance of the Tarsus situation to him other than his drive to see justice done in "The Conscience Of The King" and a little common sense suggesting that it would have been a traumatic event.

Like a young Indiana Jones, I prefer to think that young Kirk was just passing through when the whole thing happened.