StarFleet proprietary Screw Fastener? What Screw Fastener would you design/use in place?

Discussion in 'Trek Tech' started by KamenRiderBlade, Apr 18, 2022.

  1. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Really? I have them for multiple items, though they seem specific to a manufacturer. But, even when I bought my new bit kit I had a square bit for my drill driver.
    At the time we were planning ICF was not available to us in such quantities.
     
  2. KamenRiderBlade

    KamenRiderBlade Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I've always had the Square Bit in my Bit-Kit.
    No product that I've bought has ever used it, but not many things I've bought have come from Canada.

    =(.

    As somebody who has live in Taiwan and has experienced the benefits of living in Fully Concrete multi-story homes (4+ stories is normal in Taiwan). Concrete housing is AWESOME. Especially ICF.

    And there are multiple vendors for ICF, you don't always have to stick to one vendor for your supply.

    I personally like QuadLock ICF. I'm not sure how great their US distribution is.
     
  3. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Don't know about Canada but I certainly have products I have bought use square bits and I use it a bit more frequently. They are ok, if annoying.
    We live rurally and there was only one vendor (at the time) who delivered to our area and was technically from out of state. Even that was a six week wait for our product. Made ordering additional supplies untenable for our project.
     
  4. KamenRiderBlade

    KamenRiderBlade Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    These past few years has been a supply chain logistics nightmare. So I'm not surprised for the delays.
     
  5. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    This was before the pandemic.
     
  6. KamenRiderBlade

    KamenRiderBlade Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    IC

    These are some of the Screw Drive Designs that I want to bring into existence:
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Nightfall to-Ennien

    Nightfall to-Ennien Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Chicagoland born and raised actually, but my dad’s job was building and working on specialized machinery until he retired. It’s a whole different world when you get your stuff from Granger and McMaster-Carr rather than Lowes and Home Depot.
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2022
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  8. KamenRiderBlade

    KamenRiderBlade Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I bet, the McMaster-Carr carries a nicer set of hardware.
     
  9. Albertese

    Albertese Commodore Commodore

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    No, actually! But I'm super jealous of Canadians and the Robertson. My experience comes from my day job as a dental technician. Crowns that are supported by implants in the jaw are screwed in place and most brands use screws with a hexagonal bit, almost like a teensy little Torx, but not as pronounced a star shape. However, one brand we see a lot (Keystone if you're curious) uses a screw with a square bit. The final clinical screws are single use but during fabrication we use and reuse lab-screws and the hex-bit ones will eventually strip out, but those Keystone square bit screws last for-freaking-ever.

    --Alex
     
  10. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Interesting. Well I take back all my curses declared at my square bit screws from my last project.
     
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  11. ChallengerHK

    ChallengerHK Captain Captain

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    The important thing in a screw fastener is hitting the torque target, and it's pretty difficult to accomplish. While improving the design of the recess is important, I'd want a driver that had a built in pinger to measure achieved torque by measuring the stretch of the fastener.
     
  12. KamenRiderBlade

    KamenRiderBlade Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Isn't that what a Torque Wrench/Screw Driver is for? Put in the appropriate driver and tighten it to specification?

    Here the click to let you know you hit the appropriate rated torque?

    I know the AMD EPYC & ThreadRipper CPU's come with Torque Screw Drivers as part of the package that tightens to AMD's specification.
     
  13. dupersuper

    dupersuper Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I hope the Enterprise never goes there. Or the Cerritos, Protostar, La Serina, Stargazer, Discovery...sounds like a boring episode.
     
  14. ChallengerHK

    ChallengerHK Captain Captain

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    Depends on the tolerance you need to hit. The measure of "tightness" for a fastener is how far the fastener stretches. Measuring torque measures the resistance of the fastener to turning, so it's a second order measurement, which can vary by things the finish on the fastener, the material the fastener is driven in to, etc. It works, but to a spec which can vary by +/- 50%.

    When companies with lots of money need to measure bolt stretch more precisely, they put a sensor on the bolt then ping the bolt head with something hard. The sound travels to the end of the bolt and back, and comparing the time it takes to travel that distance before and after installation measures how far the bolt has stretched. What I'm saying is to build this functionality into the driver for the 23rd century, so they'd have that level of precision all the time.
     
  15. KamenRiderBlade

    KamenRiderBlade Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    So you want a Sonic Torque Wrench that measures the tightness via Sound Wave refraction through the material and use the Tricorder to calculate the Material Mass, Distance, composition, etc?

    That could be a new StarFleet ToolBox item.

    If you need info on the accuracy of modern day commercial Torque Wrenches:


    Snap-On is the best performing, but the most expensive

    Icon & DeWalts are really great units on a budget

    SK Tools is good for mid range pricing

    Kobalt isn't too bad for being cheap, but it's on a lower tier than Icon & DeWalts
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2022
  16. ChallengerHK

    ChallengerHK Captain Captain

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    Sort of. You really don't need to measure composition or mass. Distance from the fastener head to the tip is all that really matters. Think of a fastener as a spring. When it's installed, that spring stretches, and provides clamping force to the joint. The amount of clamping force, i.e., the amount of stretch, is what's critical. Things like composition, finish, etc., provides fudge factors to try to calculate torque, which is itself a second order measurement of stretch.

    Probably all true, but again a torque wrench is not measuring stretch. It measures resistance to turning the fastener, which is a rough estimate of stretch.

    If, for instance, Ford needs a torque spec for installing cylinder head bolts, they'll take a sample of bolts, then measure their length before and after installation with that sound pinging method. They'll use that data to construct a bell curve of the bolts' performance, then use that data to spell out to the bolt supplier how much tolerance is acceptable in things like finish, i.e., how smooth or rough the finish on the bolt must be to be acceptable. Once they get buy-in on that spec, they can then say something like "Given the amount of roughness we expect to see, and our calculations on its effects on actual bolt stretch, we have a torque spec of X, which is guaranteed to create enough clamping force when installed to prevent cylinder blow-by." This becomes their published torque spec. Then Ford, and the technicians who are replacing cylinder heads, have to rely on the torque wrench is accurately measuring torque.
     
  17. KamenRiderBlade

    KamenRiderBlade Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    So you need something on the tip of the Screw so that it refracts the sound wave back to the emitter?

    Does that have to be built into the Screw, or can it be a drop in item?

    Can it be a sticker to attach to the tip of the Screw, or does it have to be built into the material?
     
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  18. ChallengerHK

    ChallengerHK Captain Captain

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    You're starting to reach beyond my knowledge. To the best of my knowledge, the tip of the fastener itself will return enough of the sound wave to be sufficient for the purpose, at least in a lab setting. I'm sure that it couldn't be a drop-in, at least as I'm picturing what you mean, as that would alter the functional characteristics of the fastener. A sticker sounds like it would work to me, as long as the sensor technology was sufficient advanced, and there were no dangers implicit in the sticker ultimately falling off.

    What I'm envisioning is this: the 23rd century seems to love magnetics, at least in the tech manuals. In the driver itself, include a powerful magnetic field generator which, when activated would clamp itself onto the fastener. Then the "ping generator" and the sensor for the return signal could center on the fastener head, and do its thing. In the simplest configuration something like Bluetooth could then transmit that data to a computer which would calculate the exact stretch. A higher end tool might have its own computer built in. When finished, push a button, release the magnetic field, and go on to the next fastener.

    EDIT: Correcting a prior post in this thread. What matters is measured fastener stretch versus the modulus of elasticity of the material involved.
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2022
  19. Spike730

    Spike730 Captain Captain

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    The new generation of TPTB is simply obsessed with the Delta. You couldn't walk an inch aboard Discovery without stepping on one. It was probably even embossed on the toilet paper.
     
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  20. KamenRiderBlade

    KamenRiderBlade Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Don't give TPtB (The Powers that Be) another idea. You know some exec will think embossed StarFleet Logo Toilet Paper will have to be a thing, which it shouldn't.