Star Trek TOS Re-Watch

Discussion in 'Star Trek - The Original & Animated Series' started by Commander Troi, Oct 8, 2021.

  1. ZapBrannigan

    ZapBrannigan Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2013
    Location:
    New York State
    Here's my transcript:

    INCLUDING JANICE:

    JANICE:
    The... "imposter" told me... what happened... who he really was...

    KIRK:
    (a little stunned)
    Oh?

    JANICE:
    (not really sure what to say next)
    And I just wanted to say that I... well, Sir, I... I...

    KIRK:
    (still off balance but lets them both off the hook)
    Thank you, Yeoman.

    And with that he turns, move to his chair (EXITS PAST CAMERA). Janice, still half in a quandry, watches after him... a hint of something in her expression... something. And it is not lost on Spock who half restrains a pleased reaction... then, privately:

    SPOCK:
    The imposter had some rather interesting qualities, don't you agree, Yeoman.

    Janice, stunned, pivots at Spock, as if he had read her thoughts... hurmph... turns and goes (EXITS).
     
    hofner and Commander Troi like this.
  2. plynch

    plynch Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2007
    Location:
    Outer Graceland
    Even from a friend, that’s creepy, considering it was an attempted rape. And he addresses her as Yeoman (superior, formal) not Janice (familiar).

    Love this ep, but man, does that leave a bad taste.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2022
    Phaser Two and Commander Troi like this.
  3. alchemist

    alchemist Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2006
    Location:
    Raleigh, NC
    That scene was a wee bit different in the first draft:
     
    Commander Troi likes this.
  4. Trekker09

    Trekker09 Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2009
    Location:
    VIrginia, US
    Yikes, that’s more than a wee bit different - !
    I read this on the Collecting Trek site,
    That same message was included in Matheson’s story outline. Kirk has just said that he needs his “darker side” and that “The challenge is to master that side, wishing neither to destroy it nor to flee from it.” He then asks Rand “Isn’t that right?” to which she replies “Yes, it would be a shame to destroy it.” Is that a twinkle in her eye? “It has some very interesting qualities.”

    So either way, I guess Roddenberry was the one who edited Matheson's script to the aired version.
     
    Commander Troi likes this.
  5. Commander Troi

    Commander Troi Quoter of Quotes Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2021
    Location:
    Phoenix AZ
    Wild. Thank you all for the history!
     
  6. Timofnine

    Timofnine Vice Admiral Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2001
    Location:
    The World
    Well, in other news. I am trying to put my thoughts together about this weeks episode, The Man Trap, but I feel like I have just watched a Quentin Tarantino movie not an episode of Star Trek. :shrug:
     
  7. Timofnine

    Timofnine Vice Admiral Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2001
    Location:
    The World
    Star Trek Episode 01x06 ‘The Man Trap’

    This week on Star Trek we take a trip back in time from stardate 1672 to stardate 1513.1, but who knows how stardates work in this series - they are obviously not linear… though we do know that these first ten episodes are shown out of production order. Let’s take our weekly trip back in time and find out what happened on our planet on the Earth year 1513. This is your escape route to read something interesting and factual should you not wish to continue reading about this weeks interstellar adventure.

    I have come to realise that original Star Trek episodes have an allegorical meaning behind them. A Science Fiction ‘skin’ over a contemporary issue in politics or society, a layer that might hide the true meaning behind a story to a young and inexperienced mind, yet still allowing such a young mind to enjoy the aliens, spaceships and phaser beams. Maybe not all adults would get these allegory’s either? I am going to do my best to uncover these ‘hidden’ meanings and interpretations of storylines though I know nothing about American politics and not much about the issues and complexities of the 1960’s world. Luckily I know *lots* about Star Trek though.

    Thr Man Trap was apparently the 6th episode of Star Trek to be filmed, however it was the first ever to be shown on television back in 1966. I believe that all of the previous episodes might not have been ‘quite right’ with the suits at the studio but *this* episode probably hit the spot for them. All the main criticisms that they have about the show so far were probably ironed out by the time that this episode was filmed. Perhaps they thought it best to open up this new series to the American viewership with the episode that they were most happy with? The episode that they thought would be the best ‘hook’. They probably wanted to showcase this series with an epsiode that they thought had ‘a bit of everything’ - action, drama, mystery, suspense, romance and not *too* complex sci fi packaging, making it one of the more accessible early episodes? :shrug:

    The USS Enterprise is on a supply mission this week, they are visiting the planet M-113 to deliver supplies to the married archeological team of Nancy and Robert Crater. The planet’s surface is very well put together by the set design team with some fantastic looking ancient ruins, though I can’t help but recognise this set from previous episodes of Star Trek, most notably Where no Man Has Gone Before. I wonder how many times they will redress this set in other episodes this season? It is a shame that they did not have a Pixomondo screen back in the 1960’s like this, but they managed to pull off a good job regardless.

    Captain Kirk and Doctor McCoy along with the assistance of crewmen Darnell beam down to M-113 in order to conduct routine health checks on Mr and Mrs Nancy. This is where we find out that this mission might be a bit close to home for our good Doctor as Kirk begins to tease McCoy about his past history with Mrs Nancy, with her being ‘That one women’ in his past.

    “Should we pick some flowers Doctor? When a man visits an old girlfriend she usually expects something like that…” Kirk teases.
    “Is that how you get girls to like *you*? By bribing them?” McCoy snipes back. :guffaw:

    The Crater family have converted an old archeological complex in to their current dwellings, McCoy seems even more nervous about meeting his old flame as a result of Kirk’s comments as they approach and enter without knocking. What if she had forgotten him? That would be embarrassing! In a scene reminiscent of The Elysian Kingdom, Nancy enters her humble abode blasting out opera in a beautiful angelic voice. What an entrance.

    During this scene, I begin to wonder if the Venus drug from Mudd’s Women is coming back in to play, or at least something much quite like it. To McCoy, his lost love has not aged a single day from when he last saw her, however to Kirk she takes on a more ‘mature’ appearance age wise… like a silver vixen. I do think that this is what Kirk *wanted* to see. :D

    My thoughts that this may somehow involve the Venus drug are soon dismissed as I come to realise that this is all a result of the two Starfleet officers own minds, the beauty that they are seeing in this women is in their own minds eye. Crewman Darnell, for example beholds an attractive blonde… a very familiar face to him, that of a women that he thinks he left behind on ‘Wrigley’s Pleasure Planet’.

    We find out that Dr McCoy has a pet name given to him by Nancy, when Kirk finds out about it he can not help but tease the Doctor further. I think that ‘Plum’ is cute myself.

    Darnell can not resist his primal urges and proceeds to follow Nancy outside as she leaves… we can tell by the look on his face that he might only have one thing on his mind.

    Again, much like last week, Kirk seems to know far too much in his log entry. However this log entry is noted as being ‘supplemental’, so we can consider it as being an addendum which may have been added ‘in the future’ to serve the purpose of providing an explanatory narrative to the audience who might be getting a bit lost with the plot by now.

    We are now introduced to Professor Crater, he doesn’t want his medical check up though. Mr Crater just wants a supply of ‘salt’ as he is running out of his supply, salt is essential to provide proper hydration and electrolyte levels on such a hot and arid planet, ensuring that water can be transferred in and out of cells efficiently in the process of osmosis. Crater begins to recognise that McCoy is seeing his wife Nancy with ‘rose tinted’ glasses; through the eyes of past attachment. Though Kirk does appear to be seeing the same version of Nancy as Crater, Kirk see’s her grey’s just as much as he can. McCoy continues to examine Robert Crater’s tonsils…. Stick your tongue out and say ‘aahhhhhhhh’. :D

    Suddenly, Nancy screams outside. Whatever has happened between her and crewman Darnell? Our crew quickly make their way outside in an attempt to investigate what is going on, but they soon stumble upon the body of crewman Darnell.

    “He’s dead Jim!” McCoy states with shock, as I myself have flashbacks to the cute pink unicorn dog puppy from last weeks episode. :wah:

    Darnell’s face is covered in sucker like lipstick marks like he has been kissed to death by a deadly vixen. Though his cause of death does not seem apparent. One clue is found though - a green piece of ‘plant matter’ inside his mouth. Nancy seems to think that he has consumed a Borgia plant… but hadn’t she seductively led him out in to this alien wilderness? I’m a bit suspicious of her now. It looks like someone killed Darnell and has tried to cover up their crime by making it look like he died as a result of ‘accidental’ poisoning.

    We now find out that Nancy also wants salt, this is when I start to think that perhaps this salt is a part of this weeks allegory, especially when we think about this substances other appearance in the Star Trek universe… suck salt. Perhaps the salt is being used in this weeks episode as a creative allegory for class A drugs? Perhaps Nancy is a salt addict, her husband Robert may be procuring this substance for her in order to fulfill her addiction? :shrug:

    We are now introduced to a fresh interpretation of the character of Uhura. This character is now dressed in her traditional red attire and it surely suits her well. This version of Uhura is quite confident and seems to be able to give as good as she can take in banter, in particular with Mr Spock. Spock notices a mistake in Uhura’s frequency lists but she replies that she *hates* frequencies. This confuses Spock’s logic as he can not understand why someone who hates frequencies would want to work as a communications officer. Uhura replies that she feels like a piece of the communications console - perhaps this means that she feels that she is not being valued as a part of the crew as a person, but is being treated like a piece of onboard ship equipment? I *think* that Spock and Uhura may be flirting, but I am not too sure. Regardless of any flirtation, Uhura notes Spock’s ‘coldness’ as he is informed that the landing party has returned to the Enterprise - one dead. “It could be Kirk, one of the closest things that you have to a friend…” Uhura notes with dispair, wondering how he could just sit there emotionless and without care. Luckily enough for Spock, but still unfortunate none the less, it is crewman Darnell who is the now deceased landing party member. The crew seem to think that he died of a deadly nightshade like alkaloid poisoning - a poison from a plant which is common to class M planets. McCoy notes that this gives no explanations for the lip stick like sucker marks on Darnell’s face and body. McCoy *knows* that he did not die of poisoning - Darnell *should* be alive. There is no explanation for his death.

    We have a bizarre scene next which I hope that someone can explain to me as I might have missed the joke, but Uhura delivers a message to Captain Kirk from the planet Corinth IV, Space Commander Jose Dominquez wants to know where his chili peppers are!? Apparently they are prime Mexican red’s which Kirk picked himself. It doesn’t matter though if the shipment is late as Jose “Won’t die without them”. It seems bizarre that in this weeks episode the Enteprise has been reduced to delivering salt and chili peppers like a cargo ship or freighter? :shrug:

    McCoy discovers that Darnell has had all of the sodium chloride sucked out of him. We are all starting to put two and two together now, this is what Robert and Nancy wanted. So allegorically, was Darnell killed as a result of his killers ‘addiction’ to salt, which could also allegorically represent an illegal earth drug?

    This is where I start thinking Quentin Tarantino, I don’t know why. I wonder if he was a Star Trek fan? :shrug:

    Kirk beams back down to M-113, he is worried that Nancy and Robert could be in danger so he intends to question them. Robert informs Kirk that they started off with 25lbs (pounds) of ‘salt’ but now they only have a little bit left. McCoy samples this substance and confirms that it is indeed salt. :p

    It is concluded that the Craters must beam up to the Enterprise for their own protection. Unfortunately, before they can all depart… Crater runs off. There are now two more dead crewmen on the planet surface, and Nancy is at the scene of the crime - Crewmen Green and Sturgeon are dead. Perhaps Nancy wanted their ‘salt’ and killed them both for that? Robert desperately offers his wife some salt, but he is too late, she has already committed the crime. I *definitely* think that she might be the killer now. Perhaps when his wife craves this chemical substance, she turns in to a desperate killer in order to obtain and extract it from her victims? Another twist to the story transpires as Nancy ‘shape shifts’ and takes on the form of Creman Green. This could be like a Tarantino switch to another character with a whole new story dealing with their addiction. This episode might be made up of lots of allegorical ‘addiction’ stories with each individual example being represented by a character ‘shape shift’? Or maybe I am starting to look in to all of this a bit *too* deeply. :D Perhaps Mudd’s drug or something like it *is* the salt in this weeks episode after all? It does make appearance and perception changes and also lead to sensual attraction? Anyway, this ‘imposter’ of Crewman Green is now beamed up to the ship with the rest of the landing party. There is now a murderous monster loose on the ship, and they want their fix of salt.

    McCoy is very worried about Nancy by now, but Kirk quotes Spock from a previous episode and tells the Doctor to stop ‘thinking with his glands’. Kirk does not go as far as saying that McCoy’s glands should be removed as Spock would have done though this week.

    Yeoman Janice Rand is back in this weeks episode, after suffering a severe personal trauma last time in The Enemy Within. Rand has another unfortunate encounter with a male member of the the Enterprise crew as ‘imposter’ Crewman Green approaches and starts to make advances on to her - he wants her ‘salt’. After learning from last weeks encounter with ‘bad Kirk’, she slaps Green firmly across the face though doesn’t need to go as far as scratching him this time to halt his advances. He does however proceed to follow her down the corridor, eager for his ‘fix’.

    “Why don’t you go and chase an asteroid” An exasperated and increasingly worried Rand firmly asks Green as she ups her walking pace to escape his advances.

    As Rand makes her way down the corridor, all of the other Enterprise crewmen begin to stop and look at her suggestively too, just in the same way as Crewman Green is doing so. The other crew men have no excuse for this behaviour though - they have not been replaced by imposters.

    How would you like *that* as your own personal Yeoman!?” One of the Enterprise crewman says to his friends, stopping at the point of giving the Yeoman a ‘wolf whistle’ down the corridor.

    I can’t help but feel sorry for Janice Rand and just *how* uncomfortable she must have felt serving on the Enterprise in these early days.

    Yeoman Janice Rand safely makes it to the ships botanical bay, manned by Lt. Sulu. At this point I am not sure if he is the ships botanist or security chief. Perhaps it will be clarified later in this episode. Sulu’s botany bay is filled with beautiful exotic alien flowers of all shapes and sizes. Yeoman Rand proceeds to give Sulu his dinner… which she had actually been stealing food from herself as she was walking down the corridor with his dinner. I’m sure she pinched a chip or two! :guffaw:

    May the Great Bird of the Galaxy bless you and your planet!” Greets Sulu warmly, whilst feeding his… ‘Weepers’. I think that this is a reference to Gene Roddenberry himself, or at the very least it will adopted as one in time.

    Janice begins talking to the plants in the room around her, in particular to what seems to be a sentient genus that she refers to as a ‘Beauregard’. There also seems to be a dead ‘Beauregard’ next to Sulu. He must have forgotten to water it. Janice tickles this plant and it squueeeees in delight. Sulu tell’s Janice that his pet plant is actually called Gertrude. Sulu loves animals and plants by the looks of it, last week with the cute pink and fluffy alien unicorn dog puppy, and this week with the adorable Gertrude. Janice assumes Gertrude’s gender identity and identifies Gertrude as being a male. Sulu corrects her and asks why she needs to use gender pronouns to describe his pet, another example being such as when Starships are referred to as ‘she’ or as being ‘feminine’. Janice begins to worry that one of the plants might grab her, as if she has not gone through enough already with *people* grabbing her! :eek:

    Green, who has been wondering around the Enterprise corridors, makes his way in to the Enterprises botanical bay and confronts Janice and Sulu. From her experience with ‘bad Kirk’ last week, Janice thinks that Green’s odd behaviour might be explained by him having consumed copious amounts of Saurian Brandy, just like ‘bad Kirk’ had before she was attacked by him last week. Gertrude doesn’t like Crewman Green either and screams, hiding back inside their bud. Sulu dashes to Gertrude to comfort ‘them’. this could be Star Trek’s first foray in to gender identity and the use of pronouns for males and females. A bit heavy handed and clunky, but it is there none the less. :D

    We have confirmation that this shape shifter has some sort of psychic connection to it’s victims, as in the corridor the creature shifts in to it’s next character ‘mini story’. This time the story of Uhura and an encounter with a man who attempts to seduce her in the Enterprise corridors. Green looks at Uhura and shifts in to something that he believes she would deem as being physically appealing. The creature believes that when Uhura is lonely on the Enterprise, perhaps when she feels like she is only an extension of the ships communications console, that she thinks of ‘others like her’. The imposter begins to talk to Uhura in Swahili in order to gain her trust… but we all know that he is only after one thing - creature wants Uhura’s salt. Uhura falls for his seductive techniques, but eventually fights her lust off and retreats.

    If this episode was an allegory, as previously mentioned this could be a ‘Tarantino’ like collection of ‘mini’ encounters with each perception of the alien being a separate and unconnected story of how different drugs addicts may have killed or harmed other people as a result of their addiction, usually in order to get what they are so reliant upon; in this case, ‘salt’.

    McCoy can’t sleep, so Kirk suggests that he takes ‘the red pill’ like McCoy had given to him last week. Kirk’s says this as he consumes a blue ‘pill’. However we find out that Kirk is actually eating a plate of multi coloured cubes - ‘future’ food! :D

    The ‘story’ now reverts back to that of Nancy, as the shapeshifter senses McCoy approaching. McCoy invites the creature in to his room. Nancy entices McCoy to take the red pill too… Uh-oh! As McCoy falls to sleep, ‘Nancy’ decides to not go in for the kill, she leans towards him and licks his salty sweat. The creature then impersonates McCoy himself. :eek:

    Meanwhile, Rand and Sulu find another victim of this salt addict with ‘lip stick’ sucker marks all over their face. Kirk wants answers! He beams back down to the planet surface to speak to Robert Crater.

    “Where is your wife?!” Kirk asks.

    Kirk and Spock next realise that there is an imposter on the ship… they find the *real* Crewman Green’s body. After informing Sulu about this, who we now know must be a security officer, the Enterprise is put on a ship wide alert.

    Fake imposter McCoy goes to the Enterprise bridge. Rand now knows that whatever was up with Green was definitely *not* Saurian Brandy after all, she must have encountered his imposter on the ship. But what will the creature do next now that it has infiltrated the Enterprises command centre under the guise of McCoy? :eek:

    As Crater flees from Kirk and Spock, he is stunned by the *funniest* phaser attack in Star Trek history.

    The science fiction behind this creature is now explained to us, this creature is the last of it’s species - a bit like how the buffalo and pigeons of Earth were wiped out in humanities past. If you fast forward to 37:30 in this episode it seems like Crater has had his voice replaced? Was there an audio problem with this scene or was it re wrote and dubbed with new lines? Once on M-113 there were millions of life forms, but one creature killed them all. The shapeshifting creature on the Enterprise is responsible for the irradiation of *all* life on this planet.

    Spock comes up with a plan, he is going to set ‘bait’ traps around the ship. Salt will be distributed at tactical locations and should the creature attempt to take the salt they can capture it. McCoy questions why they don’t just keep on giving the creature salt to keep it happy? The being is only dangerous when it does not have it’s ‘fix’ so why not give it a constant supply? I *think* that it is imposter McCoy who suggests this course of action, I would need to check to confirm. I think that this form of treatment might be used in the ‘real world’ for treating some drugs addicts too? Or sometimes Doctor’s just give them another similar drug which is not as bad for them? :shrug:

    Further to his interrogation, Crater recognises that he is providing the creature with salt because it needs it to survive, he is keeping it alive; but the creature also needs love which he can also provide to it. In return, the creature uses it’s shape shifting abilities to take on the form of Nancy to satisfy him. I believe that the original Nancy must have been killed by this predatory alien, I wonder why Robert Crater has forgiven it so easily? Maybe they became *too* interdependent on each other after the original Nancy’s death? Crater is however helping to save an alien which is the last of it’s kind, but would anyone *really* want to save a creature such as this? This alien obviously does love a Robert though or it would have ‘sucked his salt’ many years ago, it is obviously keeping him alive intentionally - perhaps for the salt supply. I wonder if this alien could eventually reproduce with Robert? Kirk however thinks that Crater is just trying to be a wife lover, best friend, wise man, fool and idle slave. Perhaps Crater can be used to the crews advantage though - he can after all recognise this creature in any form that it takes due to his unique physic bond with it. But Crater is loyal to his lover and refuses to help identify it. Spock suggests using a ‘truth serum’ to extract the information from Crater, I don’t know why he did not think of performing a ‘mind meld’? McCoy resists using the serum but relents, after all this man is his ex’s new partner… so why not? I wonder why MCoy is not more upset about the death his old lover Nancy? Of course, we now know that *this* Nancy has never been the original… only an alien imposter. McCoy was sleeping for a very long time towards the end of this episode (in fact, the *real* McCoy still is!) so perhaps he does not know the full story yet if no one has filled him in… perhaps there is still a McCoy ‘twist’ coming? :shrug:

    The alien who was still disguised as McCoy all along attacks Spock but luckily he is ‘from another ocean’ so did not die from the creatures salt extraction process. The creature has however now escaped. Crater is also killed in the resulting violent confrontation.

    After turning back in to Nancy, the creature heads back to the still sleeping McCoy in his quarters, those red pills had *really* knocked him out. She begs him for help, probably wanting McCoy to take Robert’s place as her salt provider. Luckily, Kirk arrives just in time. He tells McCoy that this is not the real Nancy, but McCoy thinks that Kirk is insane and does not believe him. Kirk tries to lure the salt craving creature with salt pills, but McCoy tries to protect his ex lover and this leads to Kirk and McCoy having a fight. In the ensuing chaos, Nancy grabs the pills and eats them. I think that this might make the creature ‘stronger’. The alien continues to attack Captain Kirk but blinded by his love of Nancy McCoy can not defend the Captain, he can not believe that this is not the women from his past. Spock grabs Nancy and slaps her side to side with his interlaced fists to prove to McCoy that it can not be the real Nancy - she or no other human would be able to take such a beating. This eventually makes the creature angry though, so it slaps Spock back across the face and floors him. We now see the creatures true form; a sucker fish like alien with octopus like fingers. McCoy knows that this is *definitely* not his ex lover now so kills the creature with his phaser.

    May the Lord forgive me….” McCoy asks of his savior.

    In the closing scenes back on the bridge, Kirk reflects on the Buffalo analogy just as the credits begin to roll. I wonder if he also think thinks about… gazelles? :D

    I grade Star Trek Episode 01x06 The Man Trap - 14/10! :D

    Next week… The Naked Time.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2022
    Phaser Two and Pauln6 like this.
  8. plynch

    plynch Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2007
    Location:
    Outer Graceland
    Wait, so GR, the horrible, no good, reviled POS (so the common understanding goes) actually made the ending LESS rapey-woman-wanting-it?!

    A) Wow, so the ending was gonna be (way) worse!
    B) GR! Made it less icky/rapey?

    I’ve read one reason he had to have a vacation ticket put on his hands by Coon was he was rewriting every script. (The wordsy, stage play-ish tone of S1 I do enjoy.)

    Do we know it was GR story editing this script. There are many GR-the-antichrist people around here who will NOT want to hear that if true.
     
    Phaser Two likes this.
  9. alchemist

    alchemist Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2006
    Location:
    Raleigh, NC
    Here are a couple of relevant excerpts from a 1.5 page memo that Stan Robertson at NBC (Broadcast Standards) wrote to Roddenberry concerning that first draft of the script:
     
    Commander Troi likes this.
  10. Mr. Spook

    Mr. Spook Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2002
    Location:
    ssosmcin
    I'm not sure that does enough to pull it away from "Kirk's secret rape fantasy" but I can see what they were trying to do there. That would be a much harder sell today.
     
    Commander Troi likes this.
  11. David cgc

    David cgc Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2002
    Location:
    Florida
    I think the version where Rand herself says the line would probably play better today than the aired version. While they're both totally inappropriate and the whole sentiment should've been cut entirely (insert the TOS Writers' Bible shitting on Rand and Kirk clutching each other on the bridge in the face of impending death in "Balance of Terror" here), Rand herself freely telling Kirk that she's kinky and she'd be into it under proper circumstances is a lot less gross in 2022 than Spock, out of nowhere, assuming she felt that way and calling her out for it.

    I think a similar situation is how gross Uhura's "Sorry, neither" line in "The Naked Time" would've been if Spock had said it instead of her.

    Though, I suppose, in either case, it's a male writer putting the words into the mouth of a female character, which complicates things further.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2022
    Phaser Two and Commander Troi like this.
  12. Trekker09

    Trekker09 Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2009
    Location:
    VIrginia, US
    Well, according to Memory Alpha, John Black revised the Matheson teleplay in early June 1966 and Roddenberry made additional edits a week later. So maybe he was responding to the network criticism – though they seemed only concerned about Kirk’s image.
    I felt really sorry for Grace…IIRC, it was just a few shows later, after “Miri” when GR sexually assaulted her. At least that’s what I’ve read.
    And yet, while Grace said in her memoir she was very unhappy about the last scene of “Enemy Within” --saying what a cruel comment for Spock to make to Rand -- she also said she enjoyed the episode because it challenged her as an actress. ”That really was what Kirk and Rand were about. There were two sides of Kirk and two sides of Rand. She was there to serve him but she was also in love with him. And she knew she mustn't go over the boundaries."

    It is amazing how that scene strikes people now compared to when it first aired.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2022
  13. hofner

    hofner Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    May 8, 2003
    Location:
    Charlotte, NC


    Sorry I didn't get back to you for a couple of days, real life took me away for a while.

    Thank you very much for the transcript, I appreciate it. I would give you ten likes if I could.

    Anyway, it seems to me the 'interesting qualities' remark comes from the old thing of "Women are attracted to bad boys" thing. I'm not excusing it, Hollywood sometimes had a bad habit of treating lightly or even romanticizing sexual assault back then. "Gone With the Wind" had a pretty bad example of it for one.

    Robert
     
  14. ZapBrannigan

    ZapBrannigan Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2013
    Location:
    New York State
    I also take cupcakes. But seriously, it was brief and no trouble at all. And some day when that image is a dead link, the thread will still be readable.

    The episode had a lot of adult edge to it even for today, with a big, violent near-rape scene. It seems they wanted to give the concluding dialogue some daring sexual energy, and at the same time leave Kirk and Rand on a positive note. But the "daring" part tripped them up because the fight scene between Evil Kirk and Rand wasn't sexy. They should have let that part be and just written a "Kirk is forgiven" scene.
     
    Commander Troi likes this.
  15. Timofnine

    Timofnine Vice Admiral Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2001
    Location:
    The World
    I don’t like talking about these parts of the episode as I find it all a bit unsettling, my take is that Kirk *did* assault Yeoman Rand even though it was his bad side that did it. When ‘good Kirk’ and ‘bad Kirk’ were reintegrated, the ‘yolked’ Kirk still bore the scars of his bad side. I’m talking about the scars of his actions, not the resulting scratches which also came through after the merger of his ‘good’ and ‘bad’ sides which also visually proves the point.

    Can we start talking about this weeks episode soon please? The Man Trap? Something a bit less controversial? :D
     
  16. ZapBrannigan

    ZapBrannigan Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2013
    Location:
    New York State
    I think you've got it wrong. Evil Kirk and Good Kirk after the transporter accident are not Kirk. Neither of them are Kirk.

    Evil Kirk is to Kirk as pure sodium metal (Na) is to table salt (NaCl).

    Sodium is explosive and chlorine is poisonous, while sodium chloride is an essential nutrient. In the same manner, Kirk is a compound, not an element.
     
  17. Timofnine

    Timofnine Vice Admiral Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2001
    Location:
    The World
    That works. :bolian:
     
    ZapBrannigan likes this.
  18. Commishsleer

    Commishsleer Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2013
    Location:
    Backwaters of Australia
    Hhhmm now you don't want to talk about it I do. LOL
    Now I think that we all agree that Spock's comments were terrible and it would be even worse if they came from Kirk. However if we examine the comments I don't think that Spock meant that it would be good to be raped by Kirk. I believe what he meant was "Girlfriend on the bright side - at least 'evil' Kirk wasn't emasculated by Starflee'ts rules and regulations". We like to think things are better for women now than they were in the 60s but they are not. Of course if the episode were today Spock would not have made those comments. I also think it was appalling how Rand had to face Kirk after what he had done to her. She should have had a counsellor/lawyer. McCoy was probably supposed to be it but he and Spock are too close to Kirk. She need someone independent to protect her rights. And if the crewman had not been a witness to the attack then it would have been Rand's word against Kirk's and guess who everyone would have believed? Same as in the 60s as it is today
     
    Commander Troi likes this.
  19. Pauln6

    Pauln6 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Location:
    Bristol, United Kingdom
    If this was modern Trek, Rand's story would have been given proper resolution, probably in Dagger of the Mind. Kirk's feelings were outed in Enemy Within, Rand's in Miri, and then those feelings could have been horribly corrupted beyond repair in Dagger.
     
    plynch and Commander Troi like this.
  20. Yudu Reeolies

    Yudu Reeolies Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2011
    Location:
    foxhot
    If only AMOK TIME had occurred before ENEMY, and Rand been around to witness both, she could have muttered ''Stuff it, seven-year-itch'' and put Spocko in his place.
     
    Commander Troi likes this.