Spoilers Star Trek: Strange New Worlds 3x09 - "Terrarium"

[Mudd]

"Egregiously bad" by that standard = Star Trek. One has to grade a show featuring interbreeding with extraterrestrial species, machines that dissolve and rebuild people instantly at a distance, and FTL spacecraft on a steep curve.

If one can buy creatures made of pure energy that disable technology in real time over interstellar distance, objecting to a "salt vampire" on scientific -rather than narrative - grounds is a pointless cavil.

 

[hbquikcomjamesl]

I refer you to Clarke's Laws.

 

[fireproof78]

With regrets all around.

And action. No understanding, no diplomacy. Just basically "shoot her."

 

[Mudd]

Clarke's "Laws" are, diplomatically, wishful thinking.

More bluntly, they're hot air.

Late in the so-called "Golden Age of Science Fiction," writers and editors and fans got very wrapped up in pushing what was really a vibrantly imaginative genre of pulp fiction writing as profound, meaningful and - most importantly - respectable. They leveraged the space programs of the 1950s and 1960s, among other things. But overall, a lot of printer's ink was expended on the subject of what was "true science fiction" as distinct from merely fantasy.

But, you know, they were still writing what they were writing, which was the kind of stuff editors would buy and that the kids wanted to read. And not a lot were willing to give up the bag of magic tricks that had become so important to the adventure aspects of the craft.

Some did. Sometimes. Generally...no.

Stuff like Clarke's Laws are a fig leaf for sorcery masquerading as fictional science. But they sound wise, coming from someone like Clarke who actually did understand technology very well but didn't want to be bothered with facts that got in the way of a good yarn.

 

[Ray Hardgrit]

"Egregiously bad" by that standard = Star Trek. One has to grade a show featuring interbreeding with extraterrestrial species, machines that dissolve and rebuild people instantly at a distance, and FTL spacecraft on a steep curve.

If one can buy creatures made of pure energy that disable technology in real time over interstellar distance, objecting to a "salt vampire" on scientific -rather than narrative - grounds is a pointless cavil.

This has never been true. People can let a few necessary things like FTL, translators and transporters slip in order to have a story in the first place, and then be taken out of the story by something relatively innocuous. The closer things are to real life experience, the harder they have to work to make them seem real.

 

[fireproof78]

So, Star Trek being more fantastical makes it more believable?

 

[Mudd]

This has never been true. People can let a few necessary things like FTL, translators and transporters slip in order to have a story in the first place, and then be taken out of the story by something relatively innocuous. The closer things are to real life experience, the harder they have to work to make them seem real.

That's a better way of analyzing the question, yes. Skiffy stories lean into a lot of textural stuff to buy plausibility in stories built on impossible premises.

Someone using an energy weapon to heat coffee during a crisis probably doesn't make a fuckload of sense - the existence of these gadgets as shown raises all sorts of questions on its own - but it feels real, somehow. People would do that if they could.*

That said, it's still problematic to nitpick a plot detail on the grounds that it's "unscientific" in an overall environment of technobabble.

And, just for the record, "necessary things like FTL" and teleportation (or telepathy, for that matter) do break the universe we live in more fundamentally than extraterrestrial life that craves table salt.

And it's not like the creature conceived a child with a human, after all. Now, that would be a bridge too far even for Star Trek.

Right? Right?

*In fact, they'd be especially delighted to do it to solve a little problem if it were a nonapproved use of equipment.

 

[cooleddie74]

It's Star Trek. If I want hard science I won't watch Star Trek.

 

[Paul755]

this one held up pretty good on rewatch. It’s a shame they waited so long to really do an Ortegas episode. Wasn’t a big fan of the Metron showing up at the end though.

 

[Rom's Sehlat]

I enjoyed the fun jokes in the briefing, where Spock misunderstood the jokes.
Constellation: I didn't catch it at first. "Captain Decker!" (Yes, I know it's more nostalgic terms thrown in to make you go "I know that reference!", but it works. There's a reason the writers do it.)
Ah, it's the trope of having to survive a crashed ship, with one of the enemy soldiers.
Haha, chess! Good to know they still play 2d chess. Also, animal knuckle bones for games is ancient. I like it.
They show Uhura lying; that's not very Starfleet of her. That was disappointing writing.
Boo, just Metrons. Gorn+Federation+Metrons. We've seen that before. Lol, "Reset your perception of the Gorn." I assume that meant plural you? We just go around resetting perception?! That violates rights somewhere, but it does explain the scifi-wimeyness of a prequel show.
OK episode I guess. 5/10. Was deep, but not amazing.

 

[Nerys Myk]

They show Uhura lying; that's not very Starfleet of her. That was disappointing writing.

I'm sure Starfleet officers lie all of the time. Unless Kirk's real name is Baroner and Spock is a dealer in Kevas and Trillium.

 

[Rom's Sehlat]

Yeah, but ever since 2368, Mr. Starfleet says the first duty is to the truth: https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/The_First_Duty_(episode)#Memorable_quotes

Lying about vital data to a commanding officer isn't exactly the sort of lying a spy does.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Yeah, but ever since 2368, Mr. Starfleet says the first duty is to the truth: https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/The_First_Duty_(episode)#Memorable_quotes

Lying about vital data to a commanding officer isn't exactly the sort of lying a spy does.

KIRK: Captain's log, Star date 1313.8. Add to official losses, Doctor Elizabeth Dehner. Be it noted she gave her life in performance of her duty. Lieutenant Commander Gary Mitchell, same notation. I want his service record to end that way. He didn't ask for what happened to him.

 

[cooleddie74]

And Kirk deliberately fudges the Decker and Ilia officer records at the end of TMP to honor both their sacrifices and leave their ultimate fates ambiguous. Sulu doesn't record anything about what happened during the mission to rescue Kirk and McCoy from the Klingons in 2293.

Starfleet Captains lie, even if it's not officially "lying."

 

[Rom's Sehlat]

Koik did a great job of lying. I suppose I shouldn't judge 2268 Kirk by the 2368 Picard morals, haha. There's a reason it seems most people choose Picard (era) over Kirk (era).

 

[Nerys Myk]

Koik did a great job of lying. I suppose I shouldn't judge 2268 Kirk by the 2368 Picard morals, haha. There's a reason it seems most people choose Picard (era) over Kirk (era).

Bad taste?

 

[cooleddie74]

I don't. Because I like my saltines dry and boring, not my Trek.

 

[Rom's Sehlat]

It feels lonely, liking TOS more than TNG. The self-identified "intellectuals" in my life think that TNG blows TOS out of the water. Sometimes, I feel the siren call of saying TNG is better, and then I see the four lights and realize they're all good, and some are more good (=).

I do tell my IRL friends that SNW is the closest we have to adventures in space like TOS. LD is for the zany, fast-paced folks, and SNW is for the less ADHD folks!

 

[Detached Nacelle]

Yet SNW and LDS appeal to me in equal measure and both bring me equal amounts of joy.

 

[V'Lias]

It feels lonely, liking TOS more than TNG. The self-identified "intellectuals" in my life think that TNG blows TOS out of the water. Sometimes, I feel the siren call of saying TNG is better, and then I see the four lights and realize they're all good, and some are more good (=).

You're not the only one! TNG is fourth on my list after DS9, TOS, and SNW.