Star Trek: Insurrection 20th anniversary thread!

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies I-X' started by Turd Ferguson, Dec 12, 2018.

  1. Turd Ferguson

    Turd Ferguson Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Can't believe nobody started a thread about this. Also, can't believe it's been twenty years since this movie came out! December 11, 1998. I'd been graduated from high school for seven months, hadn't yet started college, but was deep into Star Trek at the time. This movie was kind of lackluster at the cinema for me. Coming off of First Contact, it was kind of boring and the special effects weren't so special. But, it was Star Trek and I was obsessed with anything Star Trek, so I watched it three times in theaters. And not very much in the years since.

    Fast forward twenty years, I rewatched this earlier in the morning, about 1 am. The movie wasn't as slow as I remembered. In fact, it's pretty fast paced, even with all the talky parts between Admiral Dougherty and Captain Picard and between Picard and Anij. It clocks in at just over an hour and forty minutes, so there's really no bloat to the movie. The humor is kind of lame in some parts, the special effects are hit and miss. The closing shot of the Enterprise leaving orbit of the Ba'ku homeworld still looks like ass, but the movie also contains one of my favorite effects shots: the Enterprise being chased through the Briar Patch while the engines are burning deuterium.

    The Ba'ku are still insufferable and the Son'a are still whiny, but I found myself enjoying the movie more. Not the best TNG movie, but still not the worst (Nemesis). What are your thoughts?
     
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  2. Tosk

    Tosk Vice Admiral Admiral

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    This movie has a lot of problems. I still like it. Every time someone says, "It was more like a TNG two-parter than a movie" I think, "That's why I like it."
     
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  3. Khan 2.0

    Khan 2.0 Commodore Commodore

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    the anniversary of the Trek movie that no one can or no one wants to remember..
     
  4. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The One With The Plot?

    Timo Saloniemi
     
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  5. Lance

    Lance Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    In retrospect, I feel more warmly towards it every time I see it now, and I think it's because of this. It is the movie out of the four that IMO captures that special-ness of The Next Generation the best. It's not a perfect movie but the cast cameraderie etc on display in this one feels like a warm blanket. The movies either side of it are attempting to be something else, but Insurrection has no pretensions, it just wants to be The Next Generation on the big screen, and to this end it pretty much suceeds perfectly. :techman:
     
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  6. tomalak301

    tomalak301 Admiral Premium Member

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    I watched this movie last Friday. There's a lot of good individual moments in a movie that was very much average. It's not my least favorite film, but it was very much a TV episode.
     
  7. Smellmet

    Smellmet Commodore Commodore

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    There's the odd bit in it I don't mind, the cast seem to be on good form, but that's about it from me I'm afraid. I dislike pretty much everything else about the film, from the boring plot to the insufferable Baku, the crap humour, shitty visuals and poor sets.

    Right down at the bottom with TFF for me. I can watch it from time to time but it's just such a bland, uninspired piece of filmmaking.
     
  8. Damian

    Damian Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I recently got the Blu-Ray box set of the 4 TNG movies so I decided to watch them. I watched Insurrection last week and in my case, I actually didn't mind it. At the time it came out I was a bit disappointed. The Dominion War was raging at the time on Deep Space Nine and I thought there'd be more about it in this movie then just a few throwaway lines. I kept thinking there should have been a way to get TNG cast involved with the war in such a way that it didn't require you to have been a fan of DS9.

    But nowadays a lot of time has passed since then and it doesn't bother me as much. I can judge the movie on its own merits. I agree with the critique that it's more or less a 2 part episode of the TV series. Like Tosk noted, for TNG fan that's not necessarily a knock on it. I didn't mind that really in my last rewatch. The plot was a bit pedestrian. Picard and crew have to save the Ba'ku from enduring a Native American like resettlement. Makes you wonder why Picard wasn't more sympathetic to the Maquis, but I digress.

    Two things I loved about the film, one of course is the music score by Jerry Goldsmith--he can make any movie seem worthy of an Academy Award. The score reflected the atmosphere of the movie perfectly.

    The other that I always bring up is the cinematography. I loved many of the shoots on the planet. Geordi's observing the sunrise, the mountains, the lake. They did set up a lot of nice shots IMO.

    Also, I am still amused by Dougherty's reaction whenever he is around Ru'afo. The look of disgust whenever they are together is the kind of disgust I noted on another thread that you give when you are stuck on an elevator with someone who smells like raw sewage. That, 'ugh, I can't wait to get away from this disgusting guy'.

    I think plot-wise, after First Contact they were probably trying to bring it down to Earth a bit more, much like TVH did after TWOK and TSFS. In some ways it does that. But it could have been so much more.

    So in essence for me, I can watch it, and over time I actually came to like it a bit more once I decided to just take it on it's own, and not think about what could have been.
     
  9. Vger23

    Vger23 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    There are some great moments in this movie. It looks fantastic...and it's clear that everyone had an absolute blast making it. It has a lighthearted and adventurous feel at times.

    That said, this is far-and-away my least-favorite Star Trek franchise film. It's not even close. I could never get over, even coming straight out of the theater on opening night, the fact that this 2-hour multi-million dollar movie was weaker than 2/3 of the 45 min regular TNG television episodes. It just was completely unremarkable, and on a $60M budget, having your sci-fi action/adventure motion picture event be bland and unremarkable is absolutely unforgivable.

    They were going for the "let's lighten things up" formula that worked so well with TVH after the heavy lifting of the previous TOS films...but unfortunately that doesn't work unless you have Nimoy, Meyer, Bennett and a top-notch cast firing on all cylinders. TNG just wasn't up to that task, and the story/script were just completely forgettable. I've always said that I think they inadvertently strived to make a mediocre movie as a result. Even the other weaker Trek movies had some "punch" to them...and a reason to talk about them and debate them. They had some sort of interesting hook. This literally had nothing. It's a shame...
     
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  10. CommanderTrip

    CommanderTrip Captain Captain

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    I've enjoyed all the TNG movies, or parts of them anyways. Some, more than others.

    That being said, I can't believe its been 20 years since Insurrection. Where's the Gilbert & Sullivan tribute? Worf should have had enough time to meet all the new crew members by now.

    The first star trek toy I ever owned was the Insurrection Enterprise - E with micro machine captain's yacht. Insurrection was also the movie where I got my first phaser from Toys R us. I wish I still had these, although I would not be suprised if they were buried in the basement/attic at my parents house somewhere.

    I think this movie deserve a rewatch. I had the opportunity to read Michael Piller's "Fade In" that tells his experience behind the scenes crafting the story/script of Insurrection. I was always interested/fascinated in his original idea/ideas for Insurrection, including a certain crewmember he planned to kill.

    Since reading Fade In, and knowing that Piller wrote Insurrection has definitely raised my appreciation of it over the years. Without Michael Piller and the writing team he helped craft in TNG, we wouldn't have the Trek or TNG as we know it today.
     
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  11. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Commodore Commodore

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    Insurrection came out 20 years ago? Wow, I feel old. I like the intro with the village. You'd never have an intro as tranquil as that today. But anyway...

    Character Stuff: I like when Picard does the mambo. And when he's greeting those people who make him put on that headdress. Singing A British Tar was different. Riker walking around without the beard, acting like nothing was different was a hoot. "Smooth as an Android's bottom, right Data?" Picard and Anij make for an odd pairing.

    Technical: The CGI is pretty good for the late-'90s. For the most part. I think they switched to CGI for the Enterprise a little too soon. Stretching Daugherty's face at the end makes me cringe.

    And that's all I've got. Except, yes, there are times in this fast-paced world where I too wish time would slow down. Don't know if I'd sell my soul for it, though.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2018
  12. thribs

    thribs Commodore Commodore

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    We learn that the Federation is allowed cloaking devices on their person but not on their ships. Those things could have been handy against the Dominion
     
  13. arch101

    arch101 Commodore Commodore

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    If this had been a better film, there would have been more posts. Note that TMP never has trouble with posts on milestone anniversaries. (TMP never has trouble generating posts, period).
    As for Insurrection, I always wonder how Geordi can regrow eyes he was never born with. That kinda shuts it down for me right there.
     
  14. thribs

    thribs Commodore Commodore

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    Strange since TMP is a far worse film.
     
  15. Damian

    Damian Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    To be fair, he was born with eyes, he was just blind. The planet's rays just helped his optic nerves regenerate. I never had an issue with that. However, that does lead to the question what happened to his vision in Nemesis? I guess he had to be under the influence of the radiation.

    For me it ranks in last place among TNG films (and just above TFF overall in 12th place). But I always say I don't 'hate' any of the Trek films, even TFF which comes in last place for me there's plenty I enjoy about it. Story wise it probably could outdo Insurrection but the special effects are just so horrific in TFF that it drags the rest of the movie down. Insurrections special effects, while they didn't blow me away weren't the abomination that TFF had. They were at least average.

    After my rewatch last week I actually didn't mind Insurrection too much. If I just take it on it's own and not compare it to the other films I find it entertaining enough, even with its flaws.
     
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  16. Damian

    Damian Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    But I do notice a certain amount of apathy toward Insurrection. Even Nemesis gets more attention (most hate but still). I'm curious, by and large do people hate Insurrection or Nemesis more? I'm one of the 10 people that liked Nemesis :whistle: so couldn't say. As I noted Insurrection is 4/4 of TNG, I actually put Nemesis in 2nd place, after First Contact (leaving Generations 3rd). Partly because First Contact and Nemesis were the 2 TNG films that felt like feature films to me. Insurrection and Generations felt like glorified TV episodes.

    But as for those that don't like Insurrection and Nemesis, which one do they hate more?
     
  17. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Commodore Commodore

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    I like Insurrection better than Nemesis. On a 10-scale, I'd probably give Insurrection a 6 and Nemesis a 4.

    That being said: I think Nemesis looks and feels more like a movie, even if it's a movie I don't like. Insurrection is just an episode with a massive budget.
     
  18. Turd Ferguson

    Turd Ferguson Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I enjoyed Insurrection on this previous rewatch, Nemesis I've tried watching multiple times and have to stop because it's so dreary. Tom Hardy is the reason I want to like it so much since he's one of my favorite actors, but the writing is atrocious, all the regulars look tired and bored and like they don't want to be there, Ron Perlman is completely wasted (they didn't even bother giving his character a name!) and the special effects, while slightly better than Insurrection's, leave a lot to be desired.
     
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  19. IMC Headquarters

    IMC Headquarters Commander Premium Member

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    The film's opening soundtrack is Goldsmith's most beautiful composition since Ilia's Theme for TMP overture. His immortality is assured. Metaphasic music...
     
  20. Lance

    Lance Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    You're not the first to notice :) There does seem to be a very special apathy reserved for this movie, that the others never received.

    As internet reviewer SFDebris put it:

    It isn't loved like Two, popular like Four, prescient like Six, exciting like Eight. It doesn't have people rushing to defend it, saying it's cerebral like One, significant like Three, ambitious like Five, landmark like Seven, or theatrical like Ten. Insurrection stands alone: bad enough to be hated, but not bad enough to be loved.
     
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