Sith questions

[tharpdevenport]

Oh, fuck no, but I know what you are talking about because I've seen reviews and watched clips on Youtube.

For me TFA is a polished turd. It's a weird amalgamation of the second trilogy, combined with weird amalgamations of parts of hte original trilogy, put into a Disney blender and then scored by later-career John Williams.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Oh, fuck no, but I know what you are talking about because I've seen reviews and watched clips on Youtube.

For me TFA is a polished turd. It's a weird amalgamation of the second trilogy, combined with weird amalgamations of parts of hte original trilogy, put into a Disney blender and then scored by later-career John Williams.

Maybe see the film first before you decide what it is.

Still it shows what happens after the Empire falls. It's been fragmented into the First Order, the New Republic and The Resistance with "well organized bad guys" persevering just as you "predicted"

 

[Tuskin38]

Maybe see the film first before you decide what it is.

This ^

Which is why there is still some mystery about what Palpatine was trying to do with his Empire, as there are still hints the new canon that he was preparing for something long term, but what is unknown at this time.

Doesn't one of the new sources say he was trying to find something on Jakku before his death?

Why does everyone want to go back to Jakku?!

 

[Nerys Myk]

Maybe he just likes being in control.

 

[Ithekro]

As for the end of the Empire. Palpatine had some sort of long term plan going on, we just don't know what yet as it is likely going to be a plot point for the next few films. But in the aftermath of this death, his scorched earth policies happened. Some were stopped by the Rebel Alliance/New Republic, such as the attempted scorching of Naboo. The Empire fragmented almost immediately due to the power vacuum. Admirals and Moffs would declare their own little domains using what fleets and armies they had. Systems that had been waiting rebelled openly. Some declared independence while others join the New Republic. Some held on to the ideals of the New Order and remained loyal to the Empire, but in less than two years the Empire surrendered after the disastrous Battle of Jakku, where the worn out Imperial Navy made one last stand against the New Republic. Of the 13 or so Super Star Destroyers, nearly of them were destroyed by the time of the Battle of Jakku, and by the end of that battle, all were supposedly destroyed or captured (one might have escaped). The Navy was basically spent.

The peace treaty ended the Empire's military domination in exchange for keeping their systems. It is unclear how many Imperial Worlds from the Core World or Outer Rim technically remain as part of the Galactic Empire. The remains of the most extremely loyal members of the Imperial Fleet jumped into the Unknown Regions and more or less vanished for decades. They have since come back as the First Order, which goes against the treaty, but the New Republic, after over two decades of peace, does not consider the First Order to be a threat. Mostly because the First Order is taking great pains to keep their number hidden from the Republic. The Resistance is Leia and other's efforts to keep a military force watching the First Order since the Republic won't do it as it is complacent and some of its senators are more inclined to join something more like the Empire and its orderly ways over the slow and potentially chaotic bureaucracy of the Republic. Several systems remain outside the Republic, completely independent of the larger galactic scale and regional scale governments. There are threats of another Separatist Movement some years before the events of The Force Awakens....systems that might join the First Order, or the other remains of the Empire, rather than stay with the Republic. However information is still scare for this time period as the films are still in production.

 

[Set Harth]

Palpatine rules the galaxy and can do whatever he wants to do. What we don't really know yet is, what was he doing? What was his plan....did he even have one after "kill all the Jedi"?

From the book Tarkin by James Luceno:

Even Vader was unaware of the shrine’s existence. But it was here that they would one day work together the way Sidious and Plagueis had to coax from the dark side its final secrets. In the intervening years he had actually come to appreciate Plagueis for the planner and prophet he had been. Such perilous machinations required two Sith, one to serve as bait for the dark side, the other to be the vessel. Success would grant them the power to harness the full powers of the dark side, and allow them to rule for ten thousand years. (p101)

Attacks like the one directed against Tarkin’s moon base and discoveries like the one on Murkhana were distractions to his ultimate goal of making certain that the Force could not strike back, and that whatever faint light of hope remained could be snuffed out for good. (p103)

And he would not allow himself to be sidetracked from his goal of unlocking the secrets many of the Sith Masters before him had sought: the means to harness the powers of the dark side to reshape reality itself; in effect, to fashion a universe of his own creation. Not mere immortality of the sort Plagueis had lusted after, but influence of the ultimate sort. (p242)

 

[Reverend]

Which is why there is still some mystery about what Palpatine was trying to do with his Empire, as there are still hints the new canon that he was preparing for something long term, but what is unknown at this time.

I think the basic gist of it is to delve into the deeper mysteries of the force, gain ultimate power, immortality, shape the universe to his will. Basic supervillain stuff.

If one reads the 'Tarkin' novel it's clear the Emperor couldn't give two poodoos about the rest of the galaxy so long as he got what he wanted out of it. Indeed, he's finding it something of a distraction from continuing the work he started with Plagueis. He's not even creating an ordered society, he's creating an engine of hate, ambition, oppression and misery. "Order and Security" is just a thin veneer.

Here's an excerpt that I think paint's a pretty vivid and unambiguous picture of Sidious's intentions: -

Spoiler: Tarkin novel

"Save for Sidious, no sentient being in close to five thousand years had set foot in the shrine. The room’s excavation and restoration had been carried out by machines under the supervision of 11-4D. Even Vader was unaware of the shrine’s existence. But it was here that they would one day work together the way Sidious and Plagueis had to coax from the dark side its final secrets. In the intervening years he had actually come to appreciate Plagueis for the planner and prophet he had been. Such perilous machinations required two Sith, one to serve as bait for the dark side, the other to be the vessel. Success would grant them the power to harness the full powers of the dark side, and allow them to rule for ten thousand years."

For context: the shrine in question is the one the Jedi built the Coruscant temple over. Toppling the Jedi order may have been as much about gaining unfettered access to this place as it was enacting revenge. Honestly the revenge thing never made much sense since Sith are inherently selfish, so why would they care if some ancient Sith lord was too weak to defeat the Jedi? It's not personal to the likes of Sidious, Maul, Tyranus or Vader. Sure, they each have their own personal reasons for hating the Jedi, but I can't see any of them caring about what happened to Bane and his contemporaries.

 

[tharpdevenport]

Maybe see the film first before you decide what it is.

No. I don't need to do that. I've gotten really good at weeding out bad filsm and waste of tiem films based on trailers, reviews, and if need be, clips online. sometiems I might ask for more from people on message boards. The result: I've seen a number of films in my life I wish I had never spent a penny on, but now with my current system, I haven't regretted a single film I have paid to see in a theater in probably a decade. I've ferreted out what TFA is and for me, it's gotten ever worse the more I learn.

 

[fireproof78]

I'm curious as to what is so bad about it?

 

[Idran]

No. I don't need to do that. I've gotten really good at weeding out bad filsm and waste of tiem films based on trailers, reviews, and if need be, clips online. sometiems I might ask for more from people on message boards. The result: I've seen a number of films in my life I wish I had never spent a penny on, but now with my current system, I haven't regretted a single film I have paid to see in a theater in probably a decade. I've ferreted out what TFA is and for me, it's gotten ever worse the more I learn.

But if you never actually watch the films, how do you guard against false negatives? You might never have seen a film you regretted in the last decade, but how do you know that every film you've avoided actually was one you would have regretted?

You might never have had a false positive, but you have no idea at all about your rate of false negatives, so you can't really be sure how effective your system actually is.

 

[Reverend]

But if you never actually watch the films, how do you guard against false negatives? You might never have seen a film you regretted in the last decade, but how do you know that every film you've avoided actually was one you would have regretted?

You might never have had a false positive, but you have no idea at all about your rate of false negatives, so you can't really be sure how effective your system actually is.

Next you'll be telling me that my giant squid repelling talisman is just and ordinary soap on a rope! Do you see any giant squid attacking me in the shower? I think not!!!