Sisko's father.

[Kobayshi Maru]

I just realized that in the ep 2.12 ("The Alternate") , Sisko indicates that his father is dead, yet we see him resuscitate, two seasons later...

Sisko must have been overjoyed at the miracle involved.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I just realized that in the ep 2.12 ("The Alternate") , Sisko indicates that his father is dead

No, not dead, just very sick.

 

[Timo]

It's a classic save, similar to how Spock had a human "ancestor" in "Corbomite Maneuver" but a living human mother in "Journey to Babel". Not a contradiction, but clearly something the original writer had different ideas about.

In both cases, interpreting the line against original intent created enjoyable results, as the casting and writing was spot on, adding an excellent character to the Trek universe.

There are reverse instances, too: Kirk is said to have three nephews in "What Are Little Girls Made Of?", but in "Operation: Annihilate!" we only see one, and Kirk loses his brother, which would be an excellent time to mention that he also has other siblings (the mother or father of the remaining two kids, and perhaps a few extra relatives for future storylines), yet no mention is made.

If a writer wanted, he could easily "resurrect" a brother or two for Kirk despite that latter episode. And in ST5:TFF, Kirk says he lost "a" brother once (even if he's being poetic and speaking of Spock, apparently), something that might roll off his tongue more easily if he had several brothers to begin with.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Elias Vaughn]

Well, Sisko is basically Space Jesus, so I suppose a resurrection isn't too far off.

 

[Captain Kathryn]

LOL I just watched "The Alternate" this morning and did not notice that!

Fail.

 

[MikeS]

The Evil Admiral Cartwright went to great lengths to hide from justice. Altering The Sisko's & Jake's memories, transplanting himself into the role of father and grandfather and learning to cook gumbo.

 

[Stevil2001]

It's a classic save, similar to how Spock had a human "ancestor" in "Corbomite Maneuver" but a living human mother in "Journey to Babel". Not a contradiction, but clearly something the original writer had different ideas about.

In both cases, interpreting the line against original intent created enjoyable results, as the casting and writing was spot on, adding an excellent character to the Trek universe.

The script for "Homefront" acknowledges the implication of the line from "The Alternate":

	Several years earlier Joseph fought a debilitating
	battle against a severe illness, barely surviving.
	He's never gotten back to full strength, but he's
	determined to live out the rest of his years with
	gusto. Unfortunately, the years are starting to run
	out, a fact he's determined not to reveal to his son.

 

[Timo]

Exactly. And we could argue Spock's (in retrospect) cold detachment about his own mother in "Corbomite Maneuver" is consistently expanded on in "Journey to Babel": we just misunderstood it a bit, as Spock in fact is angry for her, and to his father... It's not as if the writers of these latter episodes would have been ignorant of the former writing, quite to the contrary.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Kobayshi Maru]

I am sorry but in "Emissary", IE the first episode, Sisko says "My father WAS a gourmet chef."

You don't stop being a gourmet chef because you retire. The only way you can stop being one is by dying.


I rest my case.

 

[Timo]

What? Of course you stop being a gourmet chef if you retire - it's a profession! You can also stop being a redhead by dyeing rather than dying; there's nothing about "traits" that would require death for erasure, any more than there is about "skills" or "professions".

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Trek Survivor]

I am sorry but in "Emissary", IE the first episode, Sisko says "My father WAS a gourmet chef."

You don't stop being a gourmet chef because you retire. The only way you can stop being one is by dying.


I rest my case.

Um, no. As Timo says, of course you can stop being a gournet chef.

The line from "Alternate" is not a 'fail' as somebody else says - all Sisko says is his father got very sick, and he realised he couldn't help him anymore... sure, it can be read as his father died, but it's certainly not a mistake or error.

 

[Tora Ziyal]

I am sorry but in "Emissary", IE the first episode, Sisko says "My father WAS a gourmet chef."

You don't stop being a gourmet chef because you retire. The only way you can stop being one is by dying.


I rest my case.

You rested it way too soon.

Of course you may stop being a gourmet chef before you die. If you continue cooking gourmet meals for friends and family after you retire, then you still are a gourmet chef. If you pretty much stop cooking when you retire, then you WERE a gourmet chef.

My father was an electrical engineer and a talented artist. When he developed Alzheimers in the last years of his life, he was no longer either.

 

[Kobayshi Maru]

I am sorry but in "Emissary", IE the first episode, Sisko says "My father WAS a gourmet chef."

You don't stop being a gourmet chef because you retire. The only way you can stop being one is by dying.


I rest my case.

You rested it way too soon.

Of course you may stop being a gourmet chef before you die. If you continue cooking gourmet meals for friends and family after you retire, then you still are a gourmet chef. If you pretty much stop cooking when you retire, then you WERE a gourmet chef.

My father was an electrical engineer and a talented artist. When he developed Alzheimers in the last years of his life, he was no longer either.

"Gourmet Chef" is a distinction not a profession. The only way that Sisko's father could stop being a gourmet chef while alive is if for some reason his cooking stinks, but even so, out of respect, I don't believe that Sisko would have said, my father WAS a gourmet chef, that clearly indicates that he's dead.

Imagine Sisko telling people, my father used to be a very good cook but now, he really sucks at it.

Nobody, Sisko less than most, would intentionally say something so demeaning about his father unless he intends to hurt him.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

"Gourmet Chef" is a distinction not a profession.

Actually, it's both.

The only way that Sisko's father could stop being a gourmet chef while alive is if for some reason his cooking stinks, but even so, out of respect, I don't believe that Sisko would have said, my father WAS a gourmet chef, that clearly indicates that he's dead.

Maybe Joseph just, you know, decided to take a BREAK from cooking for awhile?

 

[Kobayshi Maru]

"Gourmet Chef" is a distinction not a profession.

Actually, it's both.

The only way that Sisko's father could stop being a gourmet chef while alive is if for some reason his cooking stinks, but even so, out of respect, I don't believe that Sisko would have said, my father WAS a gourmet chef, that clearly indicates that he's dead.

Maybe Joseph just, you know, decided to take a BREAK from cooking for awhile?

Even if he did take a break, that doesn't justify Sisko saying that his father WAS a gourmet chef. A doctor that takes a sabatical is still a doctor, you don't say "he used to be a doctor" unless you have reasons to believe that he is incompetent. But even so, out of respect, I think sisko would have refrained from saying so. Why rub salt into the wound? Unless, Sisko was angry with his father and wanted to hurt him... You don't think that's the case , do you?

 

[MacLeod]

When we use the word was we are generally referring to the past tense. i.e He was <insert profession>. If you retire or change professions you are no longer that profession so you wouldn't tend to use the present tense of is.

Sure there are times you might use the present tense to indicate someones former profession. i.e if you have need of a Doctor and know that a particular person practiced as a doctor you might use the phrase "That man is a Doctor" but that's because you need that particular skill at that moment in time.

 

[Tosk]

Does it matter? Clearly the original dialogue was written in a way that implied that Daddy Sisko was dead but not so conclusively that he couldn't show up alive and well later in the series. And thank goodness, because Brock rules.

 

[Iamnotspock]

"Gourmet Chef" is a distinction not a profession.

Actually, it's both.

The only way that Sisko's father could stop being a gourmet chef while alive is if for some reason his cooking stinks, but even so, out of respect, I don't believe that Sisko would have said, my father WAS a gourmet chef, that clearly indicates that he's dead.

Maybe Joseph just, you know, decided to take a BREAK from cooking for awhile?

Even if he did take a break, that doesn't justify Sisko saying that his father WAS a gourmet chef. A doctor that takes a sabatical is still a doctor, you don't say "he used to be a doctor" unless you have reasons to believe that he is incompetent. But even so, out of respect, I think sisko would have refrained from saying so. Why rub salt into the wound? Unless, Sisko was angry with his father and wanted to hurt him... You don't think that's the case , do you?

Occam's Razor.

A doctor who takes a sabbatical is still a doctor, yes, but a doctor who retires or is struck off the medical register WAS a doctor. Likewise, a gourmet chef who has retired and, say, no longer cooks at all due to a debilitating illness WAS a gourmet chef.

Anyway, it's irrelevant. Whatever the intent of the original line, Sisko's father then showed up alive and well and running his restaurant, therefore the only way to interpret the line, retroactively, is that Joseph retired and stopped cooking for a while, and Ben never expected him to take it up again. If the line had been, "My late father was a gourmet chef" then we'd have a continuity error, but as it is, the line can be interpreted in another way, and if there's only one other way it can be interpreted, then that other way must be correct. QED.

Does it matter? Clearly the original dialogue was written in a way that implied that Daddy Sisko was dead but not so conclusively that he couldn't show up alive and well later in the series. And thank goodness, because Brock rules.

Indeed.