Robot, probot

[Wingsley]

Here's are a few conceptual questions about TOS and TAS:

We know that robot probes and automated attendants are part of the STAR TREK universe. Witness Flint's hovering M4 security drone, Nomad, and the use of unmanned probes ("The Immunity Syndrome"), etc. Sentient and semi-sentient robots are very much a part of both Federation and alien technology as the voyages of Kirk's Enterprise has shown.

Here are some questions to consider:

1: We never saw the Enterprise crew beam down a robot probe ("probot") to a planet to check it out, either before sending a landing party down, or just to "drop it off" before quickly leaving orbit for another assignment. Does this mean the Federation/Starfleet does not make a practice of depositing probots on planets either in lieu of personnel or ahead of them?

I ask this because "That Which Survives" might have turned out differently if D'Amato had sent a geological probe down first, only for holo-Losira to have destroyed it.

2: In "Operation: Annihilate!", the Enterprise drops a couple hundred powerful satellites into orbit of Deneva. Given that the Enterprise is quite capable of deploying space-based technology aloft of what is obviously a Federation colony, could the Prime Directive be involved in Kirk not sending a probot ashore ahead of his landing party in "Bread and Circuses"?

3: Could security concerns also discourage Federation starships from relying on probots for preliminary surveys of hitherto "strange, new worlds"? In other words, could Starfleet be wary about deploying robot technology that might be captured by hostile parties such as the Klingons, Romulans, Gorn, etc., and either dissected or turned against a starship (booby trapped?) upon retrieval?

4: If technological security isn't a concern, could it be that probots are indeed used (just unseen) but "dumbed down" enough that loosing them to hostile parties would not be a concern?

5: With apologies in advance, looking to other space fiction shows of the 1950's and '60's, would Robbie the Robot or the B9 Robot of "Lost in Space" fit in a STAR TREK story?

 

[MANT!]

Robby in a Star Trek story? Yes...B-9, No... I'm quite sure technology transfer (violating the Prime Directive) is the real reason for not using probots..

 

[ZERO_of_ZERO]

I'm quite sure technology transfer (violating the Prime Directive) is the real reason for not using probots..

Ive never though about this, but the quote above seems reasonable.

Not to mention it would make the story less exciting/interesting if a probe ran in to all the danger first.

Of course they could have sent down a guy in a Red shirt first - they were pretty expedable, with lots to replace them!

 

[Wingsley]

But does this have to mean that Starfleet *never* uses robots?

 

[MANT!]

probably not...more in an industrial capacity I'm thinking..like the Exo-comps seen in TNG..

 

[Shatmandu]

Starfleet had made a critical error in the design of their Probe Androids: giving them a lifelike vagina.

The Enterprises' cache was sealed into a storage area, only accessible by Kirk.

Joe, noted Trek fiction writer

 

[The Squire of Gothos]

Spock; The probes!

 

[Timo]

I'd vote for rationale #3, too. And dumbing down the probes beyond that would render them useless for the sort of gentle probing that Kirk's landing posses usually attempt.

TOS in general relied a lot on the older scifi trend of achieving everything through magical radiation and fields. No need for robots when a tricorder or a starship scanner already tells us everything of relevance, a transporter handles transportation, and a phaser beam slices, dices and spot-welds. A more modern trend has brought forward the idea of achieving the same things via blinking gadgets that go places and do things, each having a lot of fast-moving parts. And recent science fiction has begun to embrace the idea that everything can actually be achieved simply by proper application of suitable materials, perhaps modulated by nanotechnology.

It's difficult to say which is the more realistic prediction for the real 23rd century. For all we know, all these approaches lack in credibility, and the future may end up most closely approximating the swords-and-sorcery genre of scifi where ethereal mental abilities (read: advanced computing and communications technology) coupled with the most basic mechanical implements is the proper solution to everything.

Certainly TOS can be excused for choosing a "doctrine" that excludes robots, just as it can be excused for choosing a doctrinal approach that doesn't include sorcery or nanomaterials. We might end up making such choices in reality, too.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Outpost4]

Roddenberry: But it doesn't make sense for us to send people down to a planet first. We should send down robot probes to check it out before we send people.

Coon: OK, then you write 5 minutes into every script where the robot probe finds out that everything is OK before we transport the crew. You make the viewer interested in the welfare of the robot probe.

Roddenberry: On second thought, just beam down the captain into danger.

 

[The Squire of Gothos]

Although to be honest, the danger never seems to be something the crew can scan for, be it natives that turn nasty in a second or some sort of anomalous advanced alien.

 

[Timo]

Indeed, I'd see the role of a robot not as a pathfinder, but as the trusty and valuable sidekick to the live landing party members. A combined gunnery platform, mobile laboratory, tent carrier, cup holder and microwave who also occasionally gives off a cute whistle or adorable if naiive remark. That's closer to Robbie's role, too.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Jackson_Roykirk]

I agree with Outpost4 -- Maybe it would make more sense to use robots, but that would detract from the drama of the TV show.

One can give all of the logical explanations you want as to why we didn't see more robots; but the real reason is that it would make for a less interesting 50 minutes of television. That, and because it would be too expensive to have robots in the show every week (although I suppose they could have used the same robot model on a string week after week.)

 

[Wingsley]

I think I'm being misunderstood here.

I would expect that budget and creative considerations may have indeed played a role in the absence of Starfleet robots in TOS. (Although I would point out that Kirk and Spock are quick to rely on supposedly "dumb" probes in "The Imuunity Syndorme", and those probes actually added to the drama.) Still, I think there were other things that may have been behind it:

1: TOS was made in an era long before the Viking probes reached Mars. Maybe no writers ever thought of an exploratory robot being anything more than a missile-based "probe". Keep in mind that Peepo was a new gimmick when SPACE ACADEMY came out ten years later.

2: The more I think of it, the more Robbie and/or B9 would have been at home aboard the Enterprise. But it would've been hard to come up with an all-new design to top either of those. I don't think anyone did that until BATTLESTAR GALACTICA came along.

3: If Gene Roddenberry and company had, in fact, considered the possibility of using a probot, I would expect one concern that might've killed it would be deciding on a level of sophistication for it. Can it talk like a Starfleet computer? If so, what would it say? Would it have a personality like Mrs. Roddenberry's characterization of Computer? Would a probot have become a character itself, as the B9 Robot did in LOST IN SPACE? Even if it didn't, it would have to be presented to the audience in such a way as to give it characteristics the audience would feel comfortable with. These considerations might've made it easier to just veto the concept entirely.

Let's assume the TOS crew had decided to go ahead with a robot for an episode in either Year 4 or TAS. What would it have been like?

 

[aridas sofia]

Maybe these people are so advanced that they really don't expect anything to be able to harm them. So they've outgrown the need for probots.

But then are rudely surprised on a weekly basis. And have outgrown learning from experience.

 

[Christopher]

1: TOS was made in an era long before the Viking probes reached Mars. Maybe no writers ever thought of an exploratory robot being anything more than a missile-based "probe". Keep in mind that Peepo was a new gimmick when SPACE ACADEMY came out ten years later.

But keep in mind that TV science fiction is generally 20 years behind prose science fiction, and that a lot of TOS writers were veteran prose-SF authors in their own right. Robots were certainly a richly explored concept in prose SF long before TOS came along.

(And by the way, Space Academy premiered four months after Star Wars debuted in theaters. Peepo wasn't a new gimmick, he was an R2-D2 knockoff.)

 

[Wingsley]

Then R2-D2 was the gimmick.

 

[Timo]

Let's assume the TOS crew had decided to go ahead with a robot for an episode in either Year 4 or TAS. What would it have been like?

TAS would have been fertile grounds for a robot that would have a bit of a personality, of the cardboard variety. Perhaps a primitive Data but in cliched metal box shape. I rather shudder at the thought.

TOS S4 would have benefited from practical constraints: their robot would have to have been either a full android like Data (a long-trotting Roddenberry hobby horse), or then a relatively simplistic device. I see potential for some sort of tiny hovering devices to accompany the landing parties - technological aids akin to tricorders and phasers, and no doubt similarly iconic by the end of the season. They did pretty good basic fly-by-wire effects with Nomad and the telekinetically moving objects of "Plato's Stepchildren", and could have extended those to some sort of flying scouts.

Think of futuristic falcons or carrier pigeons that perch on the shoulders or belts of the heroes ,until needed for classic spying or for the even more classic "Go, Lassie, and tell them we're stuck in this well!" role.

Also, the smaller the bots, the easier it would be to sneak them into the Trek universe, perhaps to pretend that they had existed all along and simply weren't deemed particularly necessary during normal assignments. And at handheld size, they'd make for ideal merchandise.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[The Squire of Gothos]

Maybe the remastered episodes could have included a few in the back ground, such as the robots that followed the Storm troopers in the remastered Star Wars.

 

[Outpost4]

They could have added Twiki!

 

[Wingsley]

^ Oh, now that's cruel!