Orci on Start Trek, timelines, canon and everything (SPOILERS)

[SalvorHardin]

Bob Orci on Start Trek, timelines, canon and everything (SPOILERS)

Interesting Q&A over at Trekmovie. Pretty much confirms a lot of what we've been thinking the past weeks

The full thing can be read here http://trekmovie.com/2008/12/11/bob...-movie-fits-with-trek-canon-and-real-science/

A brief summary of the interview.

Q: Why do some things appear different in the new Star Trek movie?
A: There is an alternative timeline created by Nero traveling back in time.

Q: Is everything different in the alternative timeline?
A: No, some things remain the same.​

Q: Does this alternative timeline wipe out the original timeline (from TOS -Nemesis)?
A: No, quantum theory says they both co-exist.​

Q: Does the original timeline continue?
A: Yes, again as explained by quantum theory.​

Q: Does this quantum theory approach conform to ‘Trek science?’
A: Depends on the episode, but it is explicitly cited by Data in the episode “Parallels.”​

I found this answer quite funny:

Anthony: So everyone in the prime timeline, like Picard and Riker, are still off doing there thing, it is just that Nero is gone.



Bob: Yes, and you will notice that whenever the movie comes out, that whatever DVDs you have purchased, will continue to exist.

 

[Jessop]

FINALLY. Perhaps now the canon cry babies will shut the hell up.

 

[SPCTRE]

I found this answer quite funny:

Anthony: So everyone in the prime timeline, like Picard and Riker, are still off doing there thing, it is just that Nero is gone.



Bob: Yes, and you will notice that whenever the movie comes out, that whatever DVDs you have purchased, will continue to exist.

 

[shipfisher]

Ya gotta love that quantum multi-verse.

 

[Kpnuts]

I'm now sick of reading the words 'quantum mechanics'.

Could the interviewer have asked the same question any more times? Orci must have been pulling his hair out at having to go on about the exact same thing with each question.

 

[Patrickivan]

So it's not an origins story then. It's about a completely different set of characters in a completely different Star Trek universe. They may as well have just given the characters different names, (including the ship).

I also heard that in this alternate universe, hamburgers eat people!

 

[blaXXer]

So it's not an origins story then. It's about a completely different set of characters in a completely different Star Trek universe. They may as well have just given the characters different names, (including the ship).

I also heard that in this alternate universe, hamburgers eat people!

Bitter, much?

 

[trekkerguy]

So it's not an origins story then. It's about a completely different set of characters in a completely different Star Trek universe. They may as well have just given the characters different names, (including the ship).

I also heard that in this alternate universe, hamburgers eat people!

 

[SalvorHardin]

So it's not an origins story then. It's about a completely different set of characters

No...read again

Anthony: So the big question is: Is the destruction of the Kelvin, the canon reason why everything is different?

Bob: It is the reason why some things are different, but not everything is different.

Not everything is inconsistent with what might have actually happened, in canon.

Some of the things that seem that they are totally different, I will argue, once the film comes out, fall well within what could have been the non-time travel version of this move.


Anthony: So, for example, Kirk is different, because his back story has totally changed, in that his parents…and all that. But you are saying that maybe Scotty or Spock’s back story would not be affected by that change?


Bob: Right.

He doesn't say what happens with hamburgers though... We'll have to wait until May for that

FINALLY. Perhaps now the canon cry babies will shut the hell up.

highly unlikely. I expect even more violated childhoods coming.

 

[Patrickivan]

Ya gotta love that quantum multi-verse.

So it's not an origins story then. It's about a completely different set of characters in a completely different Star Trek universe. They may as well have just given the characters different names, (including the ship).

I also heard that in this alternate universe, hamburgers eat people!

Bitter, much?

There was nothing bitter about my comments. They were quite reasonable responses to the interview.

It's not going to be an alternate universe? They aren't going to be completely different characters? This isn't a completely different ship?

Did we just read a different interview above?

The hamburger statement on the other hand was my flippant view on alternate timeline stories. That and my fear of hamburgers turning on their masters!

 

[SalvorHardin]

You know, to be honest, I get what they were trying to do with the "alternate universe\some things change because of time travel" thing.

But I don't really like it, that they chose to explain the visual or other changes and deviations from canon like this.

I would prefer they had not tried to reconcile things at all.
I would prefer they had gone the way of "It's a movie made in 2008-9 and we simply decided to update the old designs and simply disregard or change some canon facts. Deal with it."

Oh well...Still looking forward to May

 

[USS Intrepid]

You know, to be honest, I get what they were trying to do with the "alternate universe\some things change because of time travel" thing.

But I don't really like it, that they chose to explain the visual or other changes and deviations from canon like this.

I would prefer they had not tried to reconcile things at all.
I would prefer they had gone the way of "It's a movie made in 2008-9 and we simply decided to update the old designs and simply disregard or change some canon facts. Deal with it."

I would have preferred this too. I dunno, this really dampens my enthusiasm a bit. Just seems like an easy out to me.

 

[Butters]

Ya gotta love that quantum multi-verse.

So it's not an origins story then. It's about a completely different set of characters in a completely different Star Trek universe. They may as well have just given the characters different names, (including the ship).

I also heard that in this alternate universe, hamburgers eat people!

Bitter, much?

There was nothing bitter about my comments. They were quite reasonable responses to the interview.

It's not going to be an alternate universe? They aren't going to be completely different characters? This isn't a completely different ship?

Did we just read a different interview above?

The hamburger statement on the other hand was my flippant view on alternate timeline stories. That and my fear of hamburgers turning on their masters!

Yes, you read a different interview.

These are the same characters. Because of intervention from the future, they are forced to zig when they should have zagged, hence the parallel universe/parallel adventures. Its not rocket science.

 

[USS Intrepid]

I also wonder if any of this is influenced by the fact that the movie and TV rights lie in different hands. If there is a new show, is it possible it'll be set in the 'original' quantum reality?

I know, a new series, if there ever is one, is likely a long way off. Still, it makes me wonder.

 

[Jessop]

These aren't the precious canon cry babies characters now, they're alternate versions. Why continue crying? Your Kirk is happily chugging along in the other timeline.

 

[Franklin]

One thing Orci is saying is they've basically retconned what time travel tended to mean in Star Trek. Timelines are no longer "set right," but whole new universes are formed. That is, according to the latest and greatest current and most accepted and tested and breath-freshening theory out there -- quantum theory.

Man, I don't know. Something about all this sounds like a cheat, but I don't have time to give it enough thought today. They are the characters, but they aren't the characters. We're seeing them at the start of their careers, but these will be different careers. Something about this isn't very satisfying. Sounds like they are trying to have their cake, and eat it, too. (Though in some universes, the cake has you and eats you. ) If that's the case, then I'd have rather seen a clean cut with the past and a complete reboot.

Well, the movie may still be rip-roaringly entertaining. And that's the most important thing in the end.

 

[Capt_Jason]

These aren't the precious canon cry babies characters now, they're alternate versions. Why continue crying? Your Kirk is happily chugging along in the other timeline.

Finally...the voice of reason makes itself known!

It was never about an origins story, and everything to do with TPTB re-imagining a once-lucridive cash cow. Let the crying stop, Leningrad has fallen, that sort of thing.

Take this new film for what it is.

 

[tranya]

Glad to finally see this resolved but, wow, Orci sounds like his understanding of science goes about as deep as watching "Parallels." The guy comes off as seriously wanting some kind of external "scientific" justification for his story choice, and that just ain't there, buddy. Check these out:

Yes. If you look at quantum mechanics and you learn about the fact that our most successful theory of science is quantum mechanics, and the fact that it deals with probabilities of events happening.

According to the most successful, most tested scientific theory ever, quantum mechanics, it continues.

t has to conform to the latest scientific theories and the most advanced and complete, and right now that is quantum mechanics.

We have to deal with it, with the fact that Star Trek episodes that don’t conform to our theory of it, also do notconform to the latest greatest, most highly tested scientific theory in human history

I would argue that, yes, any time there is time travel that they created a parallel universe, if they want to conform to our most current and advanced thinking on the matter, which is quantum mechanics.

If we take Data’s description of the most current and awesome scientific theory to heart, then there is no prime timeline.

Does this dude have anything in his bag of tricks other than ludicrous hyperbole?

I'm excited for the alternate timeline, but this interview just turned me from being very excited about this film to fearing it's going to be as shittily written as The Island or Transformers. Orci's not exactly making himself out to be an intellectual giant here.

Anyone care to comment on how "awesome" and "current" and "most advanced of the sciences" quantum mechanics is? Especially, this watered-down version of the DeWitt many worlds hypothesis?

 

[RoJoHen]

I would prefer they had not tried to reconcile things at all.
I would prefer they had gone the way of "It's a movie made in 2008-9 and we simply decided to update the old designs and simply disregard or change some canon facts. Deal with it."

I'm pretty sure this is what they've been trying to do from the start, but people kept bitching about that too.

They should really just keep their mouths shut. They'll never please everybody.

 

[SalvorHardin]

Orci's not exactly making himself out to be an intellectual giant here.

Well, he wasn't answering any particularly hard or incredibly intellectual questions here either.

And while I agree that mentioning the "most current and awesome scientific theory" all the time got ridiculous and annoying, I got the impression that it was just a deliberate over the top reaction since he was being asked almost the same thing over and over again.