Mythbusters 10/22/08: Drinking myths & Korean arrow launcher

[Christopher]

Beer goggles: I'm not sure I trust the experimental methodology. If the test subjects know going in what they're being tested for, it can bias the results. Someone who's inclined to believe in the "beer goggles" effect might thus be subconsciously influenced to behave accordingly, while someone who's inclined to be skeptical might be deliberately trying to resist the effect. The only way to do this scientifically would be if the test subjects didn't know what they were actually being tested for. Although it would then be hard to get their ratings of people's attractiveness.

Also I'm not sure about having that separate group rated as "equivalently" attractive. That's too subjective an assessment. The difference between sober and buzzed could've been the result of the assessors' different tastes and standards.

Sobering-up techniques: I'm very skeptical of the results. I can understand a slap in the face causing a rush of adrenaline and temporarily improving one's focus, but there's no way it could reduce the blood alcohol level as claimed, is there? Okay, maybe the physical attack gets the metabolism going faster, the blood flowing faster, and maybe that slightly speeds up the rate at which the alcohol is cleaned out. So it would be analogous to the exercise thing. I would imagine the shock of cold water is meant to have the same effect, though Jamie probably cancelled it out by keeping his head underwater and lowering his temperature, which would slow his metabolism. As for the coffee, I guess the idea is that it's a stimulant, countering the depressant effects of alcohol. But I think just makes you an alert drunk rather than making you more sober.

Also, drinking coffee, or anything else non-alcoholic, would help rehydrate you. I don't know if that would speed sobriety, but I gather it does help reduce hangovers, which are largely due to dehydration. Coffee does contain caffeine, which is a diuretic, but only limited amounts, not enough to cancel out the water it contains.

Hwacha: Now, this was a lot more interesting to me. As a teetotaller, I'm not fond of their alcohol myths. I'm not fond of weapons as a rule either, but this one was pretty impressive. I wouldn't have liked to see what it would do to human beings, but it's a startlingly potent invention, and the sight of all those flaming arrows going off at once was really impressive. Having these along the borders would have a potent psychological effect on enemies, never mind the actual damage. I'm surprised these weapons didn't become more common.

I noticed that one of the wagon wheels Tory used in building the hwacha was the wheel from their gunpowder-engine experiment a season or two ago. It still had the little metal hoppers welded on the outside. Recycling!

 

[Trekker4747]

The Hwacha was awesome and cool! That's all I've really to say. Great work on the Build Team on that thing.

The drunk myths, yeah the "Beer Goggles" thing to me seemed like skewed logic in their data gathering and interpetation. As you said, knowing what is being tested effects the results. They needed to either make it blind or have a control (someone who didn't know what was being tested.) But the "attractiveness" of the people shown to them also is extremely subjective.

I'm not sure there's any "good" way of testing this. Physical attractiveness is also based on a lot more than one's face/head.

It probably would've been better to have put them in a room filled with people of all attractivenesses and see which ones they try and to pick up. Better yet, put a bunch of single men in a room full of women of various attractivenesses and see which ones THEY try and pick up! (And you'd have to make "obvious" attractiveness layers here. Obeseness, etc. Maybe even surveying their subjects on who/what they find attractive and see who they pick up while buzzed and drunk.)

The "snap out of it" bit was interesting too. But it seemed obvious to me the treadmill worked because it increased Adam's heart rate which pumped blood through his system faster and then probably made him metabolize the alcohol faster, or atleast deliver it to his liver faster.

Him falling on treadmill was classic and the slap in slow-mo was funny.

But the beer-related Myths I think were a wash. More interesting/funny than they were definitive to one thing or other.

Kari's a cute drunk too.

"He looks homeless but kind of cute."

 

[DontFeedPhil]

Its episodes like this that prove they arent always using scientific logic. They must think the audience is totally stupid. It makes me question their conclusion on the bendini motor too.
Just proves that they just say what their sponsors and excecutive producers want them to conclude...

 

[Roger Wilco]

Beer goggles: I'm not sure I trust the experimental methodology. If the test subjects know going in what they're being tested for, it can bias the results. Someone who's inclined to believe in the "beer goggles" effect might thus be subconsciously influenced to behave accordingly, while someone who's inclined to be skeptical might be deliberately trying to resist the effect. The only way to do this scientifically would be if the test subjects didn't know what they were actually being tested for. Although it would then be hard to get their ratings of people's attractiveness.

Maybe, but I think with this myth the bigger problem is simply the sample size. Imo you just cannot reliably verify it with just three test subjects, the margin of error must be huge, especially with a new set of pictures every time. I think they should have judged the same photos every time (possibly with a few days in between and some measure of randomization like having to rate a thousand photos of women/men who aren't part of the actual test, so they forget the original ones).

 

[Trekker4747]

Its episodes like this that prove they arent always using scientific logic. They must think the audience is totally stupid. It makes me question their conclusion on the bendini motor too.
Just proves that they just say what their sponsors and excecutive producers want them to conclude...

Ummm what?

Firstly. I don't see what their faults in scientific method has to do with their sponsors. (Unless their sponsors have a vested interest in people not having beer goggles)

Secondly, anyone who believes that it's possible to get more out of something than you put into it is, well, has an opinion that makes me

 

[Christopher]

But the "attractiveness" of the people shown to them also is extremely subjective.

Well, that's not really a factor, since subjective perception is the very thing that's being tested. It's not about how attractive someone actually is, it's about how attractive the observer perceives them to be in different circumstances. The subjectivity of the measurement is a given; what's being tested is whether inebriation has a consistent effect on the observer's subjective judgments.

I'm not sure there's any "good" way of testing this. Physical attractiveness is also based on a lot more than one's face/head.

True, but this is another case where they're testing the letter of the myth more than its deeper meaning -- in this case, the old saw of "Now that I'm drunk, you're starting to look a lot better to me."

It probably would've been better to have put them in a room filled with people of all attractivenesses and see which ones they try and to pick up. Better yet, put a bunch of single men in a room full of women of various attractivenesses and see which ones THEY try and pick up!

I imagine there would be some ethical concerns there, doing an experiment involving possible sexual hookups. Plus they had to keep it clean for the younger viewers. Not to mention that Adam and Jamie both have spouses, and Kari's probably seeing someone.

Besides, Kari would probably be the hottest woman in the room, so that would kind of skew the results. (Although in this one she seemed to be slouching a lot. She should work on her posture.)

Him falling on treadmill was classic and the slap in slow-mo was funny.

I wondered why that treadmill didn't have a railing. Despite what Jamie said, I have to wonder if they deliberately left the railing off and assigned Adam to the treadmill test in the hope/expectation that they'd get another Adam slapstick moment they could replay five times in a row.

I think they should have judged the same photos every time (possibly with a few days in between and some measure of randomization like having to rate a thousand photos of women/men who aren't part of the actual test, so they forget the original ones).

That's a good idea.

 

[Trekker4747]

It's also been my understanding, with alcohol, it's a little less about "attractiveness" and more about "need to mate." Alcohol lowers your inhibitions, it doesn't put thoughts in your head.

Along with lowering your inhibitions it gimps the higher reasoning centers of the brain letting the primal areas of the brain come out more. Primal brain's central thoughts, among others, is: mate!

 

[firehawk12]

Beer goggles: I'm not sure I trust the experimental methodology. If the test subjects know going in what they're being tested for, it can bias the results. Someone who's inclined to believe in the "beer goggles" effect might thus be subconsciously influenced to behave accordingly, while someone who's inclined to be skeptical might be deliberately trying to resist the effect. The only way to do this scientifically would be if the test subjects didn't know what they were actually being tested for. Although it would then be hard to get their ratings of people's attractiveness.

Maybe, but I think with this myth the bigger problem is simply the sample size. Imo you just cannot reliably verify it with just three test subjects, the margin of error must be huge, especially with a new set of pictures every time. I think they should have judged the same photos every time (possibly with a few days in between and some measure of randomization like having to rate a thousand photos of women/men who aren't part of the actual test, so they forget the original ones).

I'm pretty sure the dataset is based on an experiment that was released a while ago online. I remember actually clicking through something similar anyway - it was a test to see that symmetry was more attractive or something.

The point is, if the sample size is big enough and you have two pictures of similar "attractiveness" as rated by a large number of people, then at least statistically you can say that two different people are equally attractive.

 

[BenRoethig]

But the "attractiveness" of the people shown to them also is extremely subjective.

Well, that's not really a factor, since subjective perception is the very thing that's being tested. It's not about how attractive someone actually is, it's about how attractive the observer perceives them to be in different circumstances. The subjectivity of the measurement is a given; what's being tested is whether inebriation has a consistent effect on the observer's subjective judgments.

I'm not sure there's any "good" way of testing this. Physical attractiveness is also based on a lot more than one's face/head.

True, but this is another case where they're testing the letter of the myth more than its deeper meaning -- in this case, the old saw of "Now that I'm drunk, you're starting to look a lot better to me."



I imagine there would be some ethical concerns there, doing an experiment involving possible sexual hookups. Plus they had to keep it clean for the younger viewers. Not to mention that Adam and Jamie both have spouses, and Kari's probably seeing someone.

Besides, Kari would probably be the hottest woman in the room, so that would kind of skew the results. (Although in this one she seemed to be slouching a lot. She should work on her posture.)

Him falling on treadmill was classic and the slap in slow-mo was funny.

I wondered why that treadmill didn't have a railing. Despite what Jamie said, I have to wonder if they deliberately left the railing off and assigned Adam to the treadmill test in the hope/expectation that they'd get another Adam slapstick moment they could replay five times in a row.

I think they should have judged the same photos every time (possibly with a few days in between and some measure of randomization like having to rate a thousand photos of women/men who aren't part of the actual test, so they forget the original ones).

That's a good idea.

Kari's been married for about 2 1/2 years now.

 

[Christopher]

Kari's been married for about 2 1/2 years now.

Ah. Gee, you'd think I'd remember hearing the sound of all those fanboy hearts breaking across the nation...

 

[Trekker4747]

Kari's been married for about 2 1/2 years now.

Ah. Gee, you'd think I'd remember hearing the sound of all those fanboy hearts breaking across the nation...

I heard it.

Sounded like a fart.

Interesting to me that you're a a teetotaller, Christopher. I'm one too! I'll toast you to a class of water!

 

[Christopher]

^^A class of water? Is that what a school of fish teaches?