Magic: The Gathering question

[Unicron]

I started playing in high school, and have periodically gone back to the game and added new stuff over the last ten years or so. Lately I've been thinking of buying some new additions, but after reading the changes made for 2010 I'm honestly not so sure. I've seen a lot of fallout regarding those from various players, and I kind of wonder how this would affect any future expansions (like the soon to be released Zendikar).

Has anyone played around with the 2010 sets and the new rules?

 

[Robert Maxwell]

Couldn't you just ignore the rules you don't like?

I mean, if you're not doing tourney play, and it's just among friends/family, you can agree on what rules you're discarding, no?

ETA: I just read through the new rules, and they all seem pretty sensible, to be honest. I can see some people being pissed about the elimination of mana burn, but the rest seems rather straightforward and I'm glad they're cleaning up the rules in this regard.

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

when I was learning I kept forgetting about mana burn, or didn't know what it was.

I enjoyed playing ten years ago, with friends who were at around my skill level. Sure by any real standard we all kinda sucked, but we could actually surprise each other with stuff.

The game started losing interest for me when it seemed that deck construction was mportant than the cool stuff in teh deck. that was bound to happen, but with that. it became all about heartless strategy where every card had too much of purpose and it was more mathematics than gameplay, and m,any kids who constructed flawless decks wore their arrogance on their sleeves. I lost interest overall, but once in a while I'll break out a deck and start playing. Overall the game is pointless.

Why would they get rid of mana burn?

 

[FordSVT]

The idea that anyone could be arrogant over a friggin' deck of cards boggles my mind.

Then again, some of the people I play WoW with aren't any better when it comes to their gear..... but I don't play with gear whores, they annoy me.

 

[Alidar Jarok]

The game started losing interest for me when it seemed that deck construction was mportant than the cool stuff in teh deck. that was bound to happen, but with that. it became all about heartless strategy where every card had too much of purpose and it was more mathematics than gameplay, and m,any kids who constructed flawless decks wore their arrogance on their sleeves. I lost interest overall, but once in a while I'll break out a deck and start playing. Overall the game is pointless.

I never played M:TG, but I did play their Pokemon trading card game (I will accept any scorn people wish to give me). For me, I enjoyed playing it, but other people would be very serious and plan out great decks with perfect strategies. To me, the theory of a perfect deck was great (there were only 60 cards allowed, so you had to pick and choose carefully), but I only thought about it in theory. In order to have a perfect deck, I would have to buy probably a thousand or more cards. I simply didn't have the money for that. Once I realized that this fact separated me from people who were good at it, I lost all interest.

 

[Bishbot]

I started playing in high school, and have periodically gone back to the game and added new stuff over the last ten years or so. Lately I've been thinking of buying some new additions, but after reading the changes made for 2010 I'm honestly not so sure. I've seen a lot of fallout regarding those from various players, and I kind of wonder how this would affect any future expansions (like the soon to be released Zendikar).

Has anyone played around with the 2010 sets and the new rules?

I went to the pre-release. Although there're a lot of terminology changes there really aren't many rules changes. Combat works differently - combat damage no longer goes on the stack - but depending on how long ago high school was for you it might not be much different to how you remember.

Magic 2010 is fun and accessible. I also don't have the time, money or inclination to go all out in deck construction which is why I love sealed deck tournaments. No-one knows what they're going to open and the surprise is still there. It's not even THAT expensive if you consider it as a day's entertainment.

 

[DonIago]

I'm with Tuln. I saw my circle of Magic friends get progressively more focused on 'the perfect deck' and it just lost its appeal for me.

Granted I bought an entire box of Chronicles back in the old days, but I still didn't get every card, and I -never- bought specific cards. Nor would I. Trade for them sure, but not buy.

 

[LitmusDragon]

World of Warcraft has kind of taken the place of MTG as my hobby of choice. I don't have time for both.

Having said that if there were no WoW I'm sure I'd still be playing MTG, it's a great game and a lot of fun because it's constantly changing.

The online version was great too until they screwed up the client with the 3.0 version. This is another reason I left for WoW.

 

[Unicron]

It's been my impression that the mana burn change has drawn more ire from players who like Limited format, which makes sense since it's a smaller system than Constructed. Which is what I like.

Robert, to answer your question - and I may just stick to the familiar system I'm used to, introduced with 6th Edition - my main concern is how the changes to the combat system will affect both the training of the game (I'm hoping to teach a friend of mine over the weekend, old school, and if she enjoys it enough to play regularly, she may have issues with people who prefer the modified system) and the combat system.

I'll admit that I'm not huge on any of the combat changes - taking them off the stack to the declare blockers phase doesn't seem all that practical to me, because the stack is most useful for combat. Certainly there is something to the WotC view that some tactics are "unintuitive," but I think that matters less than allowing creative strategies and fun. If I want my attackers to only deal a little damage so I can kill all the blockers with a big fireball, I'd like to do so. If the defender wants to foil one of my strong creatures with a Giant Growth or something on his creatures, that works for me too.

I also don't see the logic behind the new way of assigning damage to blocking creatures, because I see no reason why an attacker should have to waste extra damage to kill the first blocker instead of its controller being able to divide damage and then follow through with something else. Some players have argued that the older system tends to be more biased towards the attacking player, but in my experience I wouldn't call it unbalanced or broken. The attacker might have the initiative on their turn, but the defender still has plenty of options (spells, abilities etc.) besides their creatures.

 

[Mooch]

Granted I bought an entire box of Chronicles back in the old days, but I still didn't get every card, and I -never- bought specific cards. Nor would I. Trade for them sure, but not buy.

I just bought a box of Chronicles last week.

 

[DonIago]

Gimme gimme gimme!!! (laughs)

 

[Unicron]

I've very rarely bought specific cards, though I do have Timmy, Power Gamer from Unglued. He's actually useful even though he wouldn't be a legal card in many formats (he allows you to play any creature from your hand for 4 colorless mana, and therefore can make it easier to play big expensive creatures. He's green, so that's one reason I bought him). My local comic place has some nice random assortments of cards that you can buy from various sets. I used some of those when I was building up my collection.

 

[bigdaddy]

I forgot what mana burn is, is it when you leave a land tapped when it shouldn't be?

 

[DonIago]

Right. Well, more accurately, any mana you call on (usually but not exclusively by tapping land) and then don't use.

 

[Unicron]

Yep. While I can see where the mana burn mechanic would have some real value in Limited format, it hardly seems to occur often enough in others like Constructed to be of any strategic value.

 

[Unicron]

Bought some stuff from Zendikar today, along with some mixed cards from various sets. My local comic place runs some nice deals on those. Now I'll have to see how it works with my existing collection.

 

[ALF]

MTG can be extremely expensive. But if you are only playing casual as another poster suggested, why not build some decks with proxies?

Get some sleeves for your deck and put the common cards in. Print out the rare cards you need on some thin but HQ paper (some people write with black sharpies all over cards what the proxy is and it looks disgusting. plus it helps to have the real card reference) and test it out with your opponents. You can tweak the deck to how you like it, and then if you find a pile of cash, you can buy the proxies that you want for real.

I did just that perfecting my mono red elementals deck... but I'm hard pressed to shell out $200+ replacing my Mutavaults with real cards. Since I'm not competing in tournaments, who cares? I was also able to replicate a Kithkin white aggro and Fae deck just to see what it's like playing with them, since they are still very strong on the pro circuit. Of course, using those super powered decks against my buddies isn't very sportsmenlike so I defer to other decks... although a friend of mine likes dueling me against those power decks to make sure his deck built with commons/uncommons can stand up to it.

The beauty of MTG as opposed to other CCG's is that, yes, even though expensive cards are powerful, it's ultimately the LUCK OF THE DRAW and the PLAYER'S CHOICES that determine the outcome. It should never be one sided. The first time I drafted (with Morningtide/Lorwyn) I actually defeated my opponent who is a waaay better player than me because I had Incendiary Command and he blew his hand placing a bunch on weenies on the board. After that I realized expensive cards and experience only count for part of the game. And that's a plus.

Proxies: I practiced it a lot and perfected my technique. With the right paper and cutting I had a couple of buddies fooled for a minute over a Black Lotus I created. But they don't have to look perfect... just enough for you to build the right deck at no cost. Standard and type II decks can cost a fortune. You can blow up to $500 on your mana base alone.

BTW, a couple of my friends found playing with SINGLE BOOSTERS quite a lot of fun. You have some land nearby (you'll need 2-3 of each basic land at least) one each player opens just ONE pack, apply the lands as needed and go at it using only the cards from your booster. You end up playing cards you never thought you'd like... it's cheap and fun and generally the games aren't too fast so you can cast stuff that's normally difficult to resolve. Give it a try.

Bought some stuff from Zendikar today, along with some mixed cards from various sets. My local comic place runs some nice deals on those. Now I'll have to see how it works with my existing collection.

Did you get a Lotus Cobra??

 

[Unicron]

I haven't seen that one yet, but I wasn't able to get the new white and black decks for Zendikar. They were sold out due to the Magic tournament they were hosting today. I hope to have them this week though.

I tend to agree with you about the range of customization in terms of buying; I probably buy cards only once in a blue moon, and rarely bought whole blocks, and I typically buy between 350-500 cards. That's one of each main deck, 4 boosters from the expansion (equivalent to a fifth regular deck) and anything else I might be interested in. Usually that's only about $40-50 dollars max, and I only spent more than that today cause I bought the mixed cards at $5 each for about 60-80 cards.

I've always been more of a Constructed player than Limited; while Limited certainly has a greater emphasis on the strategy aspect, I'm less comfortable just opening a couple of boosters and cobbling something together from those, versus building a traditional 60-card deck built around a specific set of mechanics. billcosby, if you're interested, I put together a nice mono white deck that I've always liked. It was built around the threshold mechanic, which was new when it was originally built, and is pretty versatile. If played correctly it can overcome some of white's deficiencies, like having weaker creatures. PM me if you'd like details.

 

[bigdaddy]

Magic gives out a free deck to people every once and awhile. I got a free red and green 60 card deck from them in the spring.

 

[FPAlpha]

I just know that apparently Magic is still hugely popular and that it keeps my gamestore in business.

Most fridays he has Magic tournaments and last Friday was the release of a new expansion which had the store packed full and every few minutes someone came up and bought a booster display.

I only wish Legend of the 5 Rings (my CCG of choice) was this popular