Love and the joined Trill

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Deep Space Nine' started by borgboy, Nov 30, 2013.

  1. borgboy

    borgboy Commodore Commodore

    Sep 3, 2005
    I'm carrying over a conversation started in the ENT about the DS9/TNG crossover comic Divided We Fall, which focused on the Trills. So SPOILERS for Divided We Fall

    Odan started out as the same blonde female host, they just drew her with spots instead of the funny forehead. By the end of the comic though the female host is dead and Odan has a new male host, and the comic ends with a good bye kiss from the male host and Beverly the moment she first sees the newly joined Trill. Overall it's a good story, but given the gay subtext, if you can even call it subtext, I think it's kind of iffy on what I think of killing the female host and getting a hetero kiss at the end.
    It's also kind of interesting how it seems that Beverly loves the symbiote and not specificaly the hosts. It does make me re-evaluate what we see of joined Trill romances. Did Worf, and Julian, love Jadzia/Ezri or Dax? Given the carry over of feelings between that, and the forbidden relationship with Dax and Khan, that does imply if not just outright establish that love with a joined Trill can carry over to another host.
    Which does make me think how interesting it could've been if Dax's new host had been a male instead of Ezri. I like Ezri, don't get me wrong, and the show needed another female lead with Jadzia gone, I just think there's an interesting story there that wasn't told.

    Mild SPOILERS for the Mirror Universe novels

    On a side note, I can't remember where this was discussed, but there has been debate over the status of the Dax symbiote in the Mirror Universe. I thought that Jadzia in the MU was still joined with Dax, but others say she wasn't. I thought that Sisko still called her Dax. I read a Memory Beta article on the MU Dax, only skimming thru the parts covering books I haven't read to limit too much spoiling, and it says that Curzon outlived Jadzia and that Jadzia never had the Dax symbiote. Any thoughts or info on that?
  2. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Vice Admiral Admiral

    Nov 20, 2012
    I got the definite impression MU Jadzia did not have the Dax symbiote.

    I think Worf's love was for Jadzia, because her aggression was what made her attractive to Worf and her aggression is clearly not a constant between hosts. Of course, when he banged Ezri it was all about Dax. I suppose she may have had some Troi appeal to him, but that's short lasting appeal for Worf.

    With Bashir it's a little more suspect because he pined for Jadzia for years before being interested in Ezri.

    And you definitely get the strong impression that the host is considered a greater individual than the host. It's kind of like the Tok'ra. The symbiants blend the personality of their hosts, they become very attached to their hosts, but in the end the symbiant takes precedence.
  3. borgboy

    borgboy Commodore Commodore

    Sep 3, 2005
    Curzon was pretty big into Klingon culture, so I could see him adding something to the mix that Worf liked. I do agree, that Worf was trying to make Ezri be Jadzia, and I can understand how someone would do that. In Worf's shoes I might have done the same thing. Having a lost loved one back even in an unusual way must be very tempting.
    I do like to think a big part of why he wanted Ezri was because of Jadzia and the Dax connection.
    I always wanted Julian with Jadzia, but I preferred Worf with Ezri. Jadzia was too enthralled by Klingon culture, she was it thru rose colored glasses, whereas Ezri had a more objective, well rounded opinion on that, and thus I think she could see Worf more as he really was.I think Jadzia had an idealistic view of Worf.
    I read somewhere recently that there had been an episode pitch that wasn't made, presumably in the early seasons by context, where Jadzia had to be temporarily seperated from Dax, and during that time Jadzia and Julian would fall in love, but it wouldn't work once she was re-joined. I really like that premise.
    I don't know about the importance. Jadzia, Ezri, and what we see and hear of Curzon, they all seem pretty different to each other, as do the other hosts. Everything we see and hear about all the Dax hosts really seem very different. Whereas it does seem like the Odan hosts, what little we see of them, even in comics to expand the story, they seem to be much more similar to each other. Maybe it's a difference in symbiotes, and some symbiotes, like Odan, dominate the host personality, while others like Dax, are more passive and let the hosts express their own personalities more.
  4. Merlanthe

    Merlanthe Commander Red Shirt

    Jun 10, 2012
    I would say that all of Daxs hosts are quite different form each other with the exception of Curzon and Jadzia.

    Both are into Klingon culture. Both like to party and play the field. Both act as confidants and providors of wisdom to Sisko. When i think of Jadzia and how her character was portrayed these are not only the defining personality traits that spring to mind but the only personality traits that spring to mind. They are also the same personality traits that jump to mind when i think of Curzon and what he was like. Going by the few flashbacks and Sisko/Dax's reminiscences Curzon Dax appeared to have been an older male version of Jadzia Dax.

    For me the only thing that really seems different apart form their gender was Jadzia's interest in Ferengi culture which didnt get developed as much as it could have especially after Worf showed up and she became even more Klingon focused.

    Whether this similarity in personality was simple coincidence or a case of Curzon, as the most recent of Dax's past hosts, being the one with the most influence over the current host is uncertain. After nine hosts its probably not a surprise that there would be two at least that are very similar personality wise.
  5. 2takesfrakes

    2takesfrakes Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Oct 13, 2013
    California, USA
    Ezri did seem to emphasize and uderscore the Curzon/Jadzia similarities, with her own uniqueness. Perhaps, Curzon and Jadzia are typical in terms of personality types who are trained, specifically, to become hosts ...
  6. AgentCoop

    AgentCoop Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Perhaps working with Sisko brought out more of Curzon's traits than Jadzia would otherwise have displayed.
  7. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Vice Admiral Admiral

    Nov 20, 2012
    When we hear about Joran though we find out just how much more Trill society values the symbiotes than the hosts. The symbiote commission would sacrifice the host for a 1% chance the symbiote won't survive.
  8. Pavonis

    Pavonis Commodore Commodore

    Apr 26, 2001
    Forbidden relationship between Dax and Khan? What? When did an Augment from the 20th Century show up in DS9? Am I missing an episode?
  9. Ríu ríu chíu

    Ríu ríu chíu Fleet Admiral Admiral

    May 10, 2005
    Mr. Laser Beam is in the visitor's bullpen
    ^ Kahn, not Khan.