InSight Probe Lands on Mars

Discussion in 'Science and Technology' started by Mysterion, Nov 26, 2018.

  1. Mysterion

    Mysterion Vice Admiral Admiral

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  2. feek61

    feek61 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Looking forward to some interesting data from Insight
     
  3. rahullak

    rahullak Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Oh yeah....time to see what lies beneath...
     
  4. Samurai8472

    Samurai8472 Admiral Admiral

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    The ice warriors won’t be too happy when they’re discovered
     
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  5. Ar-Pharazon

    Ar-Pharazon Admiral Premium Member

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    Time to unpack.

    Mars 1a.jpg
     
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  6. Santaman

    Santaman Vice Admiral Admiral

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  7. rhubarbodendron

    rhubarbodendron Vice Admiral Admiral

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    ^ on the one hand yes, but on the other it's a big step towards littering yet another ecosystem :(
    Is it morally right to spend all that money and energy on examining planets while in the time you need to read this post 10 people have starved to death?
     
  8. psCargile

    psCargile Captain Captain

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    Yes.

    And I'm snacking as I post.
     
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  9. rahullak

    rahullak Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Well, yes. The reason those 10 people are dying is not because of the paltry millions that are spent in exploring the solar system. It's because of politics, logistics, economics. If you took the money spent on this project and tried to make sure those 10 people didn't die, it wouldn't happen. Those people are still going to die, sadly, because the problems lie elsewhere.

    You might have a better case with reducing defense spending as that would hopefully cause de-escalation and improve trade relations.
     
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  10. rhubarbodendron

    rhubarbodendron Vice Admiral Admiral

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    good point but that'd propably require rather a lot of politicians being murdered first.. Sometimes I think problems should be solved like the pope election: locking up all participants and not letting them out until they have come to a compromise.

    From a professional POV as a biologist I am quite worried about these planetary missions. There is always the danger of contaminating an unsuspecting ecosystem. No desinfection ever works 100%, not even hard vacuum - there's always one germ or other organism that survives. Remember what a terrible impact the measles had on the indigenous American population or the Asian Flu on Central Europe in the 19th century? Or the crayfish plague fungus that killed more than 90% of the European crayfish population within a decade. And that was just one digit in a sytem, respectively. Imagine, what an alien infection could mean to a whole carefully balanced ecosystem.
    I'd be much happier if we'd only watch other worlds from a safe distance (safe for them, that is).
     
  11. Blip

    Blip Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    HAIL HYDRA! :D
     
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  12. USS Triumphant

    USS Triumphant Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I'd like to preface by saying that I'm not insensitive to concerns about contamination and other effects that the presence of humans or human artifacts might have on other planets. I've spent a lot of time thinking about it, honestly.

    But the conclusion I've come to is that, ultimately, these concerns are akin to concerns about human effects on Earth. Enlightened self-interest says that it makes sense to be as careful with our resources as possible. But an attitude that poo-poos humanity utterly might lead one to the conclusion that we are a scourge, and that these places would be better off without us at all.

    Well, screw that. We might be a scourge, but we're my scourge - all of the people I love or otherwise care about, our culture, our industry, all of it, are part of that scourge, and I'm not apologetic about them or me existing. Or trying to survive.

    We have finite resources on this planet. We *have* to go out there. Not only that, but us doing so is ultimately good for not only us, but for the survival of the life forms that we've made dependent on our existence (a lot of domesticated animals and to a lesser extent domesticated plants). And, at least for a while (after all, even the universe is finite), for all of the other life on Earth, if we can give them a bit of breathing room by taking our mess out to the stars.

    As I said, enlightened self-interest means we should do so carefully - it'd be a shame if we wiped out something really useful (like an organism with a natural cure for cancer) by being careless, and obviously a horrible thing if we accidentally wiped out something we didn't realize was self-aware, and a pity even if we just accidentally removed anything completely from the wonder and diversity of the universe.

    But we have a right to BE, and part of being us, for better or worse, is expansion.

    And if FTL travel turns out to be possible (I'm still doubtful, but we - humanity, probably not me - will see), then all of our concerns might be mooted, anyway, and it's all simply a race to see whether it's us *or some other intelligent life* that tampers with everything. In which case, I'd rather it be us. Sorry if that's selfish. But also, not sorry. ;)
     
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  13. XCV330

    XCV330 Premium Member

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    I would ask if you were joking, but it's clear you are not. It's a science package smaller than a car on a world that has less than 15 such things on the entire surface.. of it's planet. No.. it's NOT a big step towards littering another ecosystem. It's not even a little step. Because..

    In fact, it is almost certainly NOT an ecosystem. Find all these interacting life forms that Insight is harming? Cause that would be great. Also, you do realize that there are extreme measures taken on any ESA or NASA (edit.. said European or Mars lander.. landings on Europe seem pretty benign, apart from Swiss hang-glider training videos) lander to make certain it does not contaminate even a sterile world like Mars with foreign microorganisms?


    There are arguments back and forth on that. The ones on forth side are wrong. It's a knee jerk reaction and it's been going on since the 60's. Wasn't right then, isn't right now.

    If this money, which is a minuscule amount of funding, did not go into science, do you think it would magically wind up in a gigantic bag of food to the hungry? Yes, its appalling we have hunger in this day and age. Being a luddite will not imrove that, but technology can and WILL improve that.

    Even something as seemingly obtuse as studying a dead world like Mars (sorry.. I know you said ecosystem.. if it was an ecosystem we could harvest Barsoom's Mars Flakes and feed the world) can bring unexpected results. For instance, why DID the surface of Mars turn into a sterile desert. Desertification is a big problem on Earth. Humans loose, as you know, more and more land to desertification.
    Can anything be done to rectify it? Can those answers come from Mars? Can having very smart people dream and devise ways to turn Mars green have a more immediate effect on restoring some of that land?

    Our species is propelled by technology. It's a never ending race that can't be one by backing down. Yes, we eat too much, breed to fast (sometimes), leave a mess and leave a big dent wherever we walk, but that's who we are. The only way we've been able to survive as long as we have is by learning more and more so we can correct mistakes and thrive.
     
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  14. USS Triumphant

    USS Triumphant Vice Admiral Admiral

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    @XCV330 - Thanks for tackling the "the money could be used better than on science" part of all of that. I meant to, but got wound up in addressing the "should we even be out there" part. ;)

    I'll add, though, that perhaps those worried about how we allocate money and feeding the hungry and housing the homeless might do better to look at cost overruns on things like the F-35 project before crying about the pennies spent at NASA.
     
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  15. XCV330

    XCV330 Premium Member

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  16. publiusr

    publiusr Admiral Admiral

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    One of the larger landers since Viking.
     
  17. feek61

    feek61 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Oh brother! Yeah, sure, something smaller than a standard childs playset is going to damage the ecosystem of Mars!! This and your other comments are pretty absurd; just saying.
     
  18. publiusr

    publiusr Admiral Admiral

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    You don't want just any microbe dirty-ing things up.

    Ironically, I think a human mission is more responsible than robots.

    The rover I've seen has what could be called lock-out suits that always keep martian soil outside.

    It is very like hotzone level 4 suits.

    Wear disposible suits outside the main suit, and scrub everything down before moving towards brine filled regions, and discard outer suits under engine nozzles.
     
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  19. think

    think Like Spock Premium Member

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    [​IMG]

    anyway I like this image..

    [​IMG]
     
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  20. publiusr

    publiusr Admiral Admiral

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