If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show around?

[Aldo]

I started thinking this in the Jimmy Fallon thread on here, but I didn't want to take that one off topic.

I know one of the big reasons Conan was booted out was because Leno was second guessing retirement (and his primetime show was crashing and burning). But if Conan's Tonight Show was a ratings hit right out of the gate NBC might have passed on Leno coming back.

I suppose I'm just wondering why Conan couldn't keep the ratings up. He was a hit on Late Night, and by all accounts his TBS show seems to be a hit. Perhaps it was the fact that Conan was neutered because of the move to the earlier time slot?

I think Jimmy will do just fine with the Tonight Show, but I always wonder what would have happened had Conan not been booted out.

 

[davejames]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I don't really think more time would have made a difference. His quirky, oddball style was just never going to appeal to a mainstream audience, no matter how much they tried to simplify or dumb things down.

Fallon's style seems to be a bit more "approachable" for a mass audience, so he'll probably have a slightly easier time of it.

 

[Toxteth O´Grady]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I'm no expert on ratings and all of that stuff, but it always seemed to me that NBC didn't give Conan a fair shot. It's very possible that the ratings wouldn't have picked up seeing as how his audience was different from Leno's, but he had 3 years on his contract to try. Before his first year was even up, NBC decided to stir the pot by moving Conan back a half-hour so Leno could have his old timeslot back. The whole thing just seemed like a slap in the face to Conan to me.

 

[Timby]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I need to go back to all the numbers I pulled back when that whole thing happened, but I'm almost positive that Conan's ratings on The Tonight Show were actually better than Leno's when he took over Tonight (it took Leno almost a year to really get his numbers on an upward trend) -- but NBC's internal politics were such a cesspool back then that as soon as Leno's show cratered, the local affiliates revolted and Leno started whining about wanting Tonight back, Conan never had a chance.

 

[Kirby]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

^^
Conan joked towards the end of his Tonight Show run: "Remember kids, you can accomplish anything that you want to do... Unless Jay Leno wants it too."

Leno has some strange control over TPTB at NBC, he pulled something similar when Carson retired to get the Tonight Show in the first place. Something that Letterman really should have been given.

 

[J.T.B.]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I know one of the big reasons Conan was booted out was because Leno was second guessing retirement (and his primetime show was crashing and burning). But if Conan's Tonight Show was a ratings hit right out of the gate NBC might have passed on Leno coming back.

Conan's ratings were better than Leno's were in his first months. They didn't really start to tank until the disastrous lead-in of "The Jay Leno Show," which also knocked down ratings for the affiliates' local news all over the country. If NBC had stuck to its plan and just let Leno go for good, Conan would have settled into "Tonight" and been fine, just like he did at "Late Night" and Leno did at "Tonight."

 

[Vanyel]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

As I remember it, and I could be wrong about the length of time, but Letterman had Leno beat for the first 2-3 years before Leno took the lead for good.

 

[Aldo]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I know one of the big reasons Conan was booted out was because Leno was second guessing retirement (and his primetime show was crashing and burning). But if Conan's Tonight Show was a ratings hit right out of the gate NBC might have passed on Leno coming back.

Conan's ratings were better than Leno's were in his first months. They didn't really start to tank until the disastrous lead-in of "The Jay Leno Show,"

I recall hearing about that, how all the local news affiliates were losing ratings as well and that was what was affecting 'The Tonight Show.' People were changing the channel when Jay came on and didn't change back.

Also, I think Jay Leno moving to ten was indirectly responsible for a few cancellations of NBC dramas, one of my favorite shows: "Life" got canned since it was already on the bubble, and with Leno needing five nights a week, it was axed.

I never read anything to confirm that, but it always sounded like a likely story.

 

[Owain Taggart]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

Yeah, I think Conan was a victim of timing and politics. I think given the time, I think he could have been successful, but as it is, there was just too much going on behind the scenes and he never got a fair chance. Ironically enough, I think Conan would have faired better at Leno's new format.

 

[EmoBorg]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

As a fan of Conan for nearly 20 years, i do believe Conan could have turned things around if he had more time. We cannot ignore the fact that The Jay Leno Show, which was shown before The Tonight Show with Conan O'Brien, had poor ratings and that caused a knock on effect. I used to have a lot of respect for Leno but now days i don't watch his shows anymore because of what he did to Conan.

 

[Agent Richard07]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I'm disappointed that we didn't get a sequel to The Late Shift. Daniel Roebuck could have reprised his role as Jay Leno.

And how does Leno feel about retiring now? I didn't realize that his time would be up this February.

 

[Amasov]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I don't even think it was so much his style of humor, but more NBC wanting a younger audience in that timeslot. I'm still convinced that the whole reason Jimmy Fallon being given the Tonight Show is more a response to Kimmel moving up to 11.30 and the network wanting to compete with a younger host.

Fallon's humor is pretty quirky and nearly in the same vein as Conan's, if you ask me.

Conan should've taken the Tonight Show to 12.00 and then when Jay's abbreviated (and pathetically lame) show crashed and burned at 11.30, PERHAPS, he'd be gone for good and The Tonight Show could've moved back to 11.30.

 

[Timby]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I'm disappointed that we didn't get a sequel to The Late Shift. Daniel Roebuck could have reprised his role as Jay Leno.

And how does Leno feel about retiring now? I didn't realize that his time would be up this February.

There's no film adaptation, but The War for Late Night is Bill Carter's sequel to The Late Shift, and it covers the Conan / Leno brouhaha. Excellent read.

And Leno isn't any happier about this forced retirement than he was about the last one, but NBC seems to be in this for the long haul, given that they're allowing Fallon to remain in New York, they're keeping The Roots, and they're dumping several million dollars into renovating Studio 6B for the show.

I don't even think it was so much his style of humor, but more NBC wanting a younger audience in that timeslot. I'm still convinced that the whole reason Jimmy Fallon being given the Tonight Show is more a response to Kimmel moving up to 11.30 and the network wanting to compete with a younger host.

There's nothing to be convinced about, that's pretty much black-letter fact. Kimmel was moved to 11:30, and Leno's already weak numbers in 18 - 49 started getting even worse, which resulted in NBC making the move.

Conan should've taken the Tonight Show to 12.00 and then when Jay's abbreviated (and pathetically lame) show crashed and burned at 11.30, PERHAPS, he'd be gone for good and The Tonight Show could've moved back to 11.30.

The madness of having a show called "Tonight" starting the next day on the east coast aside, the endgame all along was for Leno to get Tonight back at 11:35. Either Conan's numbers at midnight would have been terrible because of the Leno lead-in, which would have resulted in Conan getting sacked and Leno's show becoming Tonight, or Conan would have quit rather than go to 12:05 and Leno would have gotten Tonight (which is what actually happened).

 

[Amasov]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfdFJSDFedk[/yt]

 

[Galileo7]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

Yes.

 

[J.T.B.]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I used to have a lot of respect for Leno but now days i don't watch his shows anymore because of what he did to Conan.

I haven't respected Leno since the 1992 debacle. Jay Leno wouldn't have a career if it wasn't for David Letterman. Leno had done OK on his "The Tonight Show" appearances but Carson didn't like him and didn't want him on much. Letterman OTOH had Leno on his show all the time in the '80s; at least monthly, it seemed like, and he built a solid, young following from those spots. When Joan Rivers dumped her "Tonight" guest host gig for her own show, Letterman appealed personally to Carson to get Leno one of the two guest-host spots. The other, Garry Shandling, soon dropped out to work on his own show, leaving Leno as the sole guest host.

So when "Tonight" came open and Letterman wanted the job, did Leno show any respect or gratitude for his old friend and step aside? No, he and his whack-job of an agent played dirty, threatened, manipulated, threw tantrums and every other cutthroat move they could employ to get him the "Tonight" spot.

The madness of having a show called "Tonight" starting the next day on the east coast aside, the endgame all along was for Leno to get Tonight back at 11:35.

Also, Conan's position was "The Tonight Show" was the premier late night talk show and had defined 11:30 for half a century; changing that over a personnel issue would be a disservice to the show's heritage and legacy.

 

[Yoda]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I don't think that sanctity of whether the Tonight Show airs before or after midnight is much of a real issue. If they for some reason just decided to add another 30 minutes to local news or something, I doubt Conan would've left. It's not about when the Tonight Show airs, it's about Leno pushing him out of his timeslot. It sounds good to talk about the heritage of the show and all that, bu the simpler explanation is the massive egos that these guys all have. Besides, these motherfuckers are going to tape the show at the exact same time anyway, it literally makes no difference to them. It's not like they sit down at 11:35 to watch their own shows

I also kind of doubt that leaving in protest was ever Conan's plan. He probably thought he could hold his timeslot and push Leno out completely. After all NBC had made that promise as part of his last Late Night contract.

As for whether Conan could have turned around his Tonight Show? I don't know. It seemed like his ratings were decent. Falling behind Letterman a bit in the grand scheme of things is a pretty temporary problem.

I do think that Conan probably hates being out of the game, essentially sidelined on TBS not even competing with the other hosts. It would have been super interesting if he had went back to being the post-Leno guy... would that mean that now both Leno and Conan would be getting pushed out for a Fallon Tonight Show returning to its old timeslot?

 

[Mr Light]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

I watch TBS-Conan regularly and he seems quite happy where he is, able to do his raunchy insanity rather than trying to PG it like he had to do on the Tonight Show.

 

[Yoda]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

Well, it's just speculation. And he's a professional. I'm not saying he doesn't enjoy his TBS show. But he does occasionally throw out a self-aware joke about being on basic cable, or that nobody is watching.

I just snagged that War for Late Night book that Timby recommended on my Kindle. Really looking forward to reading it.

 

[Amaris]

Re: If Conan had more time, would he have turned his Tonight Show arou

Well, it's just speculation. And he's a professional. I'm not saying he doesn't enjoy his TBS show. But he does occasionally throw out a self-aware joke about being on basic cable, or that nobody is watching.

I just snagged that War for Late Night book that Timby recommended on my Kindle. Really looking forward to reading it.

To be fair, though, Conan's really well known for his self-deprecating humor. There might be a kernel of truth in there, but I do think he's happy being on TBS. At least there he has all of his own rights.