I just noticed Kirk got kicked in the balls by Finnegan.

Discussion in 'Star Trek - The Original & Animated Series' started by Jayson1, Sep 15, 2018 at 8:28 PM.

  1. Jayson1

    Jayson1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I just got done watching "Shore Leave" again, literally a few minutes ago and I noticed this. When Finnegan is pretending Kirk has broke his back and Kirk puts his hand out to pull him up he kicks Kirk. You then cut to Kirk react in pain but you never see the kick land or show the power part of his body. When they then cut to the longshot his foot is basically in that area. Granted they wouldn't show that on tv in the 60's so it's implied but I think it's true. Am I the only one who has noticed this? It's kind of neat whenever you spot these things you never noticed before in old shows or movies you have seen many times. I don't know how many times I have seen this episode but I am guessing it's quite alot so I don't know how I never noticed it before.

    Jason
     
  2. Mr. Laser Beam

    Mr. Laser Beam Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The thing with Finnegan that always bothered me was, why didn't Kirk report him to the Academy brass?

    Granted, Kirk couldn't have actually fought back, but surely he could have filed a report with the superintendent or something. (Especially if Finnegan's constant harassment was making it difficult for Kirk to complete his studies.) I mean, there had to have been plenty of opportunities for Kirk to slip away unnoticed and visit the superintendent's office - it's not like Finnegan was watching Kirk 24/7, amirite?

    So Kirk files a complaint, at best is reassigned another roommate (or at worst, Finnegan is put on suspension or even expelled). That should have been the end of it.

    This isn't the bloody VMI or anything like that. Finnegan's antics aren't supposed to be standard for Academy plebes. There should have been a way for somebody to stop him.
     
  3. urbandefault

    urbandefault Commodore Commodore

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    When I was growing up, a man handled a bully on his own. ;)
     
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  4. Commishsleer

    Commishsleer Commodore Commodore

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    Sadly in my daughter';s school the nine-year olds are still expected to handle bullies on their own.
    From whats been reported in the press here in Australia , male cadets are able to bully and intimidate female recruits with very little repercussions from a military or political perspective. The female recruits leave in shame while the male recruits get a slap on the wrist.
    We'd hope that by Kirk's time we'd get a little better in dealing with bullies.
     
  5. GNDN18

    GNDN18 Turbulent! Turgid! Tempestuous! Premium Member

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    Given that Sturgeon was born in 1918, served in the Merchant Marines, and worked with the US Army, it’s plausible that he would have thought of Starfleet Academy as being quite similar to West Point or, as you say, VMI.

    Here’s Gold Key’s take on Mr. Midshipman Cadet Kirk’s response to hazing:
    FB93447F-B55F-46D2-A8F0-9CA70DD54263.jpeg
    25612CD0-F7D9-4E54-B34C-2611FF5FC6AE.jpeg
     
  6. Shawnster

    Shawnster Commodore Commodore

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    Sure, Finnegan was a bully who harassed Kirk, but was he as bad as Kirk remembers? These illusions /fantasies /whatever are drawn from the minds of the participants. It's their memories that are the basis of the encounter. Heck, Sulu's revolver fired 7 shots.

    These recreations are not 100% accurate.
     
  7. T'Bonz

    T'Bonz Romulan Curmudgeon Administrator

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    The only way to handle a bully for a man is to beat his ass. Same could apply to a woman handling a bully, but for the most part, you have to do it verbally. If you turn her words on herself and can get others to laugh at her, she'll back off and find other prey.

    Now the problem for young males today is the super strict no fighting. If someone clocks you, and you dare to fight back, suspension for you both!

    Schools have never protected a victim. Not in my time, and not today. You were on your own. And now males have no weapons against the bastards.

    Bonz, who learned to make bullies very sorry if they fucked with me. Not fighting - I sucked at that. But I used to be able to verbally slice someone into ribbons. I'm so tame now.
     
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  8. Jayson1

    Jayson1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Only real issue with fighting bullies today from the past is they can very well also be carrying a gun or knife. That is why I would be nervous with fighting. It was different when I was young. In fact in junior high I had a couple of years were I was the bully, twice. I had alot of difficult things going in my life and I hit two of my friends in two seprate situations over nonsense. In school and once in class. Basically the teacher just stopped it and that was it. Hell it didn't even stop me from still being friends with those people. I guess that doesn't count as bullying though and more of just two fights that were barely fights. For some reason I never encountered real bullies were you got people are always picking on you.

    Jason
     
  9. Pauln6

    Pauln6 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    It's no worse than what Kirk did to the Gorn captain . Not everyone has their genitals in the same place...
     
  10. Jayson1

    Jayson1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Of course this Finnegan is from his imagination. Perhaps deep down Kirk is depressed and hating himself which comes forth through him getting his butt kicked in fist fight. Maybe deep down he wished his romance with Ruth had lasted longer and he stayed with her instead of going into Starfleet so both people were sort of dealing with the issues in his mind. I'm also sure Finnegan also showed up again to beat him up alot while he was in the Nexus having the same issue only this time it was with Antonia.


    Jason
     
  11. Marsden

    Marsden Commodore Commodore

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    I think this is very important, these are "idealized" versions of these individuals based on memories only, they were caricatures rather than full people.

    Also:
    KIRK: I'm not a plebe. This is today, fifteen years later. What are you doing here?
    FINNEGAN: I'm being exactly what you expect me to be, Jimmy boy.
     
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  12. mos6507

    mos6507 Commodore Commodore

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    I don't interpret Finnegan as a bully. As strange as it may seem, Kirk seems pretty happy to see him again. I think he represents a sort of hyper-masculine ideal of having a pointless fist-fight over nothing one moment and catching a pint together the next. Rough-housing. It's this:



    The verbal ribbing Finnegan gives is more friendly ballbusting. It's not the sort of scene you'd see play out today because it emphasizes the Irish hothead stereotype and fosters the idea that fighting is a healthy "boys will be boys" flavor of masculinity.
     
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  13. Phaser Two

    Phaser Two Captain Captain

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    Finnegan was clearly an idealized version. An amusement park where the attractions were kind of lame wouldn't be a big intergalactic draw IMO.
     
  14. Jayson1

    Jayson1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I don't think I see them a friends but really not as enemies either. More like frienemies. Maybe he kind of liked him a little but also found him really annoying most of the time and maybe it wasn't him trying to get even so much as recapture a feeling from his youth because he was feeling kind of nostogic to the past thinking of easier times before he had the pressure of being a Starfleet captain. It's also possible Finnegan got himself killed years later so he also knows he will never be able to resolve any feelings with the guy in real life.

    Jason
     
  15. Marsden

    Marsden Commodore Commodore

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    Certain stimuli can be a strong reminder of a past time person's life and if it was a cherished time then it could be a pleasurable feeling even if the reminder itself isn't. I think seeing Finnegan again reminded him of the Academy, how couldn't it? I think that was probably a good time of Kirk's life, at least in Kirk's opinion of his memories. What if he saw Janice Lester, that would certainly bring up bad feelings. This happens to people all the time, a scent, a song, many things can trigger these feelings and I think the Shore Leave Planet builders were somewhat counting on that, bringing back good memories and having an enjoyable break from day to day life. It's not their fault these new people keep thinking about bad stuff.
     
  16. JonnyQuest037

    JonnyQuest037 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    And don 't forget that Ruth was exactly the woman that Kirk remembered from his Academy days, not the woman she would've been in the present day.

    "Ruth, how can it be you? How could you possibly be here? You haven't aged. It's been fifteen years."
     
  17. JonnyQuest037

    JonnyQuest037 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I really like those Academy uniforms. Those are sharp.
     
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  18. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Well observed; Finnegan generated as many smiles as any other expression of emotion from Kirk; if he was a true enemy, Kirk would have approached the situation with an entirely different (and darker) mindset. Instead, it was a chance to settle a score with his personal half tormentor, half friend.
     
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  19. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Ah, the Alden McWilliams additions to The Enterprise Logs TPBs. Fun stuff, and interesting how Gold Key became more canon-conscious (meaning using characters seen or mentioned on TOS) toward the end of their run with the property.
     
  20. Green

    Green Commander Red Shirt

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    Lazarus clearly kneed the transporter officer in the groin.