How William Shatner Changed the World and DS9

[Nobody]

So I'm watching "How William Shatner Changed the World" and found their summary and comparison of new Trek -- especially DS9 to TOS. It blames the failure of the show on the fact it portrayed technology as not inherently good and something that should be feared. It's a little slanted and narrow minded critique of the show's rating problems.

While DS9 was certainly darker than any other Trek -- I think it's a little unfair to blame it's ratings problem on a negative portrayal of technology. Especially since there were plenty positive portrayals of technology on the show. If anything it showed technology as morally neutral and depending on the user whether it was good or bad. Even TOS portrayed technology this way, Federation always used their technology for good, while there enemies always used their technology for ill.

It was an interesting show, nonetheless, but I found it's little DS9 segment a little biased and ignoring the aspects that made the show great -- the character relationships and the political intrigue. Anyone else able to catch this show? Was it a fair critique of DS9's shortcomings or just full of crap? I'm assuming that since this is a DS9 forum I'll get a lot of full of crap answers, but was anyone put off by their portrayal of technology?

-nobody

 

[MacLeod]

But technology is not inherently good. Technology quite often is neutral and it is how it is used that determines whether it is good or not.

 

[Nobody]

I agree with you completely -- which is why I found it odd that the documentary attributed DS9's ratings problem to it's negative portrayal of technology. It attributed the success of the franchise to it's cool technology. Which is a draw -- who doesn't want their own transporter? Or to travel in space at warp speed? To attribute that as the main reason for Trek's success seems to be a rather simplistic view.

-nobody

 

[MacLeod]

You could argue the point that DSN showed us in part what happens when technology is used for selfish ideology such as the Cardassains. They used technology to serve their own needs, used it strip mine planets they conqured in order to fed their war machine etc.. And look where it led them.

 

[Computer]

Im a TNG loyalist and a good reason why is because I was able to watch TNG at 7pm on a standard schedule with little to no changes by the network.

DS9 had no such luck, for what I did see of it, it was a very good show but got short changed considering id have to be up at 11pm on a Friday or 1am on a Wednesday and that was only dependent on if there were no sports on.

Technology really had little to no effect on DS9 ratings.

 

[scottydog]

DS9's portrayal of technology had nothing to do with either its success or its shortcomings. What an odd thing to emphasize when so many other more reasonable (and interesting) issues could be covered.

 

[-Brett-]

DS9 lasted a full seven years. That's hardly what I consider a failure.

Also, I don't see how it portrayed technology as inherently evil. They were flying around in sophisticated space ships. Half of the characters, including the show's lead, had a science or engineering background.

 

[AdmiralGarak]

It was just a bunch of "I'm better than those losers!" posturing from Shatner. I've heard a lot of complaints about DS9-- many valid, but this one is a joke. Nobody has ever made the claim.

 

[Saxman1]

Computer said:
Im a TNG loyalist and a good reason why is because I was able to watch TNG at 7pm on a standard schedule with little to no changes by the network.

DS9 had no such luck, for what I did see of it, it was a very good show but got short changed considering id have to be up at 11pm on a Friday or 1am on a Wednesday and that was only dependent on if there were no sports on.

Technology really had little to no effect on DS9 ratings.

I love both shows, but I too fell off the DS9 wagon due to the same reasons. I live a SW Chicago suburb and the show was endlessly pre-empted by Cubs baseball or Bulls basketball. Often the eps weren't even shown when the make-up slots were announced. WGN treated the show like an after-thought from the get-go.

Interestingly enough, Paramount didn't want WGN to have the show, as they knew that's what would happen. Either WGN did take them to court or threatened to, Paramount blinked and unfortunately the show was treated as feared. WGN's argument was creation of a monopoly (giving the show to the same station that had TNG!) which is ironic coming from THAT media superpower which owns a newspaper, the Cubs and it's TV outlet, a radio station, etc., which was highly unusual at the time.

 

[PKTrekGirl]

^ I can relate to this complaint as well. I live in Atlanta, and finding DS9 each week was a major chore - if it was possible at all. Even in reruns in the middle of the night on our local CBS affiliate, it was difficult to count on, because every time a prime time sports show went overtime, DS9, which came on 4 time slots later, ended up suffering by getting the beginning pre-empted.

There was one episode that, despite my best attempts, I never even SAW until the DVDs came out. And several others that I'd only seen part of.

Meanwhile, TNG was coming on at 9 pm on Saturday night, like clockwork.

 

[Good Will Riker]

Saxman1 said:

Computer said:
Im a TNG loyalist and a good reason why is because I was able to watch TNG at 7pm on a standard schedule with little to no changes by the network.

DS9 had no such luck, for what I did see of it, it was a very good show but got short changed considering id have to be up at 11pm on a Friday or 1am on a Wednesday and that was only dependent on if there were no sports on.

Technology really had little to no effect on DS9 ratings.

I love both shows, but I too fell off the DS9 wagon due to the same reasons. I live a SW Chicago suburb and the show was endlessly pre-empted by Cubs baseball or Bulls basketball. Often the eps weren't even shown when the make-up slots were announced. WGN treated the show like an after-thought from the get-go.

Interestingly enough, Paramount didn't want WGN to have the show, as they knew that's what would happen. Either WGN did take them to court or threatened to, Paramount blinked and unfortunately the show was treated as feared. WGN's argument was creation of a monopoly (giving the show to the same station that had TNG!) which is ironic coming from THAT media superpower which owns a newspaper, the Cubs and it's TV outlet, a radio station, etc., which was highly unusual at the time.

The first night WGN aired "The Search, Part I" in 1994, there was a technical error right after the Female Changeling told Odo "Welcome home," and then it rewound to the point where Odo first discovers the Great Link and then played it again until the end credits. I still have it pre-recorded on VHS in a box in the garage (Recently moved there with the other VHS to make more room on my shelf for my DVDs.).

 

[MacLeod]

Never had that problem in the UK, as the way to see it first was not on TV, but Video.

 

[PKTrekGirl]

^ You mean it wasn't even on TV in the UK? You had to rent/buy videos just to see it?

 

[MacLeod]

The Video releases where ahead of the TV airings.

 

[toughlittleship]

Sky were pretty good to DS9. They had promos for the coming episode running throughout the week.

 

[The Grim Ghost]

I thought it was pretty much presented as "TOS and TNG ruled". DS9 and Voyager were kinda lame. And Enterprise sucked. Pretty unfair imo, (except I agree about Enterprise).

 

[Nobody]

It was more "Roddenberry Trek rocks, post-Roddenberry sucks!" (including TNG) -- which I agree was unfair, even if I'm not a big fan of Voyager or Enterprise.

I guess I'm lucky that there were never any big scheduling problem with DS9. Except for the 6 episode arc in season 6, which I caught up on thanks to Spike's marathons. I really need to invest in the DVDs.

-nobody