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How Much of the Enterprise Was Inspired by Roddenberry's Bomber Flying

CuttingEdge100

Commodore
Commodore
I'm just wondering because in a way the USS Enterprise has characteristics in a way of being both a ship and a plane in some respects.

Additionally, Gene Roddenberry flew B-17's in WW2 and it was a large heavily turreted aircraft which was originally designed around the idea of not needing any escort or anything of that nature (turns out that was quite stupid, but I digress).

The Enterprise has no fighters or deployable escorts other than a few shuttles which can do little more than land on planets or act like manned probes -- truthfully though the Enterprise was designed as an exploratory vessel that could do battle superbly if needed.

The phaser-banks are kind of turret like (though this would be more extreme in TMP-TUC) and the coverage even in TOS included the top, bottom, side, and rear (Captain Kirk did make reference to the ship having "Midship Phasers", there was a phaser on the aft section of the ship) though truthfully the Enterprise's rear, and rear/flank coverage was a bit poor.
 
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Finney "dying" in the ion pod is like getting cut loose while still inside a ball turret.
 
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because in a way the USS Enterprise has characteristics in a way of being both a ship and a plane in some respects.
Being a spacecraft, the Enterprise was neither a ship, nor a plane. Owing to the fact she moved through a three dimensional environment I guess she would, regardless of her size, be more aircraft.

:):):)
 
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But in functionality, more like a ship.

Factor in the three dimensional aspect, along with the hazardous environment outside the hull, more akin to a submarine. :D
 
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Well, I suppose he put plenty of women on the ship due to the lack of them in the B-17.
 
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Okay, what does an Officer of the Deck do in a real ship?
 
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Nerys Myk

What bridge officers in ST would make good OOD's?
 
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i think closest you can get is life on a submarine though instead of 3 or 6 month tours, you do 5 year tours (and never get promoted and stay at communications for 30 years)

the starships with their large crews and work/living space on trek on more like sea ships which if nuclear powered can stay at sea indefinitely (ignoring food supplies) as opposed to airplanes with 2 or 3 man crews that need constant attention to detail while in flight and immediate ground maintenance after every flight

only thing the ships on star trek have in common with aircraft it that they both can travel in 3 dimensions

so i think star trek was much more inspired by boats than aircraft, even before Wrath of Khan which greatly gave the franchise a naval atmosphere

i think we have to keep in mind starfleet and spaceship operations cannot be realistically compared to 20/early 21st century militaries, expect for some nautical traditions and naming that starfleet borrowed as a nod to earth sea exploration days.
 
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The Starships of TOS clearly hold the strategic place within the fleet of aircraft carriers in WWII (hence the names -- almost all of them American or British carriers). While the context may have been Hornblower, the routine as depicted was very much WWII navy- something most of the viewing public of the time could relate to.
 
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What bridge officers in ST would make good OOD's?
When Kirk would tell someone like Sulu "You have the conn," he was designating them the OOD. Kirk's informal "Mind the store," was similar.
:)
 
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So, if Spock was on the bridge, being that he's also the XO, he's the OOD. If him and Kirk leave, then either Sulu or Scotty become OOD?
 
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When this guy is on the bridge he's OOD.

ood1.jpg
 
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Plenty of aviation inspiration. just off the top of my head...
-the bridge is an expanded cockpit, with pilot and co-pilot sitting up front, and radio operator and flight engineer to either side behind.
-the PH is a round wing, with red and green lights out on the "wingtips," and unit markings underneath.
-the deflector is an aircraft's radar. MJ even considered having it enclosed at one point.
-the clam-shell doors look like nothing on any Navy ship and a lot like Hangar One at Moffett Field in CA, USA.
-the nacelles carry details that suggest the protruding pipes, cowling features, and spinning propellers found on the aforementioned B-17's engines.
-the enterprise is pinstriped up like an airplane, complete with an aviation-inspired hull number.
 
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In which case, we should be asking how much of the Enterprise was inspired by Matt Jefferies' B-17...
 
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Well MJ was designing and GR was approving so it makes sense that they would move toward that common experience, even if it were on a subconscious level.
 
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To me, it seems fairly clear that TOS owes more to Forester's Horatio Hornblower novels than anything else. It's more apparent in the first season than later ones, because they'd learned from experience that a direct correlation wasn't dramatic enough.

Take the battle sequence in "Balance Of Terror." This is clearly analogous to a surface vessel fighting a submarine, but the battle on the Enterprise plays like an sailing ship-of-the-line. Kirk orders Styles (the bridge weapons officer) to fire phasers. Styles orders the phaser gun crew down in the control room to fire. A senior NCO gives the crew another order to fire.

This is basically how naval battles with sailing ships operated. An individual gun was manned by a team of two or three. This team was supervised by a petty officer or midshipman. The PO/midshipman answered to a gunnery officer, and he answered to the Captain. When going into battle, the Captain would order the gunnery officer to make ready to fire the starboard guns, often giving explicit instructions on when and where to target depending on conditions and maneuvers. The gunnery officer would order his POs and midshipmen to get ready and pass along the Captain's explicit orders. The POs and midshipmen would see to their teams.

When firing position was reached, the order to fire might come from the Captain or gunnery officer and then transmitted down the chain of command to the POs/midshipmen. They would then sight down the cannon and order to fire when in optimal position.

This is all fine and dandy if you're making a sea epic. You can show activity all over the decks, the men straining to maneuver and aim the guns, the orders coming down from the Captain until finally the firing starts, the frantic reloading, etc. Damage isn't shown by sparking consoles and camera jiggles, but by holes being blown in the ship, chunks of it falling from the sails and onto the crew ...

It's really quite exciting. I highly recommend 1954's Captain Horatio Hornblower starring Gregory Peck for a good sea epic.

It doesn't work so well on Star Trek because there are simply no moving parts. A sea battle translated to Star Trek looks exactly like "Balance Of Terror:" a bunch of people giving orders, and eventually somebody hits the firing button.

They figured out that it was both rather tedious and after the first time, it actually gets in the way of the action. Hence, Sulu became weapons officer, acquired a gooseneck targeting scanner, and the process reduced to Kirk ordering Sulu to press the firing button.

There's also the intentional parallel of the Enterprise being far from port and the only representation of the Federation nearby. This is directly from history (and Forester's novels) in which a Captain in His Majesty's Navy might be the only representative of the Crown within thousands of miles.

If a Napoleonic Era Captain such as Hornblower wanted advice from the Admiralty while in the Pacific, he'd need to pay a small, fast, private ship enough money to carry a message all the way to England. Then he'd have to wait for a reply. That could take a year or more, so Captains had very broad power to act on the Crown's behalf simply because there was no one else.

This sense of isolation is something later Star Trek series dispensed with, and I think to their detriment. It's more dramatic when the Captain must make life-or-death decisions without input from his superiors. Unfortunately, even when they re-used this concept in Voyager, they simply couldn't bring themselves to keep to it. After a while, the realism of a totally isolated ship was lost, they started contacting Starfleet again, and the threat of superiors intervening became possible.

There's no question that the military experience of everyone involved played a part in the show. The leads in all departments were at least in their mid-40s and had fought in WWII. For them, military parlance was something they remembered and using it was second nature. It stands in contrast to the rest of the franchise, which was produced by people with little or no military experience -- hence the ships and crews of the later franchise have less explicitly military overtones.

Overall, though, I think the biggest influence is still Forester and sailing ships of the Napoleonic era. James Kirk isn't Horatio Hornblower in a character sense, but the Enterprise is a lot like Hornblower's ships -- despite being a starship rather than a sailing ship.

Dakota Smith
 
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Back in the 50's and 60's, it was common practice for tv shows to rip off the plot of a popular movie and do their own version of it. Every western has their own version of "High Noon", for instance.

In this case, Star Trek lifted the overall plot for "Balance of Terror" from "The Enemy Below", a rather good WWII movie from 1957 starring Robert Mitchum as a US destroyer captain and Curt Jurgens as a U-Boat commander, and the cat-and-mouse game they go through while battling each other.
 
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