How is the chain of command determined?
- Thread starter kythe
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Typically, the road to command would be either the gold or red shirts. Picard did mention in Tapestry that security often led to command.
Contrarily-wise, Janeway was a science officer in her earlier days.
They do tend to keep the medical folks out of the command chain. Other than Crusher on a couple of occasions, I don't remember a doctor ever taking command of the ship.
Contrarily-wise, Janeway was a science officer in her earlier days.
They do tend to keep the medical folks out of the command chain. Other than Crusher on a couple of occasions, I don't remember a doctor ever taking command of the ship.
Security is an interesting idea, but I don't think we actually see too much of that. Spock was a science officer as well, and Scotty occasionally commanded and he was an engineer. Yet I don't remember seeing either Geordi LaForge or O'Brien in command and they were both Chief Engineers too.
Sulu and Data were both helmsmen and I believe they were both 3rd in command of their ships. How do helmsmen typically fit in?
Also, we usually see the main officers working together. Who takes over when they rotate shifts? I seem to remember Counsellor Troi doing some command training toward the end of the show and she took some "night shifts" on the bridge, but that really seemed an oddity.
Sulu and Data were both helmsmen and I believe they were both 3rd in command of their ships. How do helmsmen typically fit in?
Also, we usually see the main officers working together. Who takes over when they rotate shifts? I seem to remember Counsellor Troi doing some command training toward the end of the show and she took some "night shifts" on the bridge, but that really seemed an oddity.
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IMO, how an officer becomes a captain varies from individual to individual. Not every captain started off in the command division.
And a ship's individual chain of command varies from ship to ship, usually at the discretion of the captain, IMO. Sometimes, a person's position is more important than their actual rank...
And a ship's individual chain of command varies from ship to ship, usually at the discretion of the captain, IMO. Sometimes, a person's position is more important than their actual rank...
AFAIK, Chekov came up through the ranks as a security officer (he was security chief in TMP, and most assume he was a redshirt guard - offscreen - in TOS' first season). So we know, from him, that security is a possible track to command.
As is engineering (Sisko and Scotty), and even the sciences (Janeway).
O'Brien, OTOH, was not a chief engineer as such. He was chief of operations. And he wasn't an officer, he was enlisted. So he couldn't have his own command unless he went OCS.
As is engineering (Sisko and Scotty), and even the sciences (Janeway).
O'Brien, OTOH, was not a chief engineer as such. He was chief of operations. And he wasn't an officer, he was enlisted. So he couldn't have his own command unless he went OCS.
darkwing_duck1
Vice Admiral
Geordi took command in a S1 episode.
Scotty AFAIK was technically 3rd officer (he commanded far more often than Sulu did when Kirk and Spock were gone).
Data was never a helmsman. He was on Operations Officer (and the ship's 2nd officer).
This is a good topic. I tend to think of the 'command path' as what you do after you decide you want to be a captain, post whatever you joined the fleet to start out doing, and may have little to do with which branch color you wore when you were first commissioned.
I've always thought: being a combined service and all, why would it really matter which type of 'specialist' you started out as? Assuming equal personal capability and equal training (and the capacity for equal additional command training as needed) and then factoring in relevant experience, I would think that there wouldn't be an 'unlikely' path to command - just ones that are statistically rare.
We've seen Commodores in engineering red, and First Officers in science blue, so why not Captains in either color?
I've always thought: being a combined service and all, why would it really matter which type of 'specialist' you started out as? Assuming equal personal capability and equal training (and the capacity for equal additional command training as needed) and then factoring in relevant experience, I would think that there wouldn't be an 'unlikely' path to command - just ones that are statistically rare.
We've seen Commodores in engineering red, and First Officers in science blue, so why not Captains in either color?
I think there was a captain in blue. Either in "The Menagerie" or "Court-Martial".
Red, alas. But then again, Spock switched from gold to blue between 'Where No Man Has Gone Before' and 'The Corbomite Maneuver' so it might be personal choice in conflict situations like that.
You may be onto something...
Scotty was Captain of Engineering late in his career. During the 23rd-Century, it was perfectly acceptable that there were captains in sciences, medical, security, etc.
In the 24th-Century, we generally saw only those wearing command red as captains, but I think it's also feasible that there could be captains from the blue and gold divisions as well, but they would probably be staff officers, IMO.
And there was the admiral wearing operations gold in that one DS9 episode...
In the 24th-Century, we generally saw only those wearing command red as captains, but I think it's also feasible that there could be captains from the blue and gold divisions as well, but they would probably be staff officers, IMO.
And there was the admiral wearing operations gold in that one DS9 episode...
I imagine that there's enough cross training so that regardless of what division you're in, when you reach Captain you'll be judged competant enough to lead in all areas whenever possible. Sometimes in Trek, you don't have to be an expert in your area in order to lead an away team (Riker's probably one of the least scientific of the senior staff, but he had no problems leading scientific expeditions, either. He just knew how to delegate and command and lead appropriately)
I also imagine that the division you take sort of influences what type of mission or vessel you'll soon command. If you follow the sciences division, you'll probably lead more explorer type vessels, for example.
I also imagine that the division you take sort of influences what type of mission or vessel you'll soon command. If you follow the sciences division, you'll probably lead more explorer type vessels, for example.
And in a future depicted in a VOY episode, Geordi was a full Captain and had his own ship, the Challenger.
Krasnovsky was the one, thanks.
That's more along the lines of what I was thinking.
Of course, Geordi also started in command red in season one.
Wasn't he also the helmsman, then later became chief engineer?
To nitpick, the Krasnovsky issue isn't quite clear-cut. In purely canon terms, we know the guy in blue was one of the following: starship captains Krasnovsky and Chandra, or Space Command representative Lindstrom. The other two guys were wearing the more systematic gold, so perhaps the blueshirted, moustached gentleman is in fact Lindstrom, and the balding Caucasian guy is Krasnovsky.
The way Commodore Stone gestures left and right isn't completely unambiguous, and we might in any case assume that Stone is making slight errors in his gesturing - it's only human, after all.
Timo Saloniemi
The way Commodore Stone gestures left and right isn't completely unambiguous, and we might in any case assume that Stone is making slight errors in his gesturing - it's only human, after all.
Timo Saloniemi
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