How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eBay?

[hbquikcomjamesl]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

If you want a good example of that, there was TSR in the 90s. . . . The C&Ds stopped once Wizards of the Coast acquired them, and the rift healed pretty quick after, thankfully.

That brings back some memories. I haven't been involved in RPGs in decades. Partly it was from having a model train dealer who was firmly convinced that they were crypto-satanic, but mainly, it was a combination of (a) not having any friends who did them (with the result that once I was out of high school, it was nothing but randomized solitaire dungeons), and (b) TSR, and later WotC, assuming too much control over what had originally been an extremely open universe, where anybody was free to incorporate anything into anything else (e.g., incorporating elements of Arduin into D&D), and in which house rules trumped everything.

I was thinking about this more, and I think IP owners taking legal actions against fan fics/films is kind of a bad idea, unless it somehow threatens the viability of later official products. By taking legal action against fans, you take a pretty big risk of alienating those fans . . .

Which was, I gather, Roddenberry's take on the matter.

 

[T'Girl]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

Nobody is paying $200 for a fanzine.

Trekkies sometime pay substantial amounts for merchandise. My father and a uncle have a large number of fanzines from the mid seventies. Many in excellent condition, sealed in plastic and stored properly. My father has a climate controlled room in his basement just for his collections.

Some of these fanzines just might fetch two hundred dollars.

 

[JD]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

Fan fic and fan films are just a way for artistic fans to show their love for a franchise, and I don't really see the harm in it.

Sadly, some fanfic writers try to show their love for a series by making their story resemble, almost exactly, a licensed, official paperback - and sell them online, or even in stores or on hucksters' tables at conventions. That runs the risk of another fan buying the item, thinking they are getting actual licensed, official product, and refusing to buy more (official) stuff because the faux product was inferior, or too far removed from what made the series special.

Similarly, with bootleg toys: eg. Batman and Spider-man action figures in the same packet, with swapped accessories. And arms that fall off easily.

The licensees don't want inferior competitors on the market, and the studio doesn't want fans mistaking faux product (that is not vetted by the studio) for the real thing.

In those cases C&D orders are essential.

Those situations would all fall under the threat to the viability of official products. I was talking more about things like online fan fic and the web series like Phase 2 and Star Trek Continues.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Re: How is it legal for Star Trek fanzines to be sold on Amazon and eB

Those situations would all fall under the threat to the viability of official products. I was talking more about things like online fan fic and the web series like Phase 2 and Star Trek Continues.

Online fanfic is still a potential threat to licensed Trek. I know many fans who claim they "cannot afford" books or DVDs, so they download free fanfic and fanfilms.

A licensee would (at least theoretically) be within their rights to demand that CBS prevented such competition. I saw it happen here in Australia with "Batman" merchandise.

 

[Extrocomp]

I've just discovered that someone is selling their Borg vs Species 8472 fanfic as an ebook on Amazon.com. It apparently includes some Novelverse concepts like the Galactic Commonwealth, the Full Circle Fleet and the Aventine. According to one of the reviews, it's been reported and removed before, but keeps coming back.

https://www.amazon.com/Crossover-Universe-Rising-Alex-Fossberg-ebook/dp/B01LW0MPGM/

 

[Galekarens]

I've just discovered that someone is selling their Borg vs Species 8472 fanfic as an ebook on Amazon.com. It apparently includes some Novelverse concepts like the Galactic Commonwealth, the Full Circle Fleet and the Aventine. According to one of the reviews, it's been reported and removed before, but keeps coming back.

https://www.amazon.com/Crossover-Universe-Rising-Alex-Fossberg-ebook/dp/B01LW0MPGM/

Yes, before the "book" was blatantly titled as "Star Trek Crossover" and the "writer" was named Alex Richards. That version did get taken down, but now it's back, yikes, and even costs $2.99 (before was 99cents), oh my! (And supposedly there's going to be a sequel sometime, ha.)

 

[Therin of Andor]

Nobody is paying $200 for a fanzine.

Rare or coveted, out-of-print fanzines might go for that much, if they find the right (or desperate) buyer, but the original fanzines of the 70s and 80s were published/costed to break even, or perhaps a loss. It would be the second hand fanzine that had achieved legendary status that might go for a premium price. The original editor/publisher of the zine isn't making the profit, the owner of the second hand item is (ie. profit on their original investment).

Early zines that did try to charge fans lots of money (usually for "R"-rated content, such as the infamous "Courts of Honor") did raise the ire of then-Paramount/Viacom and other fanzine publishers.

In the 80s, I published two volumes of portrait art of Trek aliens, both limited to 100 copies. With offset printing, cardboard covers, coil binding and bromides, I broke even at $5 per book. While I still had my no-profit copies left in my garage (about 20 left), I heard that one had been auctioned by its owner at a convention for $78! Its selling point was its 100-copy rarity! I coulda sold the winner a copy for $5. In fact I still have a few. (EDIT: Ha, just realized I told this anecdote in this thread years ago! Necro-thread!)

Current-day fanfic is rarely published in hardcopy, AKAIK. (Some have tried print-on-demand, and some have been shut down.) Fans would typically be swapping with each other electronically. No printing/mailing costs. Those who do try to make their fanfic look exactly like a Pocket Books' novel usually quickly get a C&D letter, like the "Prelude to Axanar" fanfilm did(?).

CBS/Paramount wouldn't be concerned about someone making $$$$ on a rare, secondhand, Playmates' action figure, nor a copy of first-edition "Killing Time", nor a TV-used Starfleet uniform. Nor a "collectible" fanzine from the 70s.

 

[DrCorby]

A couple of years ago, I bought a couple of Star Trek fan publications from the late 70s, Epilogue Parts I & II by Jean Lorrah. I'd remembered reading them in 1979 and enjoying them, before Jean Lorrah became a professional writer. While they weren't quite as good as I remembered them being, I still don't begrudge the $25 or so I paid for them, since they were primarily nostalgia items from a certain time of my life, as a new college student, out on my own, being exposed to wonders that I'd never imagined seeing growing up in my small town.

So I can easily believe some old fanzines reselling for a couple of hundred dollars. I'd read about some famous (or notorious) ones in Star Trek Lives!, The Making of the Star Trek Conventions by Joan Winston, and the Best of TREK collections. Or seeing art from some fanzines in the 1st (Ballantine) edition of Bjo Trimble's Star Trek Concordance. Being able to thumb through some of those issues now would certainly be interesting!

 

[Therin of Andor]

I was in a bookshop in London the other day and saw The Unauthorised Guide to Star Trek Voyager. Picked it up to a flick through only to see it had been composed from "high quality Wikipedia articles". I knew such things existed on Amazon but didn't realise bookshops were selling them. Seems an easy way for the "author" to make money.

A few shops have found entries for those dreadful Wiki-reprint manuals in online catalogues and ordered them accidentally.

Ditto, a few official Pocket novels on S&S's official print-on-demand service. The books are larger than MMPB, but the internal content looks like margins still set for MMPB, not trade. The shops hate getting caught with them, as the Recommended Retail Price is much higher than the original MMPB.

 

[Dayton Ward]

I still have several print zines from back in the day. They're a special part of 70-90s Trek fandom, before the rise of the internet.

 

[Timewalker]

Rare or coveted, out-of-print fanzines might go for that much, if they find the right (or desperate) buyer, but the original fanzines of the 70s and 80s were published/costed to break even, or perhaps a loss. It would be the second hand fanzine that had achieved legendary status that might go for a premium price. The original editor/publisher of the zine isn't making the profit, the owner of the second hand item is (ie. profit on their original investment).

Some people just plain gouge. There are lots of them listed at $200 or $250 (Spock Enslaved is the most notorious one I can think of). But I got my copy for somewhere in the $20-$25 USD range. There's a particular non-ST print 'zine I would dearly love to get - loved the show, and this is the only fanfiction I've heard of anywhere. The person who owns it keeps it listed at $150 USD (she put it on sale once for $100 USD). You'd think by this time - years - it would have occurred to her that she's pricing it just a tad too high!

A couple of years ago, I bought a couple of Star Trek fan publications from the late 70s, Epilogue Parts I & II by Jean Lorrah. I'd remembered reading them in 1979 and enjoying them, before Jean Lorrah became a professional writer. While they weren't quite as good as I remembered them being, I still don't begrudge the $25 or so I paid for them, since they were primarily nostalgia items from a certain time of my life, as a new college student, out on my own, being exposed to wonders that I'd never imagined seeing growing up in my small town.

So I can easily believe some old fanzines reselling for a couple of hundred dollars. I'd read about some famous (or notorious) ones in Star Trek Lives!, The Making of the Star Trek Conventions by Joan Winston, and the Best of TREK collections. Or seeing art from some fanzines in the 1st (Ballantine) edition of Bjo Trimble's Star Trek Concordance. Being able to thumb through some of those issues now would certainly be interesting!

The thing about print 'zines vs. online fanfic is that the physical fanzines also contain extra material - editorials, letter columns, poetry, puzzles, games, comics, and artwork - some of which is exquisite, and is never included when the stories might find their way to being archived somewhere online. That's one reason I collect '70s/'80s print zines ('90s when you add in series such as Highlander).

And yeah, the archaeologist part of me looks at these items as artifacts that I want to have, to read and enjoy. It's also a fascinating trip down memory lane, as I can remember the whole staples-and-correction fluid hassle of putting out a fanzine. At least I was able to use a photocopier, instead of a Xerox!