From Hell’s Heart

[Lando Griffin]

what are some of your most hated characters, themes, shows? I’ve really got it in for T’Ryssa Chen. She’s too “wacky” and such a parody of an anti-Vulcan and it brings out the worst in Jean-Luc Picard. I don’t care how much he’s mellowed in his old age, there’s no way he would treat her like a daughter and give her such leeway. From interrupting him when speaking to him worrying she’d say something about pea soup on his pant leg.

Speaking of bringing out the worst in characters have you read the Romulan War book my Michael Martin? There’s this big feud between him and Andy Mangles that I’m not sure what happened, but it caused or was started after their writing split. It really shows where the true talent was in their collaboration. From the Sundered to Cathedral, to Section 31’s TNG installment, its really clear that Andy was the talent.

Michael is just a liberal sycophant in his books, naming spacedocks after President Obama, the man who dismantled our space program, to in “The needs of the many” stating that using the term Victory Charlie (VC) during the Vietnam War was racist and derogatory, not to mention his stereotyping and cliché writing of the soldiers. It really feels like a hippie peacenik is writing the war novels. The Romulan War book that came out a couple of years ago has really ruined Travis and T’Pol and Trip. IT’s a sad state of affairs in the Enterprise universe and the new book comes out soon. I don’t want to buy it but like picking a scab I really want to see what other harm he’s done.

 

[David cgc]

Michael is just a liberal sycophant in his books, naming spacedocks after President Obama, the man who dismantled our space program,

Really? He did? Awesome! Maybe I can get that almost-finished Orion Capsule on the cheap for my backyard! It'll be a bitchin' lawn ornament.

It's funny that he wouldn't have removed the goal to land on an asteroid by 2025 at the same time, though. Maybe the astronauts are going to have to walk.

 

[Lonemagpie]

stating that using the term Victory Charlie (VC) during the Vietnam War was racist and derogatory

Derogatory perhaps, but it's not a racist term as it a) translates as "Communist Vietnamese", which the North's forces were, and b) was coined by the Vietnamese themselves in 1956 - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viet_Cong#Names

 

[JD]

what are some of your most hated characters, themes, shows? I’ve really got it in for T’Ryssa Chen. She’s too “wacky” and such a parody of an anti-Vulcan and it brings out the worst in Jean-Luc Picard. I don’t care how much he’s mellowed in his old age, there’s no way he would treat her like a daughter and give her such leeway. From interrupting him when speaking to him worrying she’d say something about pea soup on his pant leg.

I couldn't possibly in any way shape or form even begin to disagree with you more in the slightest. I think Trys is the best thing to happen to happen to TNG in a long time. While she had the potential to just be a one note character who popped up every now then to make a comment or two, she's actually become a very well developed three dimensional character. Pretty much any scene with her is a highlight of a book.

 

[Thrawn]

^ I think you might wanna check that first sentence again; I don't think it means what you wanted it to mean.

 

[JD]

Oop. I meant "disagree with you more". Edited to fix.

 

[Sci]

Michael is just a liberal sycophant in his books, naming spacedocks after President Obama,

How dare he name a space station after the first black head of government of a majority-white nation in human history!

Obviously Star Trek should stick to naming space stations after imperialists instead.

the man who dismantled our space program,

The Romulan War: Beneath the Raptor's Wing was published in Fall 2009, long before President Obama's NASA policies became finalized.

It really feels like a hippie peacenik is writing the war novels.

How dare someone write Star Trek from a liberal perspective! That's unprecedented in the history of the franchise. Gene Roddenberry would never have approved!

 

[Rush Limborg]

I'm not sure what this guy's intentions are....

In the DS9 thread, he posted a smear against Leeta, comparing her to Hitler (I kid you not).

I think he's just screaming for attention--typical of spiteful little trolls.

 

[xortex]

Well, in all fairness, to do a Romulan war novel series just to do the Romulan war sounds stupid. Maybe Leeta wasn't Hitler enough like for his real tastes.

A bland story is a bland story. It doesn't matter what it's about.

Some mod is having a heart attack about right now.

 

[Elias Vaughn]

I always cry a little bit inside when people express a dislike for T'Ryssa.

 

[Kelso]

Bah. I thought this was a new novel title.

 

[Turtletrekker]

T'ryssa is awesome!

 

[Cicero]

Michael is just a liberal sycophant in his books, naming spacedocks after President Obama,

How dare he name a space station after the first black head of government of a majority-white nation in human history!

I would rather the President not be judged by the color of his skin. Only the content of his character matters. (Also success or failure, arguably.)

I disagreed with the choice to name the station for Obama for that reason: When the novel was written, nothing was known of his presidency. Would he prove to be a great president? A good one? Average? Less than average? The naming decision was based either on what the President-elect was perceived to be (e.g. black), or in what the author hoped he might do. Neither alternative demonstrates much perspective.

(I voted for Senator Obama, for what it's worth. I would again in a heartbeat. I should admit, however, that I've never been an ardent supporter of his; I am a diehard admirer of Hillary Clinton, and those of her traits which I believe he lacks have limited my enthusiasm for the President.)

Obviously Star Trek should stick to naming space stations after imperialists instead.

I don't think it's fair to characterize President McKinley as an imperialist. His own remarks - particularly on the matter of the Philippines - suggest otherwise. Racist? Probably. Zealously religious? Certainly.

But I think that a case for imperialist is difficult to make. His was an empire-minded party, but it is telling that most of the notable letters written by American imperialists during his presidency were written in criticism of what they perceived as his failure to accept the idea of empire.

His arguments for his policies, in turn, were pragmatic: time and again, he resorted to military action as the best way to restore normal commerce, resolve tension, or ensure long-term stability. (His arguments for the war against Spain refer to the two former ends, his argument for retaining control of the Philippines refer to the latter.)

I think this sentiment sums up McKinley best, for better and for worse:

Let us ever remember that our interest is in concord, not in conflict; and that our real eminence rests in the victories of peace, not those of war.
​

There is, of course, the strong possibility that the station was named for the mountain, for which McKinley remains the most widely used of half a dozen names.

It really feels like a hippie peacenik is writing the war novels.

How dare someone write Star Trek from a liberal perspective! That's unprecedented in the history of the franchise. Gene Roddenberry would never have approved!

There is a great deal of difference between liberal and "hippie peacenik" (not a phrase I would have used). Star Trek's outlook has generally been most closely associated with the (now) old-fashioned liberalism of the Kennedy era, which was by no means anti-military, combined with traits of humanism.

Roddenberry's later efforts in TMP and TNG were more in line with what might be termed "peacenik," but Star Trek has generally maintained a more traditionally liberal, militarily accepting outlook (aside from a brief brush with neoconservatism in Enterprise).

It's true, however, that Star Trek's novels and "fandom" have tended to portray and attract, respectively, a more pacifist worldview. I don't know why this is so - and, coming from a liberal family with a strong tradition of military service, I doubt I will ever understand why, the worldview of some parts of the Left being so foreign to me - but this disconnect, I think, sometimes causes mismatches of expectations.

 

[LightningStorm]

No need to keep this thread around.

Clever troll was not clever enough. And the responses are about what one would expect.