Elogium's writer must have fallen asleep in biology class

[Beard of Sisko]

We have a species that lives a shorter life than every cat and dog I've ever owned. They only conceive once in their lives. And their one conception isn't a litter, but a singular baby. And they have a mating process takes days.

Either the episode's writer was really bad at creating drama or they fell asleep in biology class. How is a species like that still even alive?

Honestly it's best things didn't work out with Neelix. With Ocampans living such short lives, you'd have to bury your child, grandchild, great-grandchild, etc. That takes an emotional toll after a while.

 

[Tosk]

They only conceive once in their lives.

They have to have a child during Elogium or they never can again. That still leaves open the possibility of future pregnancies. Or multiple children born at the same time. Hence why Kes has an uncle.

 

[Beard of Sisko]

They have to have a child during Elogium or they never can again. That still leaves open the possibility of future pregnancies. Or multiple children born at the same time. Hence why Kes has an uncle.

Kes having an uncle is a plot hole because this episode makes it clear they can only conceive on one occasion and only a singular child.

 

[Tosk]

Kes having an uncle is a plot hole because this episode makes it clear they can only conceive on one occasion and only a singular child.

There are several utterances that can be interpreted that way, but they also allow for an Ocampan to have multiple pregnancies.

 

[Dee1891]

We have a species that lives a shorter life than every cat and dog I've ever owned. They only conceive once in their lives. And their one conception isn't a litter, but a singular baby. And they have a mating process takes days.

Either the episode's writer was really bad at creating drama or they fell asleep in biology class. How is a species like that still even alive?

Honestly it's best things didn't work out with Neelix. With Ocampans living such short lives, you'd have to bury your child, grandchild, great-grandchild, etc. That takes an emotional toll after a while.

What are you complaining about? That Ocampans had short life spans?

Kes having an uncle is a plot hole because this episode makes it clear they can only conceive on one occasion and only a singular child.

Kes' uncle could have easily been the half-brother of one of her parents.

 

[Markonian]

This is addressed in the Star Trek: Myriad Universes novel Places of Exile, which states Ocampa usually bear multiples. Yeah, the episode is a bit…light on biological sense.

Side note, I would’ve love to see Linnis again.

Edit: technically, natural Ocampan lifespan is longer (see Suspiria’s array). Perhaps fully-powered Ocampa have/had more control over their procreation?

 

[Beard of Sisko]

What are you complaining about? That Ocampans had short life spans?



Kes' uncle could have easily been the half-brother of one of her parents.

The point is that they're evolutionary dead end. A species that lives shorter lives than a house cat should be having multiple litters, not a singular child on a singular occurrence.

Even if some Ocampan males mated with more than one female, their species still wouldn't last very long.

 

[Guy Gardener]

The point is that they're evolutionary dead end. A species that lives shorter lives than a house cat should be having multiple litters, not a singular child on a singular occurrence.

Even if some Ocampan males mated with more than one female, their species still wouldn't last very long.

With just a nudge, they ascend into non coporeal, immortal omni telepathic Gods.

They win.

Evolution is their #itch.

 

[Oddish]

To be capable of sustaining the species, Ocampan females would need to be capable of beating at least three children in their lifetime. Four or five would be preferable. And no, Elogium did not state that Kes couldn't bear other children after having their first in Elogium... but it did cut the timetable. If Elogium typically occurs at age four, that gives Ocampans only five years to have and raise their young.

 

[Tosk]

Ocampan females would need to be capable of beating at least three children in their lifetime

Damn. Harsh!

 

[Imaus]

I can take on three kids, can you?

 

[Ragitsu]

Reminds me of a certain someone that used to be a pro at Baby Fight Night.

I can take on three kids, can you?

Species-dependent, no? Three Vulcan kids would be an absolute nightmare in the ring, on the streets or in any venue suitable for blatantly undignified ass-whooping.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Remember Caretaker committed a sin that could never be forgiven?

The assumption is that he is talking about how he, or a member of his mission, removed all the nucleogenic particles from the atmosphere, making rain impossible, turning Ocampa into Dune, which is (probably?) where the nucleogenic Space Dolphins came from in Equinox.

What if they diddled the birthrate or the life span, and that was the sin that could never be forgiven?

Although what if the Caretaker, or Caretakers did it on purpose?

They bunged up the planet by mistake, and then rather than letting billions of Ocampa die out in less than a month as they run through all their bottled water, they thought that the Ocampa might want to whimper out slowly over the course of 20 generations, until they were gone.

 

[Finn]

We have a species that lives a shorter life than every cat and dog I've ever owned. They only conceive once in their lives. And their one conception isn't a litter, but a singular baby. And they have a mating process takes days.

Either the episode's writer was really bad at creating drama or they fell asleep in biology class. How is a species like that still even alive?

Honestly it's best things didn't work out with Neelix. With Ocampans living such short lives, you'd have to bury your child, grandchild, great-grandchild, etc. That takes an emotional toll after a while.

Hi. Welcome.

As for your op, first of all, all we have on Ocampan biology is the word of an Ocampan who was not fully grown when she went to the surface. She may have been mistaken. Also, I'm not sure why you are going off on some kind of lack of knowledge and proficiency in biology regarding the short life term of Ocampans, which I do think is absurd, but it's fiction.

As for the last paragraph, who would they be heartbreaking on Ocampa?, where a 9 year life span is the norm, no difference from living to be 90 on Earth or 2000 on Vulcan.

 

[Beard of Sisko]

Hi. Welcome.

As for your op, first of all, all we have on Ocampan biology is the word of an Ocampan who was not fully grown when she went to the surface. She may have been mistaken. Also, I'm not sure why you are going off on some kind of lack of knowledge and proficiency in biology regarding the short life term of Ocampans, which I do think is absurd, but it's fiction.

As for the last paragraph, who would they be heartbreaking on Ocampa?, where a 9 year life span is the norm, no difference from living to be 90 on Earth or 2000 on Vulcan.

"It's fiction" is not an excuse for lazy writing.

And I think you need to re-read my last paragraph. I said "It's best things didn't work out with Neelix," who last I checked is not Ocampan. Because a non-Ocampan having a family with an Ocampan would not only have to bury their spouse, but they'd also outlive their child, grandchild, great-grandchild, great-great grandchild, and so on. Assuming Talaxians have lifespans comparable to 24th century humans, who knows how many generations he'd have to bury before finally dying himself.

 

[Beard of Sisko]

There are several utterances that can be interpreted that way, but they also allow for an Ocampan to have multiple pregnancies.

Nothing in the episode implies this given a major point of drama is "She has to get pregnant now or it will never happen."

 

[Finn]

Nothing in the episode implies this given a major point of drama is "She has to get pregnant now or it will never happen."

Which was negated in the end, and the fact she was quite young when she left them. I don't know what they were thinking in the beginning when they decided to have such a short life span for Kes.

It's just a story plotline. Just enjoy the episode, and Tuvok's like about Voyager losing its sex appeal

 

[Beard of Sisko]

Which was negated in the end, and the fact she was quite young when she left them.

It's just a story plotline.

Again, poor/lazy writing is not excused by "It's just a story plotline."

Last time I looked, this is a place to critique the franchise, not an echo chamber.

 

[Finn]

Alright. cool.

 

[Oddish]

I can take on three kids, can you?

I've taken on a lot more. Of course, I didn't take any of them home.

As for the last paragraph, who would they be heartbreaking on Ocampa?, where a 9 year life span is the norm, no difference from living to be 90 on Earth or 2000 on Vulcan.

I don't think Vulcans live quite that long. Sarek was barely over 200 when he died.

And I think you need to re-read my last paragraph. I said "It's best things didn't work out with Neelix," who last I checked is not Ocampan. Because a non-Ocampan having a family with an Ocampan would not only have to bury their spouse, but they'd also outlive their child, grandchild, great-grandchild, great-great grandchild, and so on. Assuming Talaxians have lifespans comparable to 24th century humans, who knows how many generations he'd have to bury before finally dying himself.

Depends on if the Morilogium is delayed by having DNA from another species present. Linnis and Andrew both seemed to mature fast (as Ocampa do), but they might have lasted more than nine years. Or, maybe Talaxian DNA is more dominant than human... it's possible that Neelix and Kes's children would have Talaxian lifespans.