Does anyone else feel the end of "Sacrifice of Angels" is kind of a dues ex machina moment? I really didn't like the way they chose to have THE pivotal moment of the war be cheapened by having thousands of Jem'Hadar ships vanish in the wormhole. It was too big of an event with so much lead up, then, "poof they're gone". (2 episodes left of season 6, please no spoilers!)
Deus Ex Machina
- Thread starter neptune13
- Start date
No.
Well it fails several of the criteria for being a Dues ex Machina, the Wormhole Aliens where introduced in the very first episode of the series, their ability to influence the wormhole was also demonstrated in the very first episode of the series. They had played a part in several episodes of the course of the series. A Dues Ex Machina basically means
an unexpected power or event saving a seemingly hopeless situation, especially as a contrived plot device in a play or novel.
As indictaed above Wormhole aliens were a known power, ability to influence the wormhole established. No you can argue that it wasn't a good way to end the threat but that's not the same as a Deus ex Machina ending.
an unexpected power or event saving a seemingly hopeless situation, especially as a contrived plot device in a play or novel.
As indictaed above Wormhole aliens were a known power, ability to influence the wormhole established. No you can argue that it wasn't a good way to end the threat but that's not the same as a Deus ex Machina ending.
OK, but it says unexpected not unknown. From my perspective it was certainly unexpected. In stories like Orestes the Gods were mentioned throughout the story, therefore where known, and at the end one shows up out of nowhere. That play is the quintessential deus ex machina storyline. It wasn't my intention to start a semantic debate. My point was, after all the hard fighting, sacrifice and planning made by Starfleet and allies it seems unsatisfying for the Jem'Hadar ships to vanish at the last second. If that hadn't happened the Jem'Hadar would have won the war and it was a supernatural act that caused this outcome.
The Prophets/Wormhole Aliens were characters in Deep Space Nine, and Sisko developed a relationship with them over the course of a dozen or so episodes.
When they acted, they did so in a minor way: they shut the door and exterminated the trespassers, the cosmic equivalent of using Roundup. They did not destroy the Dominion. They did not destroy the Dominion in the Alpha Quadrant. They did not destroy the Dominion in the Bajoran System. Their actions had strategic importance, but they were far from widespread. And they did not bring the war to an end.
It was not supernatural. They manipulated a structure that they created.
ETA: I don't know your viewpoint, but most people take issue with SoA because they are not themselves comfortable with the Prophets storyline in general, and they wished it had died off.
When they acted, they did so in a minor way: they shut the door and exterminated the trespassers, the cosmic equivalent of using Roundup. They did not destroy the Dominion. They did not destroy the Dominion in the Alpha Quadrant. They did not destroy the Dominion in the Bajoran System. Their actions had strategic importance, but they were far from widespread. And they did not bring the war to an end.
It was not supernatural. They manipulated a structure that they created.
ETA: I don't know your viewpoint, but most people take issue with SoA because they are not themselves comfortable with the Prophets storyline in general, and they wished it had died off.
It was certainly supernatural. deus ex machina is not defined by the amount of the storyline world it effects but, buy by the storyline of the characters involved. In Orestes the entire world wasn't effected by the event that took place in that soryline, only the characters involved. They didn't "shut the door", they made the ships vanish, disappear, thousands of them. If you don't consider that supernatural then I don't know what is. Sisko tells the wormhole aliens the only thing that can save Bajor is a miracle. What, if not that, is unexpected supernatural intervention?
In Star Trek (I assume you are broadly familiar with this franchise), manipulating spacetime is common, some species doing it better than other. Within the context of the franchise, it is not supernatural, but mundane.
True, but the wormhole beings pulled Sisko into their plane of existence, he didn't go into the wormhole to ask them for help.
In the previous episode, you can find evidence that he was looking for something out of the Prophets.
True, but these beings live outside of space-time, they don't just manipulate it. I mean, to me, even in the Ster Trek universe that is beyond natural.
According to merriam-webster dictionary the definition of deus ex machina ... just kidding. the def states: a person or thing (as in fiction or drama) that appears or is introduced suddenly and unexpectedly and provides a contrived solution to an apparently insoluble difficulty . So "that appears OR is introduced suddenly" the wormhole aliens appear suddenly to Sisko without his asking and change the hopeless situation for the crew, DS9 and the Alpha Quadrant.
I never quite took to the Prophets/Emissary storyline. I do agree it was a disappointing way to end an epic 7 episode arc in which they'd played no part up until that point but not enough to ruin the episode for me.
I wouldn't have minded the Emissary storyline being wrapped up in Season 2 or 3. It felt out of place amongst the events of Season 4 onwards. I'll post more about it when you finish the series as you asked for no spoilers.
I wouldn't have minded the Emissary storyline being wrapped up in Season 2 or 3. It felt out of place amongst the events of Season 4 onwards. I'll post more about it when you finish the series as you asked for no spoilers.
Deus Ex Cunicula - God from the Wormhole.
Yes but not for the reasons you may think.
Ira Steven Behr said it wasn't Deus Ex Machina, but rather it was man demanding god intervene.
However, the first arc of episodes in season 7 revealed that Sisko was part/half-Prophet. This retroactively changed the way I view the episode. Its no longer man demanding something of god, but rather man asking his phenomenally, cosmic powered, supernatural, extended family for a favor. A favor they acquiesce to. A favor they would not have done, presumably for anyone else.
Ira Steven Behr said it wasn't Deus Ex Machina, but rather it was man demanding god intervene.
However, the first arc of episodes in season 7 revealed that Sisko was part/half-Prophet. This retroactively changed the way I view the episode. Its no longer man demanding something of god, but rather man asking his phenomenally, cosmic powered, supernatural, extended family for a favor. A favor they acquiesce to. A favor they would not have done, presumably for anyone else.
No, never thought that. The Prophets had been an increasingly important background element and I liked how they were moved forwards into the main plots. I wasn't entirely happy with the resultant storylines but the idea of the Prophets enacting a penance on Sisko for their help was a pretty powerful idea at the time.
Also this question has been asked before here, which isn't to say it shouldn't be asked again of course, but that there were some good comments in those previous threads, as I recall.
Also this question has been asked before here, which isn't to say it shouldn't be asked again of course, but that there were some good comments in those previous threads, as I recall.
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