Destruction of NCC-1701

[PhoenixIreland]

I just saw a funny clip via another threat with this in it and something occured to me...

...why didn't the auto destruct just cause a warp core breach?

Weve seen in other series that sometimes a crew needs to set the autodestruct while inside the ship and kill themselves in the proces, the saucer section slowly incinerating and the stardrive section burning up a bit but not quite being destroyed would have given the crew a slow and horrific death if they were actually inside the ship...

...not to mention the bridge slowly blowing up console by console...

 

[SonicRanger]

Mr. Scott's Guide to the Enterprise suggested that there are two different modes of self-destruct: "... Destruct-Zero" and "... Destruct-One." The warp core breach mode was intended for use in deep space. The mode we saw in TSFS uses explosive charges throughout the ship and is intended for use in close proximity to another ship or a planet (or both). Since Kirk and friends wanted to protect Genesis and the Bird of Prey (or stealing later), they didn't just dump the warp core and spew antimatter throughout the neighborhood.

 

[Non Sync]

It seems that the explosive charges would result in the containment fields around the anti-matter to collapse resulting in a matter/anti-matter explosion anyway...

 

[FordSVT]

It seems that the explosive charges would result in the containment fields around the anti-matter to collapse resulting in a matter/anti-matter explosion anyway...

It wouldn't be a controlled explosion, but you're right, as soon as the AM containment fields dropped it would begin annihilating all the normal matter it could get it's hands on.

 

[SonicRanger]

I don't have my copy of MSGttE handy, so I can't remember how they handled that particular issue. Wasn't there a line somewhere in TOS about the ship's antimatter being "deactivated"? I think the other possibility is that the antimatter bottles are ejected at high speed in some direction, allowing their containment fields to slowly decay and eventually fail at a safer distance. It could simply be, though, that they hadn't worked out all this stuff very clearly by the time of TSFS -- certainly the TMP-era "intermix chamber" wasn't quite envisioned the same way as TNG-era "warp cores."

 

[JuanBolio]

Scott's Guide states that before Destruct Zero reaches the end of its countdown, all antimatter bottles are ejected from the ship and rocket away to a safe distance.

 

[SonicRanger]

^^^

I knew I didn't just pull that out of the air -- I thought it was from MSGttE.

 

[A beaker full of death]

Was anyone else thrilled when they used the same code they used in the series?

 

[Jon1701]

Was anyone else thrilled when they used the same code they used in the series?

Yes. It rocked.

Only thing the bugs me, and this is my inner star trek nerd (which admittedly - ony shows up after you've seen the movie fifty times or so) - is that Kirk's final code for the one minute countdown.

"zero, zero, zero...destruct...zero"

Which is four "0's" even though three show up onscreen. I've spent many an hour trying to rationalise it.

Sometimes I fucking hate being a nerd

 

[JuanBolio]

Was anyone else thrilled when they used the same code they used in the series?

Yes. It rocked.

Only thing the bugs me, and this is my inner star trek nerd (which admittedly - ony shows up after you've seen the movie fifty times or so) - is that Kirk's final code for the one minute countdown.

"zero, zero, zero...destruct...zero"

Which is four "0's" even though three show up onscreen. I've spent many an hour trying to rationalise it.

Sometimes I fucking hate being a nerd

That's because "000" is the final code. "Destruct Zero" is the type of destruct specified. Destruct Zero detonates charges throughout the ship, rendering it a useless hulk. Destruct One would blow the reactor in a huge nuclear fireball, incinerating everything within a few hundred kilometers.

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

Was anyone else thrilled when they used the same code they used in the series?

Yes, but I really love how Shatner delivered the last line in the destruct sequence.

 

[PhoenixIreland]

Wow, I'm surprised theres an explanation that actually makes perfect sense

I loved that line as the ship is burning up "my god bones...what have I done?"

Tho I think McCoy should have stopped at "what you had to do"..the rest of his words were just hammy

 

[Cyke101]

I'm still surprised at how gutsy the whole thing was. I mean, Kirk blows up the Enterprise on a gamble that a lone Klingon stuck on board the Bird of Prey wouldn't just warp away.

 

[EEE]

I think this is all rationalization. They gave one of the biggest stars of the entire series an ignominious end. Even Spock came back to life. The Lady of the show was replaced by a broken down renamed twin. 1701-A is not THE Enterprise! All rationalization's aside, she should've taken out half the quadrant, even before factoring in the corbomite! Fizzle, my arse. Even with the rationalizations, half the saucer and a fizzle? C'mon already, this was THE Enterprise. THE star of the show! I tell you, it's enough to drive one to drinking Klingon coffee. Oh gawd, the depression is back. The biggest single blight on all of TOS-dom. Fizzle.

 

[EliyahuQeoni]

They gave one of the biggest stars of the entire series an ignominious end. ... The biggest single blight on all of TOS-dom. Fizzle.

I completely disagree. The 1701 was destroyed so her captain and crew could live and complete their mission to save Spock. I've always seen it as a quite honorable way for the old girl to go. And her "death" scene was handled with respect and dignity. I've never had a problem with how big (or little) the explosion was. The sequence is well done and effective and, quite honestly, chokes me up a bit every time I see it.

 

[A beaker full of death]

I think this is all rationalization. They gave one of the biggest stars of the entire series an ignominious end.

Oh horse-hockey. Kirk and Scotty, and to an extent all the crewmen aboard, might be expected to feel that way - indeed, should feel that way - and we can sympathize. But all this "the Enterprise was a character" crap is such utter nonsense. Was the batcave a character?
Sentimentalism is one thing, but to equate a set with the fine work the actors did is insulting.
No wonder people like CGI characters and cartoons these days. Acting? Who needs acting?

 

[rocketscientist]

They gave one of the biggest stars of the entire series an ignominious end. ... The biggest single blight on all of TOS-dom. Fizzle.

I completely disagree. The 1701 was destroyed so her captain and crew could live and complete their mission to save Spock. I've always seen it as a quite honorable way for the old girl to go. And her "death" scene was handled with respect and dignity. I've never had a problem with how big (or little) the explosion was. The sequence is well done and effective and, quite honestly, chokes me up a bit every time I see it.

Me too. That whole sequence had so much drama. I actually think I was more horrified by the destruction of the Enterprise than I was of Spock. The Enterprise always got out of scrapes with gods, Klingons, Romulans, space amoebas, etc. I always had the sense it would go on, especially after TWOK. In TSFS, the Enterprise took one hit too many and gave her life to give Kirk and his crew a chance to live.


The destruction of the Ent-D wasn't nearly as good. Yeah, it was cool to look at, but drama-wise it definitely didn't pack the punch that the death of the original did. That was truly the end of an era and a seminal event in ST.

Actually, I'd put the death of the original Enterprise second only to Spock's death in ST in terms of impact.

 

[rocketscientist]

I'm still surprised at how gutsy the whole thing was. I mean, Kirk blows up the Enterprise on a gamble that a lone Klingon stuck on board the Bird of Prey wouldn't just warp away.

Well, he couldn't let the Klingons take the Enterprise and, by destroying the ship, he knew he could kill a lot of them, making the take-over of their ship more possible. To do that, he needed to get aboard and that's where beaming down to the planet to save Saavik and Spock came in, since Krudge thought that Kirk and possibly Spock and Saavik knew the secret to Genesis.

It was indeed a brilliant and very gutsy move.

 

[rocketscientist]

I think this is all rationalization. They gave one of the biggest stars of the entire series an ignominious end.

Oh horse-hockey. Kirk and Scotty, and to an extent all the crewmen aboard, might be expected to feel that way - indeed, should feel that way - and we can sympathize. But all this "the Enterprise was a character" crap is such utter nonsense. Was the batcave a character?
Sentimentalism is one thing, but to equate a set with the fine work the actors did is insulting.
No wonder people like CGI characters and cartoons these days. Acting? Who needs acting?

I kind of disagree with you. Many fans of the original ST actually felt the same affection for the Enterprise that the original crew felt, or something like it. DC Fontana said in one of David Gerrold's books (that was published after TSFS where he discussed the destruction of the Enterprise) that the Enterprise itself got lots of fan-mail, that is, fans telling the producers how much they loved the ship. She and Gerrold said that the Enterprise itself was essentially like a character in the show.

It's no different from someone liking a classic car or a sailboat.

That's how I felt about the original Enterprise, anyway.

 

[CaptainStoner]

I think this is all rationalization. They gave one of the biggest stars of the entire series an ignominious end.

Oh horse-hockey. Kirk and Scotty, and to an extent all the crewmen aboard, might be expected to feel that way - indeed, should feel that way - and we can sympathize. But all this "the Enterprise was a character" crap is such utter nonsense. Was the batcave a character?
Sentimentalism is one thing, but to equate a set with the fine work the actors did is insulting.
No wonder people like CGI characters and cartoons these days. Acting? Who needs acting?

The Enterprise was referred to as an entity throughout TOS, obviously in homage to a similar tradition among other storied ships. The batcave is just where Batman hangs out and does weird stuff with Robin.

And it is equally insulting for you to slight such monumental and influential set work, an art in and of itself with just as much validity as other forms. Same with CGI and animation.