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Buffy Season 6: The Troubled Experiment

Joe Washington

Fleet Captain
Fleet Captain
Season 6 of Buffy the Vampire Slayer was an experiment designed by Joss Whedon that many grew to hate and despise because of its depressing nature. But it was Joss’s intention to explore the everyday problems of the characters’ lives and make Season 6 into something more than a typical Buffy vs. Big Bad season. Do you think the experiment was a success in your eyes or a doomed failure? Do you think other shows should follow Buffy Season 6’s example?

I think on paper it was an interesting concept but when watching it, it’s a different story that I can’t find within myself to watch completely.
 
i actually like season 6 quite a bit. i would say its my second favorite season to sit down and watch from start to finish. there is just one thing i hate about it. when you know who dies.
 
I love season six. It was a massive creative risk, yes, but I saw what they were trying to accomplish, and really appreciated it. Life itself was the Big Bad. It was about the characters moreso than any exterior threats. Some nasty, depressing stuff happened to the characters, but Joss doesn't always write what we want to see, but rather what we need to see. How many primetime shows risk losing half their audience by turning a beloved fan favourite character into a villain? Or murdering another beloved character in such a traumatic fashion?

Excellent season of TV in my opinion. i must be the only guy on this BBS that thought Buffy was great from start to finish.
 
While I was not a huge fan of the "Double Meat Palace" arc in the middle of the season, I thoroughly enjoyed Season 6 as a whole. I loved how depressing it was.
 
I despise Season Six. The Musical was a classic and the ending was alright but everything else? Ugh. Totally killed my love for the show. The Nerd Trio was the only thing that made it watchable, but they should never have been the focus of an entire season.
 
Season Six is among my favorite of the series...and yes I said this even when it was on the air. With the except of the aforementioned "Double Meat Palace" debacle I love how it unfolded. I think the worst season and one that deserves Joe's thread title is season four.
 
I enjoyed the first third of the season, absolutely hated the middle third, and kinda liked the last third. Overall it wound up being a disappointing season with some enjoyable episodes sprinkled here and there.
 
I hate the Hell's Bells arc and a few other minor things (the Riley episode, how Buffy suddenly needs money but Willow and Tara don't help, etc.) Otherwise I like the season, although it's not close to being my favorite.
 
I love season six. It was a massive creative risk, yes, but I saw what they were trying to accomplish, and really appreciated it. Life itself was the Big Bad. It was about the characters moreso than any exterior threats. Some nasty, depressing stuff happened to the characters, but Joss doesn't always write what we want to see, but rather what we need to see. How many primetime shows risk losing half their audience by turning a beloved fan favourite character into a villain? Or murdering another beloved character in such a traumatic fashion?

Excellent season of TV in my opinion. i must be the only guy on this BBS that thought Buffy was great from start to finish.
Well, I'm not a guy, but I think that Buffy was great from start to finish. :) Even season 1, which was the weakest IMO (I don't hate season 4 like many do).

I love season 6. It's one of my favorites on the show. I can see why it's polarizing, but the reasons why some people hate it are exactly the reasons why I love it. In fact, I watched seasons on 1-3 on TV many years ago (the TV channel that was showing it in my country stopped broadcasting Buffy after season 3), and I loved the show, but it wasn't one of my absolute all-time favorites. A few years later, I saw the whole show and it became one of my favorite shows ever. So, I think I can safely say that in some ways I prefer the 'adult' years to the high school years, especially 5-7. It's probably better than I only saw the later seasons when I did, because I had by that time experienced some things that made me relate to the show even more. (Season 5 resonated a lot because of the two worst things that had ever happened to me: my mother dying of cancer, and finding one of my best friends dead while he was staying at my place.) I related to the high school years a lot too, but not to that extent.

One of the things that I enjoyed in particular in the later seasons is seeing the characters change. I love shows that don't have reset buttons and feature actual character development, that put heroes through the wringer and let them fail and make mistakes and show the darker sides of their personalities.

There were some things I didn't like in season 6 - "Doublemeat Palace" was lame, and so was the whole "Riley is TEH AWESOME!" attitude in "As You Were", and the placement of lighter/standalone episodes right before or after some of the darkest episodes just felt incongruous... But that has happened in pretty much every season.

But overall I loved the season, I loved that it took risks and went to some really dark places, and that it was all about people trying to cope with real life, I loved that it didn't shy away from showing just how flawed the main characters were and having them act like monsters at times, even having one of them become the season's ultimate Big Bad. The main villains were all humans for once, and I think it was brilliant that the main villains for the most of the season were a trio of former high school outcasts/losers who couldn't cope with the real life and real relationships... while our protagonists, another trio of former high school outcasts trying to grow up (and left without their paternal figure for once), were struggling with their demons, messing up their relationships, acting extremely bad/weak/stupid at times, and being defeated by their old unresolved issues. In particular, I can't be the only one to notice the striking Warren - Willow parallel in the last few episodes (and I thought that long before I saw S7 "Killer in Me"): both former high-school nerds who got addicted to (supernatural) power in order not to feel small and insignificant anymore, and become destructive and homicidal in the process (not to mention that they both used brainwashing to get back/keep their girlfriends from leaving them - though of course, I'm not saying that Willow was anywhere as bad and creepy as Warren).
 
It's my least favourite season. It's not terrible, but mainly I don't favour it as an awful lot of it is just simply bland
 
I didn't like it. I think part of the reason it was different in a bad way was because at the time, Whedon stepped down as executive producer and the show had already used up most of its best ideas. I wouldn't blame the person who took over, though. It's like season 9 of "The Simpsons" - the reason it started the show's decline wasn't because Mike Scully was a terrible showrunner. It was already played out by then, I think it would have started to suck even with someone else running the show. The last two episodes of Buffy season six were very satisfying, but most of the rest wasn't so impressive. They did a good job of building to an epic finale, and as a villain, Willow was definitely way better than Glory and more fun to watch.

There were also a few decent, almost self-contained episodes in there ("Life Serial", which is basically just the nerds fucking around, and "Normal Again", which is like a 'what if' scenario), but I hate the story arcs. I think Buffy and Spike having a relationship was a huge mistake and I'll never buy it as plausible (even as an abusive relationship). They gave Spike some beautiful dialog to try to sell it, but I still wasn't buying it. I hated how they destroyed Xander and Anya's relationship too. Whedon pretty much admitted in interviews that he never wants to let characters in a relationship stay happy because that's boring, but I grew bored of him constantly ruining relationships to make them more 'interesting' years ago. The couples were a lot more interesting together than they were after his contrived ways of splitting them up. Riley and Oz's departures in earlier seasons felt natural, but the Spike/Buffy, Willow/Tara, and Xander/Anya season six stuff was just forced.

I hated the musical episode too. I don't know why people make such a big deal about it. Just because it's a unique 'gimmick' episode doesn't automatically make it classic. I like some musicals, but I didn't like seeing the characters that way. I'd rather see them bouncing great dialog off each other and doing some solid, natural acting rather than strutting about in a phony-looking musical with corny songs. I enjoyed the other gimmick episodes (silent and dream), but not this one.
 
As much as I hate Season Six, I absolutely loved the musical episode. Great songs. Great use of the format. One of the best eps. I wonder if they spent the entire summer working on the musical to the neglect of the season proper and that's why it suffered so, because it certainly sounded like the entire summer break was spent working on the songs.
 
I think Buffy and Spike having a relationship was a huge mistake and I'll never buy it as plausible (even as an abusive relationship).
As they say: your mileage may vary...

Interesting fact: I saw seasons 4-7 a few years after I saw 1-3; one of the things I got spoiled on in the meantime was that there was going to be *something* between Buffy and Spike, and I immediately thought "Yeah, I can see that." I never actually thought there was going to be a story like that and I wasn't giving it much thought, but I always kind of felt that the characters had more chemistry than any of the actual couples on the show. They seemed oddly similar in some ways - direct, impulsive, snarky, boisterous, no patience for rules and rituals. I remember that, no matter how much I liked Buffy/Angel storyline in the early seasons, I thought at some points(certainly in season 2 finale) "Isn't it odd that she has more sparks with the guy who's been trying to kill her for quite a while than with her boyfriend?"

Personally I think that it was brilliant that the show actually went there, and didn't hold back on all the dark and disturbing aspects. Of course it was gonna be edgy and controversial stuff - all the reason for me to love the show even more...
 
I think Buffy and Spike having a relationship was a huge mistake and I'll never buy it as plausible (even as an abusive relationship).
As they say: your mileage may vary...

Interesting fact: I saw seasons 4-7 a few years after I saw 1-3; one of the things I got spoiled on in the meantime was that there was going to be *something* between Buffy and Spike, and I immediately thought "Yeah, I can see that." I never actually thought there was going to be a story like that and I wasn't giving it much thought, but I always kind of felt that the characters had more chemistry than any of the actual couples on the show. They seemed oddly similar in some ways - direct, impulsive, snarky, boisterous, no patience for rules and rituals. I remember that, no matter how much I liked Buffy/Angel storyline in the early seasons, I thought at some points(certainly in season 2 finale) "Isn't it odd that she has more sparks with the guy who's been trying to kill her for quite a while than with her boyfriend?"

Yeah, they had chemistry all right...as enemies, and I just don't think that naturally transfers to romantic chemistry. I loved the way they interacted as enemies...obviously they were similar in ways that helped make these interactions so fascinating. That doesn't mean them becoming lovers makes a lick of sense. It's like Batman and The Joker. In many ways, they are so alike. They're both people who operate outside the law and follow their own instincts rather than societal norms as they're motivated by psychological problems/past traumas. They're both stubborn, obsessive, and passionate, but the difference is, one's actions are for justice and the other's are for chaos. So they're obviously made for each other...that doesn't mean it would make sense for them to start having sex.

Buffy and Spike are much the same. I like some of the Spike and Buffy relationship stuff before it became real. Like when everyone was under Willow's spell in "Something Blue" and Buffy tells Riley something like, "I think we fought all those years because we were hiding how we really felt about each other". That was funny. What was funny was how ridiculous the idea was. It was also funny when Spike got a crush on Buffy and she would just look nauseated or call him a pig when he'd tell her he loves her or try to impress her by doing stuff like refraining from biting disaster victims.

Then, the writers actually expected us to really seriously believe Buffy might have been on to something with that line about hiding their true feelings through hostility? Absurd. I just can't understand how two people who hated each other so much could possibly end up having any kind of relationship, even an unhealthy one. The idea started as a joke, and should have stayed that way. It never deserved to be anything more. I didn't mind when he was in love with her and she was rejecting him. It was amusing when she was trying to figure out why he liked her and said, "I beat him up a lot, maybe to him that's like second base".

Him having a crush on her and her being grossed out by it was okay, but when she actually gave in, I think that's when the show pretty much 'jumped the shark' for me. I always liked the Spike character and the acting of James Marsters. I understand why, after originally being a one shot character, the writers kept coming up with ways to bring him back. The chip thing was a bit contrived, but I was able to go with it. It fit into the Initiative arc well.

Spike as a love interest for Buffy, though, was one contrivance too many. To me, it just smacked of the writers running out of ideas. 'Well, we've run through two Buffy boyfriends. We don't have anything else for Spike to do, but we want her in a couple and we want to keep him around. Two birds, one stone, let's just put them together!' I think Spike's feelings lead to some cool moments as long his love was unrequited (loved the scene where Riley threatens him, for example), but once Buffy indulged him at all, yikes! It seems they couldn't leave Buffy and Willow single on this show (see also Tara, who never needed to be anything more than a friend, and Kennedy, one of the most lazily conceived and forced love interests ever). I liked Buffy's speech about how she needed quality time with herself at the end of "I Was Made to Love You". It was realistic and mature. I hate how they just undid that for Spike.
 
Yeah, they had chemistry all right...as enemies, and I just don't think that naturally transfers to romantic chemistry. I loved the way they interacted as enemies...obviously they were similar in ways that helped make these interactions so fascinating. That doesn't mean them becoming lovers makes a lick of sense. It's like Batman and The Joker. In many ways, they are so alike. They're both people who operate outside the law and follow their own instincts rather than societal norms as they're motivated by psychological problems/past traumas. They're both stubborn, obsessive, and passionate, but the difference is, one's actions are for justice and the other's are for chaos. So they're obviously made for each other...that doesn't mean it would make sense for them to start having sex.
Funny you mention Batman, since what you've described has its own Television Trope and it's called Dating Catwoman.

Spike as a love interest for Buffy, though, was one contrivance too many. To me, it just smacked of the writers running out of ideas. 'Well, we've run through two Buffy boyfriends. We don't have anything else for Spike to do, but we want her in a couple and we want to keep him around. Two birds, one stone, let's just put them together!'
Actually, Joss Whedon first toyed with the idea during season 4, and it might have been the actors who first put the idea into his head. In an early S4 interview with Sarah Michelle Gellar, she said Joss had asked her who could be Buffy's new boyfriend now that Angel was gone, and she said that she wanted it to be Spike, but Joss said that maybe having her date another vampire would be too much. James Marsters said that he always played Spike's interest in Buffy as being somewhat sexual and that when he was told Spike would be revealed to be in love with Buffy, he told Joss that he had been hoping for that but was afraid it would be too 'presumptuous'. By "Something Blue", the writers seemed to be toying with the idea, and by season 5 they had decided to have a Buffy/Spike storyline (though I don't know how much was decided already) - and that's when they had the Buffy/Riley breakup, which, if you remember, Spike had some involvement in, reinforcing Riley's insecurities and the idea that Buffy could never be fully satisfied with a normal human who didn't have something of a 'monster' in him. So, it's not like they went through two boyfriends as you said, it's that they set up a Riley/Spike contrast since the beginning of season 5.

Also, the season 5 premiere "Buffy vs Dracula" was full of hints about Buffy's dark side and her attraction to vampires (and the strain it put on her relationship with Riley).

Then, the writers actually expected us to really seriously believe Buffy might have been on to something with that line about hiding their true feelings through hostility? Absurd. I just can't understand how two people who hated each other so much could possibly end up having any kind of relationship, even an unhealthy one. The idea started as a joke, and should have stayed that way. It never deserved to be anything more. I didn't mind when he was in love with her and she was rejecting him. It was amusing when she was trying to figure out why he liked her and said, "I beat him up a lot, maybe to him that's like second base".
And nobody in the room thought or dared to ask her: "So... if that's what you think, why do you beat him up so much, Buffy?" ;)

Also, some other interesting questions, like why did she get so freaked out when he first said he was in love with her that she revoked the invitation to the Summers house for the first and only time (she never bothered to do that since the season 2 finale) - she was apparently more scared of him being in love with her than she was of him trying to kill her (as in early season 4)?

Sorry, but I never ever bought that she was just "disgusted" by the idea of the two of them together. The way Buffy's behavior with Spike was written and portrayed, especially season 4-5, with overstated hostility, a lot of unnecessary aggression and too many angry protestations of disgust and hate, you just couldn't help thinking "she doth protest too much". Of course she wouldn't ever consciously contemplate the idea under the normal circumstances. But the show put her in the circumstances and psychological state where it was believable, IMO. And she was still deeply tormented and disgusted by herself. It's not like they made it into a fluffy romance a la "Something Blue", which was something that could have only happened under the spell. I understand that a lot of people have fun with the idea of a 'bad guy' crushing on the heroine but prefer the heroine to retain her proper and savory image. But really, that's more of a stereotype than you realize, and a very old one - it goes back to the 18th century sentimental and Gothic novels where the chaste heroines were pursued by lustful villains but never gave up their virtue.

Then, the writers actually expected us to really seriously believe Buffy might have been on to something with that line about hiding their true feelings through hostility? Absurd.
Unless you remember what Buffy (at that point fully sane and not under any spell) told Willow earlier in the same episode - while discussing Riley:

Buffy: I don't know. I really like being around him, you know? And I think he cares about me.. but.. I just.. feel like something's missing.
Willow: He's not making you miserable?
Buffy: Exactly. Riley seems so solid. Like he wouldn't cause me heartache.
Willow: (Fake worry) Get out. Get out while there's still time.
Buffy: I know.. I have to get away from that bad boy thing. There's no good there. Seeing Angel in LA.. even for five minutes.. hello to the pain.
Willow: The pain is not a friend.
Buffy: But I can't help thinking — isn't that where the fire comes from? Can a nice, safe relationship be that intense? I know it's nuts, but.. part of me believes that real love and passion have to go hand in hand with pain and fighting.

(Suddenly a vampire jumps out from behind a bush. Buffy stakes him without so much as looking the other way. He crumbles to dust and she and Willow continue on their way)

Buffy: I wonder where I get that from.
Is that messed up? Yes. Absurd? For people with healthier experiences and outlook on love/sex, probably. But there are plenty of people who keep being drawn to dysfunctional and messed up relationships, and Buffy always seemed a bit like that.

That episode was full of 'absurd' things that seem like foreshadowing of the later storyline. Like broken-hearted Willow becoming vindictive, and starting using magic too much to fix all her problems.
 
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I particularly like Xander's line in (I think) Season 6, where he goes, "Is this some sort of blind spot for you Summers women?!" He could never understand why Joyce, Dawn, and Buffy all seemed to like and trust Spike.
 
Season 6 was pretty good for the most part and I enjoyed it, even though it got pretty depressing/sad in places.

High Points:
Obviously the musical...top 5 episode of Buffy ever.
Tabula Rosa - One of the funniest Buffy's ever
The Nerd Trio - pretty hilarious in places and still managed to be somewhat dangerous
The darker places some of the characters got to in their post-college experience....can be pretty realistic in adjusting to life
Tara's death - very powerful
Willow as the bad guy - also very powerful and interesting to watch
Xander/Anya up until Hell's Bells.

Low Points:
Doublemeat palace crap - boring
Magic = Drugs, but only for season 6. Magic is used constantly throughout the first 5 seasons (and season 7) as though it were a powerful tool - one to be yielded responsibly like any other powerful thing, but a powerful tool. All of a sudden - and just for Season 6 - it's suddenly "addicting", it causes "withdraw" and gets one "high". One of the most retarded things a Buffy storyline has ever introduced right next to the Turok Hon being these almost invincible uber vamps early in the season (7) where Buffy can barely defeat one where at the end, anybody including Anya and Xander can beat them. :wtf:
- Finally, and perhaps most egregious, the arbitrary breaking up of Xander/Anya because Joss was Lazy (capital L on purpose) and though that couples who stayed together were always boring. Lame. They could have been just as interesting together and married and Anya's death would have meant so much more in Season 7. As it was, it was sort of just a footnote which was also very lame.

All in All, Season 6 was pretty strong, very funny and had the musical so that puts it ahead of Seasons 1, 4, 7 and perhaps even 5. It wasn't as strong as Seasons 2 or 3 but was very enjoyable,nevertheless.
 
- Finally, and perhaps most egregious, the arbitrary breaking up of Xander/Anya because Joss was Lazy (capital L on purpose) and though that couples who stayed together were always boring. Lame. They could have been just as interesting together and married and Anya's death would have meant so much more in Season 7. As it was, it was sort of just a footnote which was also very lame.
I didn't have a problem with the Xander/Anya breakup in season 6. I could buy that, despite having matured a lot during the last couple of seasons, Xander still had too many issues stemming from his own dysfunctional family and his old insecurities. He still had lapses into his old behavior. (Including one of the things that always annoyed me about him - his habit of being judgmental about Buffy's love life, even though he wasn't the most unbiased person out there considering his early crush on her and rejection.) He only really seemed to really have grown up in season 7.

I did, however, have a problem with Xander and Anya not getting back together in season 7, even though they seemed to be going that way. When they had sex in "Touched", I thought that was it, and then she said it was the sign it was really over between them. :wtf: That didn't make sense. It just seemed like dysfunctionality for its own sake. What I liked the most about Xander/Anya was that they were always having lots of kinky sex, but in a healthy and fun way, without the Buffy/Spike angst, power games and emotional abuse. The way they ended it in "Touched", together with everything else on the show, came dangerously close to suggesting that sex is always bad and destructive and that the only way to have a meaningful relationship is to just cuddle and have a spiritual connection. :rolleyes:
 
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