A few notes on Voyager re-watch

[Kaelef]

I (re) watched Voyager over the course of the last month or so, after only seeing maybe 1/6 of the episodes during their original run. A few observations I wanted to share:

• I lost interest in Voyager early in its original run, so the opinion I had of it was quite low. Overall, however, I was pleasantly surprised to find that it was comparable to TNG, and probably had longer runs without any bad episodes than TNG ever managed (seasons 5 and 6 of VOY were almost spotless).
• When VOY was good, it was certainly as good as TNG.
• Voyager had a terrible first season. Worse than TNG's first season. This is probably why I lost interest in it originally. Keep in mind that by this point, our expectations were much higher, having seen both TNG and DS9 develop into good shows. There was nothing wrong with VOY's first season acting or production values, so I can only blame the first set of writers or the assumptions they were working under. It was bad enough that I considered not watching the rest of the show.
• I think VOY experienced the greatest improvement of any Trek series from the first to the second season. While the second season was still "clunky", it's not only watchable, but has some of the series' best "hardcore scifi" episodes.
• I liked Janeway from the beginning, but her character changed significantly at some point part-way through the third season. She started acting a bit more erratic. She was awkwardly jokey at times. I disagreed with her position more often. Even her hair changed. I still liked the character, but not as much as I used to, and I found the change jarring.
• The series had an annoying number of mutiny episodes. It started to feel like "Voyager's Mutiny of the Week". Had I been in Janeway's shoes, I'm not sure I would've left the doctor running after the number of bad choices he made.
• I was impressed with the improvement in the CGI and other effects in the show as it went on. Certainly the last couple of seasons show a marked improvement over the first couple. It's too bad re-creating these effects for HD will likely never be financially viable.
• Although season 7 wasn't as good as the seasons that perceeded it, it didn't have the major drop-off in quality that TNG had.
• I was disappointed the writers gave up on Kess - there was a lot of potential there (and "Fury" was one of the only bad episodes in S6) - but they did a better job with 7/9 than I expected. Although 7/9's looks were certainly flaunted, her character wasn't played in the sexist way her looks might suggest.
• The writers never came up with a way to show us how Voyager's signature "bio-neural circuitry" gave it any sort of an advantage over any other starship we're familiar with. If anything, it was a weakness on several occasions.
  
• I could've done without the episodes that focused on Barclay and Troi.
  
• Neelix's last scene - and especially Tuvok's role in it - was a real tear-jerker.

So, yeah, overall I enjoyed the show quite a bit - certainly much more than I expected, and about on par with TNG. DS9 is still my favorite, and I'll always be a TOS die-hard, but VOY is no longer the distant-fourth-place it once was.

 

[Refuge]

I nodded to practically all of that. Nice to see an overview from both the story, acting, and productions aspects. It is interesting how Voyager appeals .. like almost fresh or at least independent, when you see it after its original run. I get what you're saying.. it goes up a level. There was a cluster of shows both Trek and other science fiction all at once, and that kind of invited comparison. To see it (Voyager) for its own worth is a good way to enjoy it.

 

[Kaelef]

I nodded to practically all of that. Nice to see an overview from both the story, acting, and productions aspects. It is interesting how Voyager appeals .. like almost fresh or at least independent, when you see it after its original run. I get what you're saying.. it goes up a level. There was a cluster of shows both Trek and other science fiction all at once, and that kind of invited comparison. To see it (Voyager) for its own worth is a good way to enjoy it.

There's a lot to be said for watching shows in a compressed time frame like this. You see the connections, back-references, and character arcs more clearly. Of course, you also see mistakes and discrepancies more clearly...

The premise for Voyager is pretty daring, as it not only foisted a new set of characters on us, but also a new universe around those characters in the form of new species and locations. And the writers were forced to come up with new species and give up old ones as Voyager made its journey. This was good in many respects (the Kazon were pretty annoying) and unfortunate in others (I would've loved to have seen more develop with Species 8472 after the events in "In the Flesh" made them far more interesting). Of course, they cheated a good amount by sticking with the tried-and-true Borg.

 

[cosmic mouse]

Hey Kaelef, since I'm currently working my way through this series for the first time I like your comments on it. I agree on season 1, maybe not terrible, but it's certainly my least favorite so far and I'm almost done with season 4, so good to see you praise s5 and 6. I also agree on Janeway though my opinion may change by the end. She's my 2nd favorite character, but I liked her more in the earlier seasons vs where I'm currently at in the show. Her character is taking a bit of a different turn, with the series changes they made, but she's still my favorite Starfleet captain I think.

 

[at Quark's]

Voyager had a terrible first season. Worse than TNG's first season. This is probably why I lost interest in it originally. Keep in mind that by this point, our expectations were much higher, having seen both TNG and DS9 develop into good shows. There was nothing wrong with VOY's first season acting or production values, so I can only blame the first set of writers or the assumptions they were working under. It was bad enough that I considered not watching the rest of the show.
I think VOY experienced the greatest improvement of any Trek series from the first to the second season. While the second season was still "clunky", it's not only watchable, but has some of the series' best "hardcore scifi" episodes.

In general, I like early VOY more than late VOY. This because at the beginning of the show, they still tried to go for an original premise, an attitude I felt had largely evaporated in later years. So I'm curious, what writing specifically makes S1 outstandingly bad to you, and in what way did it improve by the time of S2?

I was impressed with the improvement in the CGI and other effects in the show as it went on. Certainly the last couple of seasons show a marked improvement over the first couple. It's too bad re-creating these effects for HD will likely never be financially viable.

Certainly, though I'd have to add that it was helped by rapidly improving CGI technology. You see the same thing when looking at 'contemporary' scifi shows like DS9 or B5 (and even in TNG already).

I was disappointed the writers gave up on Kess - there was a lot of potential there (and "Fury" was one of the only bad episodes in S6) - but they did a better job with 7/9 than I expected. Although 7/9's looks were certainly flaunted, her character wasn't played in the sexist way her looks might suggest.

I felt she was played in a sexist way, but in the way of the 'innocent blonde bombshell that doesn't know (or in her case: care) how sexy she is'. Though I'm no fan of 7 of 9 as a character, I'll admit that she had numerous qualities apart from that.

I could've done without the episodes that focused on Barclay and Troi.

Agreed, felt a bit like hitching on TNG's popularity. Though I do like they showed some of the efforts on the home front to get them home, as well.

Neelix's last scene - and especially Tuvok's role in it - was a real tear-jerker.

Agreed on this as well.

 

[Sophie74656]

I have to ask about all of the mutinys you mention.

 

[Thomas Eugene]

I could've done without the episodes that focused on Barclay and Troi.

Interesting that you should say this. Though I don't like TNG (and consequently know it a lot less than VOY), I've always thought that Troi was a lot more useful as a character on VOY than on TNG. If people criticize Seven for how she was the sexy babe on the show, what do they think of Troi? Don't misunderstand me, she is a nice woman and like Kes she added a lot of warmth to TNG, but as far as I remember she didn't do much else. Seven, on the other hand, turned out to be one of the best Star Trek characters in my book.
I don't remember what Barclay was like on TNG - I guess pretty much the same as on VOY - but he was always good on VOY. I felt he served a purpose, it was just natural that a crazy guy like him would find some kind of new obsession (after his addiction to the holodeck and God knows what other "ailments") and I think that putting him in the role of the Starfleet officer who relates to the fate of the Voyager crew to the point of going mad fitted his personality.

All in all, I thought that including Barclay and Troi on VOY was a good move - it also gave a sense of continuity. And this despite the fact that I don't like TNG. I wish they'd made a stronger connection between VOY and DS9 - that would or at least could have been awesome.

 

[Sophie74656]

Interesting that you should say this. Though I don't like TNG (and consequently know it a lot less than VOY), I've always thought that Troi was a lot more useful as a character on VOY than on TNG. If people criticize Seven for how she was the sexy babe on the show, what do they think of Troi? Don't misunderstand me, she is a nice woman and like Kes she added a lot of warmth to TNG, but as far as I remember she didn't do much else. Seven, on the other hand, turned out to be one of the best Star Trek characters in my book.
I don't remember what Barclay was like on TNG - I guess pretty much the same as on VOY - but he was always good on VOY. I felt he served a purpose, it was just natural that a crazy guy like him would find some kind of new obsession (after his addiction to the holodeck and God knows what other "ailments") and I think that putting him in the role of the Starfleet officer who relates to the fate of the Voyager crew to the point of going mad fitted his personality.

All in all, I thought that including Barclay and Troi on VOY was a good move - it also gave a sense of continuity. And this despite the fact that I don't like TNG. I wish they'd made a stronger connection between VOY and DS9 - that would or at least could have been awesome.

Deanna was supposed to be the sex symbol of TNG. That's why she was hardly in an actual uniform and always wore those outfits. I did enjoy her on Voyager though. Just an observation about Pathfinder...look at Deana's uniform vs anyone else. Her uniform is a tight one piece body suit. Everyone else has a two piece looser fitting uniform.

 

[Prax]

I have to ask about all of the mutinys you mention.

He probably is referring to individual mutinies, like when the EMH goes off on holographic rights crusades, or when Seven is disobedient...Or when Tom Paris commits acts of terrorism on water planets.

 

[Sophie74656]

He probably is referring to individual mutinies, like when the EMH goes off on holographic rights crusades, or when Seven is disobedient...Or when Tom Paris commits acts of terrorism on water planets.

not really a mutiny

 

[Prax]

Mutinsubordination?

 

[Sophie74656]

insubordination yes, but hardly a mutiny

 

[Prax]

Mutiny you!!!

 

[Sophie74656]

Mutiny me? mutiny you! mutiny everyone!

 

[tomswift2002]

I would have to disagree with the CGI. "Blink Of An Eye" (or is it "Wink Of An Eye---one is a TOS episode, one is a Voyager episode) had the worst CGI of the series. Voyager looked like the Enterprise in Season 3 of TOS where it had gone through about 20 generations of optical processing and was no longer grey, but was white (with no trace of a nearby star).