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I think the enormity of a 70 year old media franchise and the things that have trickled through over the decades might be coloring your perceptions here. In the grand scheme of things it's not really normal to be able to see deleted scenes from movies. The vast majority of what we have is thanks...

There's not a lot cut out of III and IV, but there are a few things. Off the top of my head, for Search For Spock: McCoy enters the turbolift Kirk got into at the end of the first scene on the bridge and he's already acting weird. A shot or two of Valkris wearing a veil and/or mask and removing...

Off the coast of Alaska, remember. Though I can't say for sure whether that's any more realistic a place for Finnish whalers to be hanging around. :shrug:

Scotty: "I bet that Klingon bitch killed her father." Spock: "Her own father?" Valeris: "It is an old story, sir." Scotty: "Take my word. She did not shed one bloody death howl!"

I posted this in another thread a while back, and this thread's just screaming for a return engagement. So here's some more The Voyage Horner for your listening/ viewing pleasure.

Some more international flavor (flavour?) for The Voyage Home: Star Trek IV! UK trailer:

It's mystifying how the entire international cut (it had its own title and everything !) is very nearly lost to time at this point. I made a post of my own about it not too long ago (shameless plug): https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/the-voyage-home-star-trek-iv-the-1987-international-version.314449/

My take on various legs of this octopus of a conversation: No they were not making a "redshirt" joke Someone on the production had the good sense to give Bones' line "He's dead already" to Scotty so as not to remind anybody of Bones' catchphrase "He's dead, Jim!" which shows both that they were...

... .......... ........why would he need to take off his jacket...?

Well, for whatever it's worth, at least humans are not alone in this time-honored folly...

The "Never Noticed That Before" thread comes through with some more spine-tingling details of the terrifying TWOK!

I'm thinking it must be a coincidence; there's only one that really looks like a skull and I can't for the life of me imagine why it would be there on purpose. Still, that's certainly something! :eek:

I mentioned before (maybe a couple times) the interpretation that makes the most sense to me is that Kirk absolutely refused to give up persuing a life of a starship captain (that would have potentially kept him out of David's life for years at a time) - in fact, I'm thinking he broke up with...

What book is this, by the way? It's always stuck out to me that video stores used to put "Fantasy, Sci-Fi, Horror" together in the same section. There are some war and crime films that are arguably as gruesome and disquieting as horror, but it does seem like being a "horror movie" requires an...

And that's fine. I'm mostly saying that my perspective isn't so much working retroactively from TNG-onwards but more that the placement of the Valkris scene so early created a powerful impression on how I viewed the Klingons and their actions through the rest of the movie (namely, they're...

Good points, both of you. I wasn't necessarily concerned whether it was the explicit intention of the filmmakers to "soften" the Klingons or not, just that this is where you can point to their portrayal starting to shift. (Though for whatever it's worth, they could've very easily modified the...

Kruge's introduction with Valkris is interesting because I'd say this is precisely the moment Star Trek starts shifting the Klingons into "noble (by their own definition at least) warrior race." Kruge isn't angry with Valkris and doesn't take any enjoyment from ordering her death, and she...

I think that's fair. I wouldn't want a full-on Star Trek horror movie, either. I like that TWOK keeps it to bits and pieces (like I said, it's never registered to me as a "dark movie" overall) and I think First Contact had the right idea to present its horror-style scenes with a bit of a wink to...

I definitely suspect there's a lot of Meyer's personal aesthetic bleeding into the film here (no pun intended). I recall reading someone from the production (I forget which film) claim that Meyer enjoys using copious amounts of blood in his movies, which checks out as his two Star Trek entries...

Speaking of the show, the more I think about it the likely reason TWOK could get away with dipping its toes (and somtimes its whole foot) into horror water is because so many episodes of the show have setups similar to horror stories: so many of them are mysteries involving freaky space...