It would have been particularly interesting to see Picard's reaction on Sisko embracing his Emissary role over the years ('I know I asked you to do everything to bring Bajor into the Federation but I'm not sure I intended you to take it this far').
What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?
- Thread starter Amasov
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If Ti-Ho sounds too silly and Yorktown suggests something too gruesome, what about FASA's solution; that it was the USS Atlantis (NCC-1786), a newly completed ship which was hastily renamed "Enterprise" following Kirk's trial?
http://trekipedia.com/file/U.S.S._Enterprise_NCC-1701-A_(FASA)#cite_note-FASA2224-1
In point of fact, Sisko was born to be the Emissary ("Orb of the Emissary"). He didn't "allow himself to become a religious figure," it was his destiny, as ensured by time-traveling wormhole aliens.
And because time is meaningless to them and Sisko was the one who taught them about the concept, it's very possible Sisko started the whole thing of the Prophets assuring his birth. He might have already been born regardless, but the difference after his encounter (or a possibility, his 'penance' after "SACRIFICE OF ANGELS") was to be part Prophet.
They have shown to be able to cause changes with people remembering BOTH the before and after version. (Kira remembering the unfinished Akorem poem in "ACCESSION", for instance).
I'm with Janeway... time travel gives me a headache.
Works for me. Also has the advantage of being another space shuttle name.
That depends on when it became a training vessel. Given how much later TWOK was after TMP, it could have been active for almost 10 years or more.
One of the few occasions in Starfleet where I could imagine such an early depreciation actually making some sense would be with the NX-01. After Federation Starfleet is formed, there being a veritable influx of new (alien) technologies and design philosophies, making the NX-01 obsolete overnight to such an extent even refitting her wasn't worth it anymore.
We know the refit took 18 months.
We know Khan was marooned by Kirk 15 years prior to TWOK.
So the suggestion of almost 10 years seems reasonable.
I agree with this. It might the only occasion where it makes complete sense.
Kirk hadn't logged any time in space for 2.5 years which I assume is when he left the Enterprise for promotion. The 18 month refit may have started one year into his desk job. The longest that the Enterprise Refit could be in service is 15 years - 2.5 years = 12.5 years.
I literally used to have a spreadsheet with all of this.
15 years from Space Seed, not from the end of the FYM. If we make the not unreasonable assumption that there are at least two more years of FYM after Space Seed (was that at the beginning? The middle? Where is TAS?) then that adjusts the math.
Then Bennet / Nimoy wanted to tell a story where the crew and ship are old and ready to be put out to pasture. We get dumb lines that the Enterprise is 20 years old. By what math?
One could disregard the line in TWOK and interpret Morrow's line to mean it's been 20 years since the refit. The TWOK math works better but the TSFS gives more scope (and might even allow another captain in the middle somewhere). It makes more sense for TSFS but TSFS makes less sense than TWOK (that takes effort) so I go with TWOK. Most days.
In any event there is no reason to retire either the 1701 or the 1701A because of age. These are starships, not Hollywood actors.
Yeah, the dialogue in TWOK states that they’re training new crew specifically for Enterprise, she’s not supposed to be a training vessel attached to the Academy. This is probably related to Bennett’s ideas that they might need to move on from the original crew down the road, which is why they introduced characters like Saviik and David Marcus.
I wonder if the idea that Enterprise’s days were now numbered in ST3 was an attempt to soften the repercussions of her destruction later in the film. Kirk wouldn’t be in as much trouble with Starfleet in following movies for destroying a ship that was going to be scrapped anyway.
I ignore what Marrow said as a stupid line. Just like I ignore "the time barrier's been broken!" in "The Cage". Or, more recently, I ignore the Chaetae Picard bottles that say 2401, since it makes more sense for PIC Season 2 to start off in 2400.
For planning to decommission the Refit Enterprise and the Enterprise-A, they must have bullshit insurance agents for Starfleet in the Late-23rd Century. "Oh! This is more damaged than what we calculate the repair to be worth. Decommission her! It's totaled!" "No, it's not!" "Yes it is!" "Scotty said the Enterprise could be fixed in two weeks! Is it REALLY totaled or do you just not want to fix it?!"
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The Eugenics Wars for one episode of the franchise being around 2173 and no character in-story challenges the Starfleet Admiral's statement being one of the most egregious examples of the dialogue not having been fact-checked before the final shooting script went to print. You just ignore it, assume the character is rounding off or bad at history or both or just figure it's a real world error on the part of the writer and roll with it. If the rest of the scene works then you can just shrug and blow it off.
Every great civilization has collapsed to some degree or another. Some fade from history while others rebuild and rise from the ashes to rewrite a new history.
Will this ever happen to the Federation? A common thread to collapse is over expansion creating the need to become all things to all people, a shell game which offers nothing to no one except illusion.
Of course this will never happen to the Federation, they are perfect with a ridged set of regulations. RIGHT?
The controversial part....
In order for the Star Trek franchise to survive they must explore the recreation of their empire.
The generation After the Fall not bound by Trek Cannon because the Federation is gone, history.
I liked Capt. Sisko because he was a little outside of the sand box, others may consider him unfit for the office yet an Avery Brooks would be perfect to shape an outpost of humans back to humanity in an era when everything needs to be rediscovered.
Captain Picard's great grandson could be the tailor running around yelling "Make it Sew" (kidding, I'll end the rant on that note.)
Will this ever happen to the Federation? A common thread to collapse is over expansion creating the need to become all things to all people, a shell game which offers nothing to no one except illusion.
Of course this will never happen to the Federation, they are perfect with a ridged set of regulations. RIGHT?
The controversial part....
In order for the Star Trek franchise to survive they must explore the recreation of their empire.
The generation After the Fall not bound by Trek Cannon because the Federation is gone, history.
I liked Capt. Sisko because he was a little outside of the sand box, others may consider him unfit for the office yet an Avery Brooks would be perfect to shape an outpost of humans back to humanity in an era when everything needs to be rediscovered.
Captain Picard's great grandson could be the tailor running around yelling "Make it Sew" (kidding, I'll end the rant on that note.)
My controversial take is that DS9 did far more deeper and richer world-building for the Trek universe than any previous or contemporaneous Trek series or film.
TOS is my all-time favorite Trek series but you're not wrong.
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