Spoilers Supergirl - Season 5

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by dahj, Jul 20, 2019.

  1. Marc

    Marc Fleet Admiral Premium Member

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    Probably something do with the rules for casting. IIRC if an actor appears in more than a certain number of episodes they get counted as main cast even if they only have few lines/small appearances in those episodes.

    Plus it helps making sure the performer is available when they're needed. If Andrea Brooks was simply down a guest star they'd have to negotiate with her agent etc when she's available for which episodes.
     
  2. Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME

    Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Ah alright. Thank you for the explanation. That being said, learning that their newly promoted actress got pregnant had to be pretty unexpected. Right the beginning of s5, Brooks pregnancy was visible through her outfits and in this episode, her curves were difficult to hide and it will not work out. Not to mention her absence after childbirth. There unfortunately, she will be totally unavailable for awhile (the importance of her character does not justify a quick return to the set for the actress).
     
  3. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Credits aren't about number of episodes or quantity of screen time, they're about actors' contracts and how much they get paid. Actors credited in the main titles as regulars are paid a regular's rates and get residuals from reruns and home video sales. (Everyone "above the line" -- credited in the opening -- gets residuals, while people billed only at the end do not.)


    Yes, that's the main reason for signing someone as a regular even with limited screen time.
     
  4. The Realist

    The Realist Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Another nicely observed analysis, particularly of Lena's character, actions, and motivations. Given the thundering Old Testament condemnation of her by certain gods hereabouts ;), your subtler evaluations are especially appreciated.
     
  5. CorporalClegg

    CorporalClegg Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Only if one completely ignores the text of the show.

    The three main plots of the season all revolve around 'mind control' and thought appropriation - or stealing a person's autonomy, with one equating it to murder. In other words, the text of the show literally states that what Lena did to Eve was murder and draws an obvious parallel between what J'onn did and what Lena is doing now.

    So ignoring a significant portion of the material so that it adheres to your preexisting belief isn't 'nicely observed analysis' at all. It's confirmation bias.
     
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  6. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Oh, nevermind how she was willing and actually killed Adam as part of her experiments last season. Yeah, she's a good one, all right.

    Eugenics is what she believes in and practices with her experiments. This is a character trait for her for (at least) two seasons running. Eugenics is one of the most evil philosophies / programs in human history, one that has cost the lives of millions, so try as you might, Lena--from wanting to create super soldiers last season, to merging Eve with the Hope A.I., (which has all but taken over Eve's true self until plot convenience dictates that its not) to experimenting on "improving" the minds of what she sees as inherent "flaws" in humankind's thinking, is not doing anything for the benefit of humans, but seeks to alter and control them.

    This plot has numerous precedents in real world history, and every ounce of it was and remains the beliefs and acts of evil.

    Further, you're reading wish fulfillment into Lea's character; her stopping J'onn's brother is not making her a heroine. She does not want him interrupting her plans, and J'onn's death would set all of her targets on alert (since they believed he had been sent away).

    Just go with it. Nia's powers are never going to be defined enough to justify what you just watched.

    All rational conclusions, but do not be shocked if Eve makes a running plot-contradicting, last second return to stop whatever Lena is about to unleash and/or prove she's a heroine after all.

    Yep.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2019
  7. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    I wouldn't go that far. If one character says something, that's just that one character's point of view, not necessarily the stance of the storytellers. After all, you've got no story if different characters don't perceive things differently. So J'onn's belief that what he did is tantamount to murder is meant to tell us about his feelings about his own actions. It doesn't automatically apply to Lena's actions.

    And Lena has been pretty adamant that she's not willing to kill. My impression is that Eve is still in there somewhere, just suppressed, and Lena intends to release her once she and Hope succeed at finding a way to remove people's violent urges. It's certainly a violation, but I don't think it's meant to be as irreversible as murder, or Lena wouldn't be willing to do it.
     
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  8. The Realist

    The Realist Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Nah. :p
    Yah. :techman:
     
  9. Enterprise is Great

    Enterprise is Great Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Andrea Brooks is pregnant. Her baby is due in three weeks.
     
  10. CorporalClegg

    CorporalClegg Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    It's how basic theme-building works.

    I thought you were a writer?

    To put it another way, if one character says 'Running red lights is wrong,' then the audience is simply meant to infer that character believes in rigid adherence to rules. If, however, we see another character run a red light during a story about [the necessity of] traffic laws, then the audience is meant to infer that the second character is in the wrong.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2019
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  11. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    Yes, which is why I know it's not as simplistic and mechanistic as you're assuming. "Basic" is for novices. It's the beginning of what you need to learn, not the end-all.

    Characters are not merely mouthpieces for stating themes. Theme is just one of the fundamentals of drama, along with plot, character, and setting. And if anything, modern serialized TV tends to prioritize plot and character arcs over theme.

    And it's the arc that matters here. What characters believe at the start of their journeys is often meant to be flawed or erroneous or incomplete, subject to evolution over the course of the story arc. After all, if they don't grow and change, if they start out with the final answer already, then there's no arc. So a character who starts a story believing he's done something irredeemably wrong (like J'onn) will generally end up learning that he can be forgiven after all. Conversely, if the storyteller's intent is that the character's actions were truly wrong, then the character will usually start out denying that (like Lena) and only come to accept it at the end of the arc. So you can't assume that what a character believes at the start of the season is meant to be their ultimate truth.
     
  12. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    John did the right thing.

    A biological superweapon used by the white Martians, just happed to he John's insane brother, who needed to be put down to avoid a genocide.

    Although didn't John have wipe the brother he just killed from existance to stop that sibling corbinite bullshit from killing John?
     
  13. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Nope, and as CorporalClegg pointed out, ignoring the plain as day writing of Lena (and her pro-eugenics philosophy/experiments over two seasons) is seeing something that is not presented on the show.
     
  14. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I finally watched the most recent episode, and it was OK.
    I got a liked seeing Phil Lamarr as Malefic, I mostly know him as a voice actor, so I always get a kick out of seeing him onscreen.
    I was a bit confused how exactly Dreamer's powers were able to stop the tidal wave. It looked like one fairly small beam but it stopped the whole tidal wave that was going to hit the entire west coast. I didn't realize she was supposed to be that powerful.
    It was pretty obvious that Riproar was William's friend the moment they showed the picture of him. When they said he had four arms, I was expecting something like the picture of the comics version on the last page, so I was a bit surprised it was just to Doctor Octopus mechanical tentacles, rather than actual arms.
    I found the back and forth with Andrea at the end a bit whiplash inducing, first she wasn't a bad guy, and then we get the reveal she is working for Leviathan. It just felt kind of weird the way it played out.
     
  15. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    I get the impression it's more that she's being coerced by Leviathan, much the way Eve has apparently been. They both seemed afraid of the elderly woman who seems to be the spokesperson for Leviathan.
     
  16. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah, I guess she did. I just felt a bit weird how we got the big scene with Kara and William realizing she wasn't the one behind the attack in Antarctica and then got the scene with her and the Leviathan lady. But I guess it was just that she wasn't the mastermind behind everything, not necessarily that she was not villain.
     
  17. Christopher

    Christopher Writer Admiral

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    As I said, I don't think she is a villain. I think she's being forced to work for the villains. There's a big difference.
     
  18. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    That could be it. Hopefully we'll find out more of what exactly her relationship is to Leviathan sometime soon.
     
  19. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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  20. Morpheus 02

    Morpheus 02 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I only saw the season premiere and will have no time to binge watch. Can someone let me know if there are any "essential" episodes I need to see for this season.