Let's talk about the elephant in the room, this series violates Roddenberry's vision big time

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by Sci-fi fan, Oct 4, 2017.

  1. Crazy Eddie

    Crazy Eddie Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The most talented actor in the world cannot turn a shitty role into something respectful, especially in television. A ridiculous minstrel character played by Peter Dinklage would still be a ridiculius minstrel character, which is the whole reason Peter Dinklage habitually refuses those kinds of roles. It's not because he's a bad actor, it's because the things that make a role demeaning are decided by people OTHER than the actor, people who have control over the final product and how it is edited as well.

    As it stands, Jeri Ryan was given far better material to work with than Jennifer Lien, and arguably better than half the main cast of the show. if Braga wanted to, he could have told her to talk with a high pitched voice and play her character like something out of Jersey Shore, and she would have to choose to either do what she's told, quit her job, or try to convince him to back off on that shit. She chose option 3. Which was an option that apparently Beltran and Wang didn't have (although Mulgrew did, because she's Kate Fucking Mulgrew)
     
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  2. cooleddie74

    cooleddie74 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The Wachowskis made the Matrix movies. The Coens made Fargo, The Big Lebowski and O Brother Where Art Thou? but I do get your point. :)
     
  3. Shaka Zulu

    Shaka Zulu Commodore Commodore

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    A vision that was more clear headed then the later one, which smacks of substance abuse.

    Which is why these people are using The Orville to beat up on Discovery.

    Worse than that-it was virtually incestuous, as it suggests that Winona Kirk was her son James's 'love instructor' (which I take to mean that she stripped to butt nekkidness, told Jim to do so, then showed him how to make love to a woman showing him what parts of him were to go into what parts of a woman! :wtf: Imagine if a father did that to his teenage daughter?)
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2017
  4. Refuge

    Refuge Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Actually it is almost common knowledge that Garret Wang was retained because of his image as well, having made People magazines 50 most beautiful. He's hardly a good example of an actor who didn't further his presence on a show because of his sexuality. His character may not have got rank beyond 'ensign' but Harry got story. I could name many, he just did not create the interest. Comparing two individuals working in a visual medium who might be 'hot' does not reduce what comes after, to the same thing.

    The Seven of Nine character was promoted way before any suggestions of a relationship were a reason for Seven being featured. That ship was sailing way before the actress and the producer got together. She was already more than a bimbo in a catsuit, just as 'Harry' was still carrying having Garret portray him.
     
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  5. Commishsleer

    Commishsleer Commodore Commodore

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    I thought it said that Winona named her son after her loved instructor. Still it was creepy enough that Kirk knew of that anyway.

    As for the ladies wearing skin-tight outfits. Everyone should be allowed to wear what they want without judgement or being attacked. My problem with Troi was not just that her boobs were hanging out (not that bad if she wasn't on duty) but that the camera was panning her chest in Season 1.
    T'Pol, Seven, Kira, Troi (mostly) acted professionally, saved the day on many an occasion no matter what they were wearing
     
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  6. cooleddie74

    cooleddie74 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The two times when T'Pol was most egregiously displayed as eye candy were the decon scene in "Broken Bow, Part II" and the pon farr subplot in "Bounty" which basically had a scantily-clad Jolene Blalock hanging off of and drooling all over John Billingsley for a good part of that episode. Had she been given more to do than just writhe in heat and moan that Phlox should mate with her to relieve her discomfort it wouldn't have been so bad, but that episode wasn't particularly kind to her character.
     
  7. The Mighty Monkey of Mim

    The Mighty Monkey of Mim Commodore Commodore

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    The decon scenes in ENT were generally pretty equally exploitative of both the female and male cast members, IIRC.
     
  8. cooleddie74

    cooleddie74 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Especially Trip. But T'Pol got the worst of it. ;)
     
  9. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk A Spock and a smile Premium Member

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    A Coen Brothers Matrix. Interesting.
     
  10. cooleddie74

    cooleddie74 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    It'd be more watchable than either of the two sequels.
     
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  11. Commishsleer

    Commishsleer Commodore Commodore

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    But probably in GRs vision...
     
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  12. cooleddie74

    cooleddie74 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Gene's vision was blocked by his own sweat and pairs of bare legs. ;)
     
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  13. Crazy Eddie

    Crazy Eddie Vice Admiral Admiral

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    That's kinda what I mean. Garret Wang was just a pretty face in the same way as Jeri Ryan initially was. But he wound up playing a highly forgettable and completely replaceable character whose background, development and personality are all but nonexistent. Which is literally what I meant when I said that if Garret Wang had been sleeping with Braga instead of Ryan, Harry Kim probably would have gotten way better lines and a lot more screen time.
     
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  14. oberth

    oberth Commodore Commodore

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    ... and lots of flak from the american religious right (if they ever found out)
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2017
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  15. Refuge

    Refuge Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Garret Wang could have fucked the universe and his acting ability would have translated whatever script he got exactly the same way.
     
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  16. WraithDukat

    WraithDukat Captain Captain

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    There are no small roles only small actors (apparently).
     
  17. Crazy Eddie

    Crazy Eddie Vice Admiral Admiral

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    In the case of Peter Dinklage, LITERALLY.

    But there's a tremendous difference between a small role and a degrading one.
     
  18. cooleddie74

    cooleddie74 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Garrett Wang is one of the nicest cast members of any Trek series and extremely giving and generous to the fans. It's probably hard to find a nicer and more friendly Trek actor to interact with in a convention setting. That said, the poor guy was probably the worst actor in the entire lead cast of his show and that arguably includes Jennifer Lien.
     
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  19. Refuge

    Refuge Vice Admiral Admiral

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    You know to be fair he is not the worst actor in all of Trek. HALF of those in TOS were actually shit actors. Nichelle Nichols, George Takei, Walter Koenig, Majel Barrett. Entirely dreadful. Denise Crosby (TNG)... make it stop! Frankly I'm throwing Avery Brooks out there too. Wooden dreadful acting.
     
  20. Satron

    Satron Commander Red Shirt

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    Brooks is pretty bad. But his character is compelling enough to mitigate his limitations.
     
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