How is Worf, a character from TNG and DS9 and a long time associate of Picards, less fan wanky and more logical than Kira, Riker, Sisko or any other Trek character?
Who Should Be the Next Captain of the Enterprise?
- Thread starter Captain Clark Terrell
- Start date
Because he's currently the XO of the ship, and a more logical choice then all of the other characters who all have lives going in directions that have nothing to do with commanding the Enterprise, except for a 'kewl' factor for fans.
Although some fans still cling to the concept of Worf never getting a command because of what happened during DS9 and him choosing Dax over the mission, current TrekLit has already established that Starfleet got over that, and already offered him a command, which he turned down, since he didn't feel ready yet.
Personally, I feel that having Sisko or Kira commanding the Enterprise would a be decision on the same level of 'inspired' as when Seven and Chakotay suddenly became a couple in VOY. Meaning, a bunch of writers thought it would be 'awesome'.
Being XO doesn't mean you're next in line for the Captain's chair of your current assignment. Sisko is an experienced commander and war hero. In a real life military that would make him a top choice for the fleet's flagship. Kira may be a longer shot. Looking at Kira Lit history on Memory Beta, I see she is also an experienced commander and held the rank of Captain in Starfleet. So again, a real life military would see her as a viable commander for the Enterprise.
My vote goes to Worf. While he may not be the first candidate Starfleet-wide, he does have years of experience on the ship now, knows it well and also has both a great deal of tactical and diplomatic experience that would be required for the flagship. He's also likely the most marketable character from the current TNG crew.
Of the other characters mentioned in the posts directly above, I agree Sisko feels too small-universe, and not an ideal choice given his recent "instabilities"; he's just gotten settled on the Robinson so I'd leave him there for a while yet. Kira has retired from service, and I don't see her returning unless there was some great threat that demanded her presence. And I don't see Riker leaving Titan either. I suppose he could leave command to Vale and return to the Enterprise with Troi, but that would not only make things awkward for Worf, but also leave behind the closely-knit crew he helped build on Titan. I just don't see that happening.
If we do go for a new character, then yes: let it be an alien, perhaps also a woman. I've actually warmed to STO's Shon quite a bit during the recent updates, but we've already explored Andorian, Vulcan and to a lesser extent Tellarite culture quite a bit. My pick would be from one of the less-often mentioned Federation species, like a Benzite or a Denobulan. And if we do have to have a human, let it be one from a colony world.
Of the other characters mentioned in the posts directly above, I agree Sisko feels too small-universe, and not an ideal choice given his recent "instabilities"; he's just gotten settled on the Robinson so I'd leave him there for a while yet. Kira has retired from service, and I don't see her returning unless there was some great threat that demanded her presence. And I don't see Riker leaving Titan either. I suppose he could leave command to Vale and return to the Enterprise with Troi, but that would not only make things awkward for Worf, but also leave behind the closely-knit crew he helped build on Titan. I just don't see that happening.
If we do go for a new character, then yes: let it be an alien, perhaps also a woman. I've actually warmed to STO's Shon quite a bit during the recent updates, but we've already explored Andorian, Vulcan and to a lesser extent Tellarite culture quite a bit. My pick would be from one of the less-often mentioned Federation species, like a Benzite or a Denobulan. And if we do have to have a human, let it be one from a colony world.
All those reasons make complete sense, but when it comes to TrekLit, those reasons don't always apply. And having Sisko, who was the main star of DS9, becoming the captain of the Enterprise, seems very fanboyish, like someone suggesting somewhere on the forum that a fanfilm with the E-E staffed by people from all shows. It's a bit to much I feel.
As for the reasons you mentioned of a n experienced captain, I pointed out earlier in this thread that I would like a complete new character. That would make the most sense to me. An older captain, preferably alien, that would take the center seat.
But Starfleet is neither a real life military nor, although having aspects that are very similar to a military is it actually a military force.
^ Yes, this. It's always struck me as unjustified when people criticise aspects of Starfleet's functioning by pointing to the protocol of modern militaries. While military organizations as they exist and have existed are clearly a massive influence on Starfleet, it's also clear that Starfleet is a distinct organization, of a type that doesn't exist in reality. It draws strongly from a military, and partially fulfils the role of such, but isn't the same beast. Which isn't to say that they can get away with anything or that logic doesn't apply, or that comparing Starfleet protocol to military standards isn't useful and often fruitful, but the arguments along the lines of "Riker's been in the same first officer post for seven years, his career is over, because in a real military you'd be moving on after two or three" always struck me as uncalled for.
Well, we do have the canonical discussions of Riker's career in "The Best of Both Worlds," although he continued on as first officer for a decade or so after that.
But I do agree that the extent that we can determine what Starfleet would or would not do based on contemporary military practices is pretty limited.
So is there an "in universe" reason a person like Sisko shouldn't be the CO of the Enterprise? Because looking at his CV, I'd think any organization, military or civilian, real or imaginary would have him on the short list for a leadership position.
Starfleet is military. No matter what Roddenberry in his later years or anyone else might say, When the UFP goes to war Starfleet is who fights it.
I don't think the objection is to the idea of Starfleet being military -- it's to the assumption that a future multispecies interstellar military must be organized the same way as the 20th/21st-century United States military and must handle promotions and assignments in the same way. There have surely been historical military organizations that were structured differently, and there would undoubtedly be alien militaries that are structured differently too.
Possibly, but I would think factors like background and experience would be considered when looking for potential leaders no matter what. Sure there might be some nepotism, cronyism or classism in play as well.
It's not like such negative things are the only alternatives to what we're used to. Maybe one of Starfleet's founding cultures had a sort of apprenticeship system in its military tradition, where serving as a commander's first officer was seen as training for eventually taking their place.
Haven't we seen career paths in Trek though?
Kirk- Supposedly served as the CO of a smaller ship prior to getting the Enterprise.
Picard- Was the CO of the Stargazer prior to becoming the Captain of the Enterprise.
Sisko-Serves as XO of the Saratoga, does a stint at The Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards, becomes the CO of DS9 and later the CO of the Defiant.
Janeway- Serves as a "Command officer" ( XO? CO?) on the USS Billings, then becomes the CO of the Voyager.
Archer- He's one that seems atypical. His background is as a test pilot, though its possible he serves as an CO or XO prior to become the CO of the NX-01.
Riker- Was offered the command of several ships. while the XO of the Enterprise and the Hood and finally became the CO of the USS Titan.
Assuming this is typical, most COs have commanded previous ships or been an XO.
Well, yes, of course, but the point is that it can be another way, not that it has to be. Obviously not every captaincy is going to be earned the same way. Acknowledging that one possibility exists does not preclude alternatives.
True, there are many paths but the typical one in Starfleet seems to be XO to CO, or if you are a CO you can become the CO of a different ship. Not seeing the example you gave as being one embraced by Starfleet.
^Huh? The "example" I gave was an attempt to explain the XO-to-CO pattern as the result of a sort of "apprenticeship" tradition. So how can you say in one sentence that it's typical, yet in the next say you don't see it being embraced?
Lots of interesting suggestions. I'd love to have a female captain of the Enterprise. Sure, we've had them, but never as the current captain, only in flashbacks. Ezri and Saavik are both exciting choices. I'd love to have Saavik in some 24th century Trek in some capacity.
I don't see any reason why Picard would be leaving the Enterprise anytime soon, not allowing for the 24th century longer life spans. I think Picard not being the captain of the Enterprise would hurt the sale of the books.
I don't see any reason why Picard would be leaving the Enterprise anytime soon, not allowing for the 24th century longer life spans. I think Picard not being the captain of the Enterprise would hurt the sale of the books.
Because the example was for the XO to take over for the CO of the ship he's "apprenticing" on not a different ship. Which hasn't been shown to be true in most of the cases we've seen. Spock became the Captain of the Enterprise after Kirk, but we don't know if there was a CO between Kirk and Spock. Picard became the CO of he Stargazer when it's Captain was killed. Though neither is exactly the scenario you outlined,
But throughout this thread, we've been discussing it as a possibility -- people have been nominating Worf as Picard's replacement. I'm just trying to be open to both sides of the question. Remember, I myself pointed out earlier that it would better fit with established naval patterns if the ship were assigned to a veteran captain, but others have suggested that Starfleet isn't necessarily organized the way an Earth military would be, so I considered that premise and thought of a hypothetical model that might justify the suggestion. But I'm not taking sides or asserting it has to be True, I'm just exploring the idea. It's about conjectural possibilities, not documented cases.
And I think there is evidence in canon to suggest that first officers are often considered the heirs apparent for their captains, even if we haven't seen that possibility fulfilled. I think Riker once said he turned down commands because he was holding out for the Enterprise. We saw him as Enterprise captain in the alternate futures of "Future Imperfect" and "All Good Things...". T'Pol similarly took over the captaincy of Enterprise in "Twilight"'s alternate future, even though she was a civilian at the point of divergence in the series' present. ST has always seemed to assume that first officers were the leading candidates to replace their captains, and it's that precedent that's influencing the Worf suggestions here.
And I think there is evidence in canon to suggest that first officers are often considered the heirs apparent for their captains, even if we haven't seen that possibility fulfilled. I think Riker once said he turned down commands because he was holding out for the Enterprise. We saw him as Enterprise captain in the alternate futures of "Future Imperfect" and "All Good Things...". T'Pol similarly took over the captaincy of Enterprise in "Twilight"'s alternate future, even though she was a civilian at the point of divergence in the series' present. ST has always seemed to assume that first officers were the leading candidates to replace their captains, and it's that precedent that's influencing the Worf suggestions here.
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