Devious - Jon Pertwee's final Doctor Who story

[23skidoo]

I know, some folks are going WTF? when they read the subject line. "What about Planet of the Spiders" or "The Five Doctors" or even "Dimensions in Time"?. But anyone who bought the War Games DVD here in North America yesterday (or when it came out in the UK last spring) will know what I'm talking about.

Devious was a fan-film that has been an ongoing project for something like 15-16 years. Sort of akin to the various Star Trek fan films that have cropped up, it's an amateur production with homemade sets and SFX, but somehow the people behind it managed to get Jon Pertwee himself to play the Third Doctor in a storyline that is set between The War Games and Spearhead from Space.

The production is rather legendary since Pertwee died a year after shooting his scenes, and since the film was never completed only a few people had had a chance to see his last performance as the Doctor (although some audio from this was reused by Big Finish to let Pertwee appear in the 40th anniversary story Zagreus back in 2003).

A 12-minute excerpt from the film, including the complete Pertwee scenes, was included with the War Games DVD, the first time the BBC has allowed a fan production onto one of their DVDs (they never included Shakedown or Downtime (the film starring Lis Sladen and Nicholas Courtney and Debbie Watling as their DW characters) or the Auton trilogy on any of their other releases).

Devious doesn't have the polish of some of the higher-budgeted fan productions, but it was still fun to watch. And Pertwee is just mezmerizing once he appears. Yeah, he looks a lot older, but he still commanded the screen and had some great lines. I know BBC Video and 2 Entertain get criticized from time to time, but I think they should be applauded for allowing this bit of footage to get wide international release. Pertwee is still my favorite Doctor (with Tennant a close second), so it was great to have this little bonus. It's also an interesting historical artifact of the "interregnum" era when it was fan productions like this (audio and video) that kept the franchise alive.

Alex

 

[The Nth Doctor]

I've been wanting to check this out for a few years. I'm waiting for my copy of The War Games (which I've been waiting for ages in itself) to be shipped to me via Amazon, but it'll probably take awhile...

 

[wamdue]

a Doctor Who Fan Film staring an actual Doctor, and I thought things like New Voyages having Takei & Walter was blurring the line, between fan film and offical production.

I had thought some of the Doctor Who spin-offs vidoes were done by the people who owned the rights to the aliens involved, like the Estate of Terry Nation and the Daleks, rather than Fan Films.

 

[23skidoo]

I had thought some of the Doctor Who spin-offs vidoes were done by the people who owned the rights to the aliens involved, like the Estate of Terry Nation and the Daleks, rather than Fan Films.

That's where Devious is rather unique. Starting in 1987 when Reeltime Pictures made Wartime, featuring John Levene as Sgt. Benton, there was a string of professionally made video productions by companies like Reeltime and Bill Baggs Video (BBV). As you point out, the BBC allowed these to be made because, unlike, say, Paramount which owns every nut and bolt of Star Trek, The BBC only owns the characters it created itself. In other words, the Doctor, and a few others. But Robert Holmes created the Autons, so when BBV or Reeltime (I forget which) decided to make a trilogy of films featuring them, they cleared it with Holmes' estate. Ditto the Sontarans, as well as the rather remarkable Downtime which featured Sarah Jane Smith, the Brigadier and Victoria.

The only rule was that the Doctor couldn't appear or, I think, be directly mentioned. That's why BBV started making productions like The Stranger, which was initially the Sixth Doctor and Peri in all but name (later they retconned the character to be nothing like the Doctor) and The Professor and Ace which likewise had to be retconned to "The Dominie and Dorothy" because they got a little too close to the line.

Devious got away with it because it was never intended for commercial release, unlike the BBV and Reeltime productions. According to the website of the production, by the way, they also got Anneke Wills to reprise the role of Polly, though she's not in the excerpt on the DVD (at least I don't think so - there is a woman who kind of looks like her who appears on screen for a few seconds).

The talent behind a lot of these productions is quite incredible. Besides getting original DW cast to sometimes play their original roles but more often playing new characters -- including Davison, Colin Baker, McCoy and Pertwee on several occasions -- you also see the starts of many careers here. Alan Cumming is in one production. Nicholas Briggs - today known as the Dalek voices on the new series - was everywhere. Mark Gatiss cut his teeth on a series of video films called PROBE which focused on Caroline John as Liz Shaw, and also co-starred Louise Jameson in a new role; the show was basically doing Fringe years before Fringe came along.

And there was also the remarkable The Airzone Solution, an "environmental thriller with no Doctor Who connection, but brought together all the surviving Doctor actors (except Tom Baker) in new roles, and we even got a (PG-rated) love scene between Colin Baker and Nicola Bryant thrown into the mix!

There is quite a bit of treasure to be found in these productions - don't even get me started on "Do You Have a License to Save This Planet?" which featured Sylvester McCoy as "The Foot Doctor". I'd love to see someone coordinate with Reeltime and BBV and put out a box set of these productions.

The BBC is also to be commended for never really putting the clamp down. Virgin Books was allowed to publish novelisations of Downtime and Shakedown as part of their regular lines of Doctor Who novels, for example, and the "The Beginning" DVD box set included several short comedy films made by Reeltime. And now we have Devious being included in the War Games DVD. Maybe when November 2013 approaches and they're looking for more items to release, they'll think about putting out Wartime or Shakedown: Return of the Sontarans...

Alex

 

[wamdue]

I had thought some of the Doctor Who spin-offs vidoes were done by the people who owned the rights to the aliens involved, like the Estate of Terry Nation and the Daleks, rather than Fan Films.

That's where Devious is rather unique. Starting in 1987 when Reeltime Pictures made Wartime, featuring John Levene as Sgt. Benton, there was a string of professionally made video productions by companies like Reeltime and Bill Baggs Video (BBV). As you point out, the BBC allowed these to be made because, unlike, say, Paramount which owns every nut and bolt of Star Trek, The BBC only owns the characters it created itself. In other words, the Doctor, and a few others. But Robert Holmes created the Autons, so when BBV or Reeltime (I forget which) decided to make a trilogy of films featuring them, they cleared it with Holmes' estate. Ditto the Sontarans, as well as the rather remarkable Downtime which featured Sarah Jane Smith, the Brigadier and Victoria.

The only rule was that the Doctor couldn't appear or, I think, be directly mentioned. That's why BBV started making productions like The Stranger, which was initially the Sixth Doctor and Peri in all but name (later they retconned the character to be nothing like the Doctor) and The Professor and Ace which likewise had to be retconned to "The Dominie and Dorothy" because they got a little too close to the line.

Devious got away with it because it was never intended for commercial release, unlike the BBV and Reeltime productions. According to the website of the production, by the way, they also got Anneke Wills to reprise the role of Polly, though she's not in the excerpt on the DVD (at least I don't think so - there is a woman who kind of looks like her who appears on screen for a few seconds).

The talent behind a lot of these productions is quite incredible. Besides getting original DW cast to sometimes play their original roles but more often playing new characters -- including Davison, Colin Baker, McCoy and Pertwee on several occasions -- you also see the starts of many careers here. Alan Cumming is in one production. Nicholas Briggs - today known as the Dalek voices on the new series - was everywhere. Mark Gatiss cut his teeth on a series of video films called PROBE which focused on Caroline John as Liz Shaw, and also co-starred Louise Jameson in a new role; the show was basically doing Fringe years before Fringe came along.

And there was also the remarkable The Airzone Solution, an "environmental thriller with no Doctor Who connection, but brought together all the surviving Doctor actors (except Tom Baker) in new roles, and we even got a (PG-rated) love scene between Colin Baker and Nicola Bryant thrown into the mix!

There is quite a bit of treasure to be found in these productions - don't even get me started on "Do You Have a License to Save This Planet?" which featured Sylvester McCoy as "The Foot Doctor". I'd love to see someone coordinate with Reeltime and BBV and put out a box set of these productions.

The BBC is also to be commended for never really putting the clamp down. Virgin Books was allowed to publish novelisations of Downtime and Shakedown as part of their regular lines of Doctor Who novels, for example, and the "The Beginning" DVD box set included several short comedy films made by Reeltime. And now we have Devious being included in the War Games DVD. Maybe when November 2013 approaches and they're looking for more items to release, they'll think about putting out Wartime or Shakedown: Return of the Sontarans...

Alex

I had no ideas so much had been made with so many actors & characters from the Classic series, as you say the BBC never put the "clamp down" sounds like it may have gotten a little out of hand.

Back to Devious, I do wonder how the producers of this thought they were going to get it out to fans, this was 1995, and whilst yes the internet was around then, the same can not be said of broadband, which made it easy for people to download large video files, which would have taken ALONG time on dial up.

I do get why an actor would do a FanFilm now, but not then, how many people did Pretwee (never mind the producers) think was going to get to see it?

I also cant fault the creators of the Autons & the Sontarans, for making what they did, they owned the rights after all, its really the BBCs fault for allowing them.

I dont think in 20 years time we will see RTDs doing a Siltheen d2DVD project, maybe set in Petes world with a 20 years older Rose, after the Doctor has moved on, she might have had to have left Torchwood as well, as im sure the BBC have the rights to Torchwood.

It could go something like this

Rose: Its been 20 years since I came to this reality, before that I travelled with this man, this wonderful amazing man (she sounds like Sarah Jane) his name was, well he never told me his real name, but that doesnt matter now, that ended I was left here alone. I grow old im so old now I look in the mirror & see my mother.

I used to work for this group, well I used to run the group, but then the clone, took it from me, and I was left alone, fighting aliens from my basement in Brighton.

Now they have returned, well the alt reality version of them anyways, me and some of my new friends need to stop them.

The Siltheen they have returned.


or he could make it now with Camille Coduri as the older Rose

(this only works if you assume RTDs himself owns the rights to Rose & the Siltheen, but not to Torchwood)

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Back to Devious, I do wonder how the producers of this thought they were going to get it out to fans, this was 1995, and whilst yes the internet was around then, the same can not be said of broadband, which made it easy for people to download large video files, which would have taken ALONG time on dial up.

The same way other fanfilms (and reconstructions) were distributed -- video tape exchange.

That's how I got the Rupert Booth fanfilms of the '90s. "Phase Four," the Cyberman story, is top-notch. (It was also filmed over a really long period of time; Christine Potter's appearance changes drastically over the four parts.)

I do get why an actor would do a FanFilm now, but not then, how many people did Pretwee (never mind the producers) think was going to get to see it?

The thing to remember about Pertwee is that he was a fan. If he were alive today, he'd be all over doing Big Finish audios. He'd probably have lobbied for some sort of appearance on the new series. Yeah, he did other stuff in his long career, but he loved being the Doctor, he loved fandom, and he loved the fans.

I also cant fault the creators of the Autons & the Sontarans, for making what they did, they owned the rights after all, its really the BBCs fault for allowing them.

Ehh, that's how copyright works in the UK. And pretty much everywhere in the world except for the United States. So, it's not the BBC's fault.

 

[wamdue]

Allyn Gibson The same way other fanfilms (and reconstructions) were distributed -- video tape exchange.

there is that, just seems like those productions would be seen be a very small amount of fans.

Allyn Gibson The thing to remember about Pertwee is that he was a fan. If he were alive today, he'd be all over doing Big Finish audios.

and good for him, for being like that.

Allyn Gibson he loved fandom, and he loved the fans

loved fandom? im not even sure fans love fandom.

yeah ok im having some fun there, but its good that he liked fans, going to fan events etc etc

I hate when actors think they are above the franchise & the fans that made them famous.

Allyn Gibson Ehh, that's how copyright works in the UK. And pretty much everywhere in the world except for the United States. So, it's not the BBC's fault.

but the BBC could have bought the rights to those characters when they were first created, im sure that is allowed under UK law.

 

[23skidoo]

I'm confused with some of the comments here. Are people somehow trying to suggest that it was wrong for these films to be made? That the BBC did something wrong by not buying the rights to the Sontarans, etc?

Just to be clear, the people who owned the rights had nothing to do with the production of any of these shows. Fans got together -- and by fans I include professional film directors and actors and scriptwriters -- and shelled out the money to get the OK. The films that resulted had no more or less distribution than the hundreds of independent films that are made every year. I think some of them even got TV broadcast (didn't some PBS stations air some of them?). Devious was a home-made production and so was not typical of the usual output. And the fact Pertwee agreed to do it -- forgive him for actually loving the work at a stage in his life where odds are he couldn't care less about the money anymore. He clearly did it for fun.

I think it was wonderful that they were able to do make these productions, and in my opinion Doctor Who would not be on the air now, and certainly Big Finish wouldn't have been able to give us more than 100 new adventures featuring Davison, McCoy, Colin Baker, and definitely Paul McGann, if it weren't for all of these efforts.

If anything I wish we had this over here so that the people who have been harping to see a DS9 movie or a Klingon movie could make one without having to be underground about it. Certainly the involvement of guys like George Takei and Walter Koening in the fan films, and Tim Russ behind the camera, shows they'd be able to do the exact same thing Doctor Who fans were able to do for years.

I'm the first to knock fandoms, but there's a difference between people who sit around and bitch all the time saying "I can do better" and those who actually step forward and try. "Downtime" isn't going to win any BAFTAs, but it was a darnsight better than most of the stories that aired on Doctor Who during the late 80s. And it wasn't just casual fans, either. "Shakedown" was written by Terrance Dicks. 'Nuff said.

Alex

 

[wamdue]

Just to be clear, the people who owned the rights had nothing to do with the production of any of these shows. Fans got together -- and by fans I include professional film directors and actors and scriptwriters -- and shelled out the money to get the OK.

so the Auton & Sontarans films were not made by the people who own the rights to those aliens? Which is how I understood it.

 

[Rarewolf]

the rather remarkable Downtime which featured Sarah Jane Smith, the Brigadier and Victoria.

Maybe when November 2013 approaches and they're looking for more items to release, they'll think about putting out Wartime or Shakedown: Return of the Sontarans...

Victoria and Sarah Jane Smith were owned by the Beeb - but things were cordial enough to let the independent project (directed by veteran who director Christopher Barry & written by McCoy writer Marc Platt) go ahead.

It's more likely Shakedown and so will be bought out independently eventually, but there are rights to sort out (various financers) and they want to do things like a full 5.1 remix, when they have the time.

Reeltime's Mindgame is out on DVD. A Sontaran, a Draconian and a Human. The human is played by Sophie Aldred.

 

[Winterwind]

Hmm. I was wondering about the fan production listed on the back of the DVD case. I think I'll be watching that before I watch "The War Games'.

 

[Captaindemotion]

I'm confused with some of the comments here. Are people somehow trying to suggest that it was wrong for these films to be made? That the BBC did something wrong by not buying the rights to the Sontarans, etc?

Just to be clear, the people who owned the rights had nothing to do with the production of any of these shows. Fans got together -- and by fans I include professional film directors and actors and scriptwriters -- and shelled out the money to get the OK. The films that resulted had no more or less distribution than the hundreds of independent films that are made every year. I think some of them even got TV broadcast (didn't some PBS stations air some of them?). Devious was a home-made production and so was not typical of the usual output. And the fact Pertwee agreed to do it -- forgive him for actually loving the work at a stage in his life where odds are he couldn't care less about the money anymore. He clearly did it for fun.

I think it was wonderful that they were able to do make these productions, and in my opinion Doctor Who would not be on the air now, and certainly Big Finish wouldn't have been able to give us more than 100 new adventures featuring Davison, McCoy, Colin Baker, and definitely Paul McGann, if it weren't for all of these efforts.

If anything I wish we had this over here so that the people who have been harping to see a DS9 movie or a Klingon movie could make one without having to be underground about it. Certainly the involvement of guys like George Takei and Walter Koening in the fan films, and Tim Russ behind the camera, shows they'd be able to do the exact same thing Doctor Who fans were able to do for years.

I'm the first to knock fandoms, but there's a difference between people who sit around and bitch all the time saying "I can do better" and those who actually step forward and try. "Downtime" isn't going to win any BAFTAs, but it was a darnsight better than most of the stories that aired on Doctor Who during the late 80s. And it wasn't just casual fans, either. "Shakedown" was written by Terrance Dicks. 'Nuff said.

Alex

Well, personally, I think it's fantastic that Pertwee did this story and fantastic that it's getting as wide a release as this. Well done on all those parties, from the Beeb to the creators of the various characters, to Mr Dicks, to the makers, for allowing projects like this to happen.

Isn't it a shame he isn't around to see the success of the new show and participate in it? I'd love to see them find a role for Sean Pertwee as some sort of tribute.

 

[OmahaStar]

I'd love to see them find a role for Sean Pertwee as some sort of tribute.

If they're going to go that route, why not find a double role with Sean Pertwee as a father and Harry Melling as a son? Even for just a single scene, it could be a nice tribute.


Sean - son of Jon Pertwee (3); Harry - grandson of Patrick Troughton (2) and plays Dudley Dursley in the Harry Potter films. He's recently lost a lot of weight, and looks remarkably like his grandfather. Take a look - http://www.harrypotterspage.com/images/photogallery/albums/userpics/harry-melling_oct09.jpg

Maybe even have the mum be played by Jessica Carney (William Hartnell's granddaughter).

 

[Relayer1]

Bump.

Sorry about the necromancy, but shouldn't this be finished by now ?

 

[Stevil2001]

It should have been finished ten years ago.

 

[jbny67]

I highly doubt it will ever be finished.

 

[Relayer1]

That's a great shame. Isn't it even being worked on anymore ?

 

[Brendan Moody]

The website is still active, so it's evidently being worked on, but there's no sign of a timeframe for completion.

 

[Emperor-Tiberius]

Still, its curious how it doesn't quite sit well with the established continuity, is it? The Two Doctors seemingly cannot happen in Devious' version of events.

 

[Relayer1]

Still, its curious how it doesn't quite sit well with the established continuity, is it? The Two Doctors seemingly cannot happen in Devious' version of events.

Haven't seen Two Doctors for ages - what's the issue ?