Season FIVE OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread

[JarodRussell]

A shot like this is also in TWOK, after the first attack of the Reliant. Somehow they moved the camera through the Reliant's roll bar thingy. I always wondered how.

 

[Borjis]

TNG switched to D1 in Season Four.

You sure about that? Last time I saw a D1 deck it looked like it could've come out of an old UNIVAC computer, and it certainly wasn't small enough to fit on a table (unlike what we see in Star Trek's 25th anniversary special where there are two VTR's on a desk). Not too mention they were notoriously expensive to use.

I think he's referring to the color crosstalk or "rainbow effects" where high luma frequencies sometimes end up in the chroma signal. You could always see it on Worf's sash, for instance:

I've always chalked that up to the nature of the NTSC signal at SD levels, even for component video. Since even in "All Good Things" on the DVD when the camera is pulling up from the lit floor grates in the courtroom there is rainbowing from there not being enough information to seperating the slats. The old newscaster striped-tie affair.

I used to have 2 D1 decks at my studio...cutting edge for the time, it wouldn't at all be unthinkable that they'd be using that as its WAY better than 1" which I also had at one time.

A rainbow cross-talk affect won't happen over component nearly as much as composite, but always occurs with composite. D1 is a Digital composite signal. Beta/SP & Digital Betacam are component and wouldn't show that unless high frequency detail (more of a moire effect than rainbow cross-talk) was present.

 

[Maxwell Everett]

TNG switched to D1 in Season Four.

You sure about that? Last time I saw a D1 deck it looked like it could've come out of an old UNIVAC computer, and it certainly wasn't small enough to fit on a table (unlike what we see in Star Trek's 25th anniversary special where there are two VTR's on a desk). Not too mention they were notoriously expensive to use.

You'd have to show me a frame grab from the special or give me a timecode to look for so I can see exactly what you're talking about. But there are two D1 VTR's on this page here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D-1_(Sony)

A rainbow cross-talk affect won't happen over component nearly as much as composite, but always occurs with composite. D1 is a Digital composite signal. Beta/SP & Digital Betacam are component and wouldn't show that unless high frequency detail (more of a moire effect than rainbow cross-talk) was present.

D1 is 4:2:2 component. D2 is composite.

 

[Maxwell Everett]

Heads up! Fry's Electronics has Season 5 and Unification on sale today through November 27th:

Star Trek: The Next Generation Season 5: $49.99

Star Trek: The Next Generation Unification: $12.99

Ad here: http://www.frys.com/ads/page8


If you bought them already at a brick and mortar store on Tuesday, be sure to bring this ad with you and get a price match if available!

 

[Borjis]

D1 is 4:2:2 component. D2 is composite.

DOH!

Meant D2 haha (i never had D1 just D2)

 

[jimbotron]

Also from Cause and Effect, the remastering of the explosion was a little "too" good.

Now when the breakaway model explodes, you can clearly see the bussard collector fly off to the right. You can see it painted brightly red and yellow, and it looks like it popped off an AMT model kit. I never noticed that in SD. Now I can't help but see it.

They would have been wise to paint it gray.

 

[Doug Otte]

UGHHHHH!!!!
One thing I thought would also be fixed was Crusher's uniform. In "Skin of Evil", the HD did an error where her uniform appeared green instead of blue during the funeral, even though it's the same shot and lighting. For whatever reason, I thought that meant her uniform was always supposed to be blue, and that it only appeared green in later seasons because of the limitations of SD mastering, so the HD remaster would correct it. Watching S5 now, guess it really did appear green in scenes. I assume that all had to do with the way those scenes were lit, because it does appear blue at times yet in scenes with less lighting it appeared green. Truer colors or not, I still hate the green uniform. At least DS9 seemed to be more consistent with blue uniforms, until they did the switch to FC uniforms.

That's very much a product of the material and the way the scenes were lit. IRL the blue uniforms are more of a turquoise than a solid blue that's reflected on-screen. This color shifting happened to all of the uniforms, but most noticably with the red, which was actually almost a purple color.

I remember reading an interview w/ McFadden back during the original run. She seemed exasperated because she was asked so often, and wanted to make it clear her uniform was teal. Because teal is blue/green, I'm sure variations in lighting could bring out one or the other in different scenes.

 

[Cap.T]

So I just watched "Darmok" and I have to say so far I'm a little bit disappointed in regards to picture quality. While the scence on the planet looked absolutly outstanding, I found everything on the bridge a lot less sharp looking then in previous seasons. I thought it was especially note worthy everytime there is a close up of Jonathan Frakes. In earlier seasons one could literally count every little wrinkle in the actors faces but if you look at Frake's forehead in "Darmok" it seems almost a bit hazy.
Again it still looks very good but the previous seasons just seemed sharper. Maybe it will get better in the next episodes.

 

[LOKAI of CHERON]

So I just watched "Darmok" and I have to say so far I'm a little bit disappointed in regards to picture quality. While the scence on the planet looked absolutly outstanding I found everything on the bridge a lot less sharp looking then in previous seasons. I thought it was especially note worthy everytime there is a close up of Jonathan Frakes. In earlier season one could literally count every little wrinkle in the actors faces but if you look at Frake's forehead in "Darmok" it seems almost a bit hazy.
Again it still looks very good but the previous seasons just seemed sharper. Maybe it will get better in the next episodes.

Yes, I've only watched the first few episodes thus far, but the PQ is noticeably softer than previous seasons. A little disappointing.

Still streets ahead of the DVD's though, particularly in terms of contrast and colour.

 

[mr.peany]

I'm beginning to think it has something to do with the way this particular season was shot. Just going back to the DVDs and the lighting, sharpness etc all seemed slightly muted compared to earlier seasons. I dare say it's a lot more noticeable now it's on bluray.

 

[SpHeRe31459]

Yes I've noticed it as well, any time we're on the bridge it's softer. It sure seems like a stylistic choice because it's there in every episode of S5 that I've watched.

When they cut away to another part of the ship it's sharper. For example: when they have a conversation with 10 Forward in Power Play it cuts back and forth between the bridge and 10 Forward, and the 10 Forward shots are sharper (ignoring the 1:41 of SD footage they had to use, of course).

 

[MakeshiftPython]

From what I understand, Marvin Rush preferred the softer look in his photography, which is why everything doesn't seem as sharp and crisp as the earlier seasons looked. He'd often use a diffusion technique. Just watch "Time's Arrow" and you'll notice all of the San Fransisco scenes have an extremely soft look to them. The same kind of look can be found in films like the 1978 SUPERMAN. Rush never went to that extreme in his Enterprise-D settings, but you can notice he'd take such liberties in other settings such as the Klingon interiors, Romulus, and many other settings.

 

[Beta-Z]

From what I understand, Marvin Rush preferred the softer look in his photography

But Rush has been there since the beginning of S3.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

It was something he gradually used more and more over the years, not something employed a lot at very beginning, which is why S3 is for the most part crisp and sharp compared to what came after.

 

[Beta-Z]

Well then i'm just glad he left after the 2nd ep of S6.

 

[LOKAI of CHERON]

From what I understand, Marvin Rush preferred the softer look in his photography, which is why everything doesn't seem as sharp and crisp as the earlier seasons looked. He'd often use a diffusion technique. Just watch "Time's Arrow" and you'll notice all of the San Fransisco scenes have an extremely soft look to them. The same kind of look can be found in films like the 1978 SUPERMAN. Rush never went to that extreme in his Enterprise-D settings, but you can notice he'd take such liberties in other settings such as the Klingon interiors, Romulus, and many other settings.

Yes, I spotted the diffusion in Time's Arrow from day one - clearly an artistic choice in that episode. But, having watched a few episodes from this season now, even the (relatively) sharpest scenes are quite obviously softer than most of what's come before.

I am now moderately disappionted in the technical presentation of this set, but understand it may have not been avoidable.

Still, as I stated earlier, the boost in contrast and colour is a decided improvement on the pitiful S5 DVD's.

 

[FrontierTrek]

Yes, this slightly soft appearance is certainly due to the way in which the show was shot. I'm screen-capping Season 5 right now, and comparing like-for-like Blu with DVD you can see the same differences in sharpness, albeit camouflaged in SD due to the limitations of the resolution.

CBS Digital tried wherever possible to get the best out of the material, but they are limited by the way in which it was shot 25 years ago. They were certainly surprised about some of the "questionable" filming techniques used when they saw the raw footage.

 

[LogicDeLuxe]

Just watch "Time's Arrow" and you'll notice all of the San Fransisco scenes have an extremely soft look to them. The same kind of look can be found in films like the 1978 SUPERMAN.

And the entire run of DS9, afaIk. I hope, that this is not a bad sign. (I didn't watch season 5 blu-ray yet.)

 

[MakeshiftPython]

Watching the fifth season on blu, the softer look is actually growing on me this time. It never looked that great in SD, as it made it appear more video like than anything else. I remember being fooled into thinking they might have switched to shooting with video because of that. Now with the season in HD and in more vibrant colors, I'm fine with the use of soft filters.

If/when DS9 gets the HD treatment, we should definitely expect the soft look being much more prominent on that show than it ever was on TNG. I always thought that show is more suitable with that soft look than TNG anyway. I don't think VOY had that much soft filter, but an HD treatment of that might say otherwise. I think ENT definitely did, so much that many thought the live action footage on blu was just upconverted like the f/x.

 

[cbspock]

Also from Cause and Effect, the remastering of the explosion was a little "too" good.

Now when the breakaway model explodes, you can clearly see the bussard collector fly off to the right. You can see it painted brightly red and yellow, and it looks like it popped off an AMT model kit. I never noticed that in SD. Now I can't help but see it.

They would have been wise to paint it gray.

I'll have to check that out when I get up to that episode..lol So far the season looks great. The show looks a little darker and a little more muted this season, I guess they changed lighting, and film stock again this season.


-Chris