7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOILERS)

[Professor Zoom]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

I don't see how Clara is any less of a character than previous companions.

I get it. You have a crush on her. But, yeah, she is less of a character and becoming more like a plot point.

Personally, I'd say she has more personality and is better acted than Sarah-Jane was in 70s Who, and she's less annoying than Jo Grant. She also doesn't cry all the time and reference Eastenders so she's probably in the top tier of New Who companions, if not my favourite by default.

Meh. That's fine. I think Donna was a great companion. She grew. She was the first of the new Who companions who actually challenged the Doctor on his decisions (Pompeii for example.)

I know you see Rose as a "chav" but, she was a little more interesting that Clara... she had a family, she had a boyfriend, and, yeah, she was in love with the Doctor in a way we hadn't seen before. So, yeah, more interesting than Clara who is traveling with the Doctor because she.... can... I guess...

Still early days now though and time will tell if she'll be up there with Ian, Barbara, Leela, Romana, Ace and Bernice Summerfield as a favourite of mine.

Great! We disagree. Except for Bernice, who I am not familiar with, all of those examples are much better characters than Clara. Maybe not as better acted, but, yeah, I think more interesting.

She's slowly becoming an uncharacter. She's cute and bubbly enough to keep fanboys interested and in their beds at night, but she's more of a MacGuffin than an actual flesh and blood character with depth, needs, goals, etc.

Please explain to me Susan or Sarah-Jane's needs and goals in the classic series? Did Rose and Martha have any needs beyond the Tenth Doctor's dick?

Well... Susan was traveling with her Grandfather, so... and I know MAYBE this is a stretch, it might have had something to do with traveling with family... taking care of her Grandfather... Hmm.....

Sarah Jane was a reporter. She was someone who was in pursuit of story, of adventure. And what greater adventure than traveling in time and space?

Anyone else you want to quiz me on?

I get it, Clara is as cute as a button. She's perky, she's bright and shiny. And she's played with a lot of charm.

But other than being the "impossible" girl... )which really, HOW is she in impossible? She must not be THAT impossible, the Doctor isn't really working that hard to solve the "problem." He's visited one psychic. Ooooo. And he keeps talking about how she's a problem) I don't think she's all that great.

 

[Kelso]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

Good episode. I enjoyed the Van Baalen brothers and Clara continues to be a delightful character. She and the Doctor had some marvelous scenes.

Regarding the reset, the episode made it clear-and it has been well established in the series- that a rewritten timeline can be remembered.

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

I am mostly just finding Clara to be kind of a boring companion. Stuff happens all around her, and I feel like she's just kinda...there. For big crazy mystery girl, she's exceptionally ordinary, which is really odd to me because Future Oswin and Victorian Clara were so much more interesting.

In what way? You've expressed that opinion before but I still don't understand it. For me, Clara has been consistently portrayed as the exact same character in every incarnation. What makes the other versions so much more interesting, in your opinion?

 

[RoJoHen]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

Her attitude. Her intelligence. Her, I dunno...gumption? This present-day Clara is fine, but the other two version just seemed a little more gung-ho. The current version is just along for the ride, but I don't get a particular sense of excitement from her.

Now, maybe that's the point of this Impossible Girl. The Doctor stole her away to find out what makes her so interesting, but all he has managed to find so far is a normal, boring girl.

Clara is fine. I don't dislike her, but I don't exactly like her either. She's just there...kinda like Martha.

I agree with Professor Zoom. Clara isn't really being developed as a character. She is a plot device, a mystery for the Doctor to solve. Unfortunately, he doesn't really seem to be doing a whole lot to try and solve it.

Now, keep in mind that this early into Season 5, I didn't really like Amy all that much either, and she and Rory eventually became my two favorite companions. I also found that liked the early Amy episodes a lot more the second time around. The same could easily be true of Clara. For some reason Moffat's run of Doctor Who is off-putting to me until I go back and re-watch it. Then I think it's awesome.

It could also be that I liked the other versions of Clara better because she was interacting with more familiar characters. Oswin's interaction with the Doctor and Rory was fun to watch, and I enjoyed her as part of the Victorian Era ensemble with Vastra, Jenny, and Strax. It's possible that I just don't find her all that interesting as the new main character without all those other people around.

 

[sttngfan1701d]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

My massive crush on JLC aside, I fell for Clara immediately in Asylum of the Daleks, but liked her Victorian version better. I still like the Victorian version better, but Clara v3.0 has definite potential. Yes, right now she's a plot device; I think we're not being allowed to see it yet because the writers need her to be a plot device for now. That's part of what was so frustrating about the reset for me. They went to an interesting area with her and the Doctor only to rip it away. We'll see if it's picked up again in the finale.

I like her spunk. I like that she doesn't listen and I like her suspicion of the Doctor. And I like his fatherly affection toward her. She's headstrong like Amy yet....different. There's a very natural give-and-take developing with them and I hope that there's enough time to fully develop it. And it will develop once the constraints of this "mystery" storyline are shaken off.

 

[Cutter John]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

Yeah, I gotta agree with the general opinion about Clara. She is just pretty much just there. We've been so busy with the plots each week that we know almost nothing about her. Her likes, dislikes, fears, and thoughts. I still have hope for her though. Maybe once the big mystery is solved the show can start concentrating on giving her a personality.


But yeah. 7B has been a big disappointment for the most part.

 

[Professor Zoom]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

My massive crush on JLC aside, I fell for Clara immediately in Asylum of the Daleks, but liked her Victorian version better. I still like the Victorian version better, but Clara v3.0 has definite potential. Yes, right now she's a plot device; I think we're not being allowed to see it yet because the writers need her to be a plot device for now. That's part of what was so frustrating about the reset for me. They went to an interesting area with her and the Doctor only to rip it away. We'll see if it's picked up again in the finale.

But she doesn't JUST have to be a plot device. She could still be a character. Every character the Doctor encounters could "just" be a plot device as in something that sets the story in motion or advances it. That is A function of characters in a story, but its not the SOLE function.

As you said, they moved her into an interesting territory... only to say, "nope, didn't happen." Come on, they are making up rules to how time "works" why did she have to forget everything. And I'm sorry... an echo, maybe she remembers something... that's bullshit.

It didn't happen for her. It barely happened for the salvage people.

I think it was a tremendous missed opportunity. Her remembering what happened could have advanced the story. But we are pretty much where we were at the end of the Christmas special.

Did they suddenly get the writing staff of Torchwood: Miracle Day working on Doctor Who? What's the deal?

 

[RoJoHen]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

Yeah. Honestly, if we had to go with a reset ending, I almost wish Clara would have died again. I wish the Doctor would have failed. It would have been ballsy, and we would be in basically the same boat that we're in now. Something is drawing her to the Doctor; it's not like we wouldn't have run into her again.

 

[JoeZhang]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

As you said, they moved her into an interesting territory... only to say, "nope, didn't happen." Come on, they are making up rules to how time "works" why did she have to forget everything. And I'm sorry... an echo, maybe she remembers something... that's bullshit.

Leaving aside the fact that Doctor Who has always just made up rules as it needs to, how is this different from the when Rory was erased from time by a crack and the Doctor remembered but Amy didn't?

 

[Professor Zoom]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

Yeah. Honestly, if we had to go with a reset ending, I almost wish Clara would have died again. I wish the Doctor would have failed. It would have been ballsy, and we would be in basically the same boat that we're in now. Something is drawing her to the Doctor; it's not like we wouldn't have run into her again.

YES. That would've been great. It would have been an advancement on the story.

As you said, they moved her into an interesting territory... only to say, "nope, didn't happen." Come on, they are making up rules to how time "works" why did she have to forget everything. And I'm sorry... an echo, maybe she remembers something... that's bullshit.

Leaving aside the fact that Doctor Who has always just made up rules as it needs to, how is this different from the when Rory was erased from time by a crack and the Doctor remembered but Amy didn't?

It's different because the salvage guys changed. Albeit slightly. Why do they change, and "remember" but Clara doesn't...? Amy didn't sorta remember, there wasn't an echo. She didn't remember at all. Though, to be honest, I don't remember the serial enough to argue the point for very long.

I think a LITTLE consistency would go a long way. Certainly defining your sandbox, your rules, and then sticking to them... it used to be in Doctor Who you couldn't cross your own time stream... except for an Anniversary special... now it happens almost every Moffet serial.

If you have rules and you stick to them, personally, I think it makes you a little more creative than always just changing the rules to get out of the corner you've painted yourself into.

 

[Cutter John]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

Why do I get the feeling that they're going to spring a "Wait, I remember..." from her on us in the final episode?

 

[DalekJim]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

I know you see Rose as a "chav" but, she was a little more interesting that Clara... she had a family, she had a boyfriend, and, yeah, she was in love with the Doctor in a way we hadn't seen before. So, yeah, more interesting than Clara who is traveling with the Doctor because she.... can... I guess...

I doubt I'm alone in being thankful we don't have another annoying mother that hates The Doctor. Also, The Doctor shouldn't have a love story as it's a betrayal of the character.

The family drama formula was repetetive and a cynical attempt to grab the soap opera audience. I like that the show is centred more on exploration than basing itself in modern day London, one of the absolute dullest places in the universe. Clara has been given solid development in her episodes. She's only been in 5 episodes so far so she's not exactly Jaime Lannister level of complex, but as far as Doctor Who companions go there's nothing wrong with her. I don't want 2 episodes exploring her family life and boyfriend. I wanna explore the universe.

Do still wish she was Victorian though.

 

[Relayer1]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

I liked Jackie more than Rose. Mind you, I liked Cribbins more than the dreadful Donna...

 

[DalekJim]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

Donna was pretty shit and an attempt to dumb the show down but Turn Left was a pretty good episode. Certainly one of RTD's better scripts (Compare it to the following story!). Tate gave a much superior performance to Piper in it.

 

[Brent]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

by the title of the episode i thought it would be a good and interesting episode,but just like the rest of the episodes they were crap.part 2 of season 7 is turning out to be a dud.

I am mostly just finding Clara to be kind of a boring companion. Stuff happens all around her, and I feel like she's just kinda...there. For big crazy mystery girl, she's exceptionally ordinary, which is really odd to me because Future Oswin and Victorian Clara were so much more interesting.

Maybe that's why I like her so much, she's just an ordinary person this time, or acts ordinary, every companion has had some kind of god like complex, I just want an ordinary person stuff happens to around her and she reacts to it for a change, that's what I'm getting with Clara finally. Sometimes you just need normalcy.

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

Also, The Doctor shouldn't have a love story as it's a betrayal of the character.

Nonsense. In fiction, especially in long form fiction, rules are meant to be broken, and screams of "betrayal" or "tradition" are only uttered by those who lack imagination.

 

[Starkers]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

Well despite the reset I rather enjoyed that, and as people have said I don’t think it’s as much of a reset as people think. In fact I suspect at some point we’ll get a “You think I don’t remember?” line from Clara. The salvage crew weren’ty great actors, but I thought they were nice additions to the story, and I loved the Sunshine’esque monsters, and the reveal for what they were. As for Clara, the jury’s still out as far as I’m concerned. I liked her a lot more in this episode than others (how much of that is down to how adorable she looked I’m not sure) but she still seems to lack a certain spark. As I’ve said before I found Alaska Clara more interesting than Victorian Clara and Victorian Clara more interesting that modern day Clara. She’s just there at the moment (which is fair enough, plenty of companions have just travelled with the Doctor…because.)

As for Rose being a chav, I think what people mean when they say Chav is that she’s common and working class (and she is, she has a job and everything) and whilst I’ll never be the biggest Rose fan in the world I think it’s a bit unfair to focus on the fact that she talks a bit common like, and I quite liked the notion of seeing what impact someone travelling with the Doctor has on the family back home, my problem began when RTD did it again…er and then did it again!

As for Donna, won’t hear a word said against her, best RTD era companion, best post 2005 companion and would rank high in my list of companions overall. Post 2005 though my rankings probably go…

Donna
Amy
Rory
Clara
Rose (s1 and the last five minutes of REOT)
Rose (everything else)
Martha.

Lord knows where I'd put River and Jack in amongst that list however...

 

[Guy Gardener]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

Rose is the girl in the shop who gave Clara the TARDIS' phone number.

If Clara actually said "Girl in the Shop", it has to be Rose.

I'm just wondering if this is oldschool Badwolf, or Rose after 10 years of bad road?

 

[RoJoHen]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

Rose is the girl in the shop who gave Clara the TARDIS' phone number.

If Clara actually said "Girl in the Shop", it has to be Rose.

I'm just wondering if this is oldschool Badwolf, or Rose after 10 years of bad road?

I actually had the same thought, though I doubt they'd go that route. Why is Clara sprinkled all across time and space? Because crazy Dark Phoenix Rose sprinkled her there when she absorbed the Time Vortex!

 

[Guy Gardener]

Re: 7X10 Journey To The Centre Of The TARDIS(Grading/Discussion)(SPOIL

Someone is making a Girlfriend for the Doctor.

He has a wife, but he needs a girlfriend?

Some one is making a girlfriend that will be a girlfriend like she is the governess of a child.

The Doctor is a child.