WI: The Enterprise-E is stranded in the Delta Quadrant?

[JJohnson]

Let's say for whatever reason, the Enterprise E is caught in the Delta Quadrant, and finds itself right were Voyager was at Scorpion. How would the crew handle the situation?

I'm looking to pick up an old story idea I had, and flesh out to maybe a few movie-style stories or perhaps a mini-series length fanfic.

A few details:
-Picard decides to rescue Seven from the Borg, has her join the crew, acts like a father figure to her
-Seven wears a normal uniform
-Data gives her lessons on being human

The question would be, how do you see Scorpion playing out? How does Picard's crew handle Species 8472, and how does Picard handle being put back face to face with the Borg so soon after First Contact? How would Picard handle the Equinox' crew? And any particular in-betweens that should be touched on or would be particularly better off had the Enterprise been there?

How do you see Data, Geordi, Riker, Picard, and the rest of the crew interacting with her? I'm guessing Data will give her 'lessons' in being human; Picard would insist on her using her real name; Geordi might try to act like a friend to her; Riker I'm not sure of; Troi would try to get her to explore her emotions, running up against the emotional inhibitor, which might need to be addressed earlier. Ideas?

 

[T'Girl]

Picard decides to rescue Seven from the Borg, has her join the crew, acts like a father figure to her

No way in hell. At most Picard might allow her to leave the ship alive like he did with Hugh. If Picard has abject hatred for any group, guilt by association, it's the Borg.

Janeway initially held Seven against her will, her repeated demands to be released, to escape, to call "her people" for help.

Picard would have had Seven off the ship as soon as he could.

 

[Vanyel]

Maybe not, Picard could have seen her as a kindred spirit, one assimilated so young and unable to even try to resist assimilation like he had tried. Also if the events in Unity happened to Riker as they had to Chakotay, Riker could have been her advocate and fought to keep her aboard especially once her link was severed.

Picard would have seen Species 8472 as the threat they were at the time, and like Churchill and Roosevelt with Stalin, Picard would have seen the Borg as the lesser of 2 evils and joined forces with them.

Picard may have made Seven do a lot more to prove her willingness or at least her resignation to joining the crew and not betray them.

 

[47]

1. Picard was an ex-Borg. He would have done things a lot differently from Janeway. NO WAY he would have gone to the cube for instance. Picard was not a hands on captain like Janeway was. NO WAY he would have let anyone go to the cube. No way in hell!

2. I see Data helping Seven definitely, and Worf NOT happy at all. I see Geordi going cuckoo for cocoa puffs around her. As for Picard, he would keep her because it's the Starfleet thing to do, no more. Eventually though he would soften up, but he would never become a father to her. I'd see Beverly become a mom though.

 

[Xhiandra]

I don't think Picard would ever consider the Borg the lesser of 2 evils.

Placed in a situation where he has to pick an ally between both a new form of life and the Borg, which he personally hates beyond reason (First Contact hasn't happened yet by the time of Scorpion, he's still in full Ahab mode), he'd choose the new form of life, even if initial contact proceeded extremely badly (who takes the role of Kim? Unnamed redshirt #157632? Riker?*) due to a misunderstanding.

Even with Troi (taking the role of Kes)'s warnings of the Undine's intentions, he wouldn't consider it sufficient to antagonise them.


Besides, from a literary point of view, I'd think that's a more interesting angle: instead of just having Picard/the TNG crew proceed slightly differently but to largely similar results; have the story unfold on a completely new perspective.
Namely, the alliance being between the Enterprise-E and the Undine and see where it gets you.
Don't pre-write the ending, just have characters behave as they normally would and see what happens; regardless of positive or negative outcomes.

*standard TNG away team in possibly conflictual situations: Riker, Worf, Data, 0 to 2 redshirts.

 

[47]

To follow Xhiandra's idea (which is good by the way) you may have to rewrite the Undine as a species which is pissed off by the Borg, but not powerful enough to defeat them, just to whip their collective ass for quite a long time without achieving a definitive victory. Also they would have to be less malevolent and not want to purge the galaxy.

And I'm pretty sure it's possible to keep Seven in the story, by the way.

 

[Xhiandra]

The "purge the galaxy" bit was implied later in Voyager to be just a shock-tactic: make yourself sound much more ruthless than you actually are to scare away potential opponents.

At least that's how I rationalise the post-Scorpion retconning of the Undine.

 

[47]

Maybe. But still, Kes perceives them as extremely malevolent (or something to that effect). No doubt Deanna would too. If she tells Picard that they're focused on hurting the Borg and don't mind much that there are other species around, it will sound more logical that Captain Prime Directive decides to help them rather than the Big Bad Borg.

 

[R. Star]

There's no way in hell Picard would have allied with the Borg. I see him making peaceful contact the RIGHT way with 8472. Voyager tried to tractor the bioship, beam it away then boarded it all as if they had every right to. Is it any wonder the pilot attacked them?

 

[Vanyel]

The "purge the galaxy" bit was implied later in Voyager to be just a shock-tactic: make yourself sound much more ruthless than you actually are to scare away potential opponents.

At least that's how I rationalise the post-Scorpion retconning of the Undine.

Scorpion Part I
After escaping the first bioship. Kes says what she heard the pilot say:
Kes:...the weak will perish.

When Voyager finds the singularity Species 8479 are using to enter this Universe:
Kes: Yes, I can hear them. They come from a place where they are all alone. Nothing else lives there.....I feel malevolence, a cold hatred, the weak will perish. It's an invasion. They intend on destroying everything.

So it was established in Scorpion Part I that Species 8472 was out to destroy everything, not just the Borg.

So the Borg would have been the lesser of 2 evils. The Borg had already destroyed hope of diplomacy by invading their space. Picard would have had no choice.

 

[47]

Which is why the Undine would need a rewrite if the OP chooses to write a story where Picard does ally with them.

 

[Mage]

At this point, Janeway knows next to nothing about the Borg. Not unlike Picard, who had much more on-hand experience with them. Sure, by the end of the series it was the other way around, but at the time of Scorpion... no. Picard would know better then to trust the Borg, and would never even consider an alliance. He would find other ways to get to the core of the problem, perhaps even open up a dialogue with 8472.

I wonder if Janeway, knowing what she learned of the Borg by the end of the series, would be so open to the idea of an alliance with the Borg.

 

[47]

I agree. Janeway took a lot of decisions Picard would never have taken anyway.

 

[Vanyel]

At this point, Janeway knows next to nothing about the Borg. Not unlike Picard, who had much more on-hand experience with them. Sure, by the end of the series it was the other way around, but at the time of Scorpion... no. Picard would know better then to trust the Borg, and would never even consider an alliance. He would find other ways to get to the core of the problem, perhaps even open up a dialogue with 8472.

I wonder if Janeway, knowing what she learned of the Borg by the end of the series, would be so open to the idea of an alliance with the Borg.

How do you open up a dialogue with a race whose goal is to destroy everything in your galaxy. The only way that one was established was because Voyager and the Borg discovered how to defeat the bioships of Species 8472.

Picard is not stupid, and he may have been hurt nearly beyond repair, but he knew how to compartmentalize his feelings.
1. Species 8472 is out to destroy all life in the galaxy.
2. Find a way to stop them.
3. Our idea will only work with Borg help.
4. Ally with the Borg.
5. Deal with Species 8472.
6. Cut and run from the Borg.

 

[Mr_Homn]

picard went to the edge of the universe and returned within a few hours.

delta quadrant would have been no sweat

 

[Mage]

At this point, Janeway knows next to nothing about the Borg. Not unlike Picard, who had much more on-hand experience with them. Sure, by the end of the series it was the other way around, but at the time of Scorpion... no. Picard would know better then to trust the Borg, and would never even consider an alliance. He would find other ways to get to the core of the problem, perhaps even open up a dialogue with 8472.

I wonder if Janeway, knowing what she learned of the Borg by the end of the series, would be so open to the idea of an alliance with the Borg.

How do you open up a dialogue with a race whose goal is to destroy everything in your galaxy. The only way that one was established was because Voyager and the Borg discovered how to defeat the bioships of Species 8472. So 8472 had a reason to be pissed. Sure, they overreacted a bit, but still.
Did Janeway even try to establish contact with 8472? I think she only reasoned that way because Kes told her that 8472 were having so many nasty thoughts. I don't remember any attempts of 'opening hailing frequencies'.

Picard has always been the better diplomat between those two. He would try to find another way around this situation then allying himself with the Borg.

Picard is not stupid, and he may have been hurt nearly beyond repair, but he knew how to compartmentalize his feelings.
1. Species 8472 is out to destroy all life in the galaxy.
2. Find a way to stop them.
3. Our idea will only work with Borg help.
4. Ally with the Borg.
5. Deal with Species 8472.
6. Cut and run from the Borg.

It was later found that 8472 only wanted to destroy everything here AFTER the Borg violated their space. The Borg were the first to act in that little war. Sure, 8472 overreacted a bit with their 'destroy everything' attitude, but the Borg instigated it all.

As far as I can remember, Janeway never even tried to establish contact with 8472. Kes told her that she picked up all these nasty thoughts, and Janeway acted on that. When they realized the Borg were the once that started it all, it was already to late.

Picard has always been the better diplomat, and would not choose a side so easily, not even if the Borg were involved. He would find out what compelled the other side aswell.

 

[47]

And I bet he would find out the name Undine, used by Species 8472 to refer to themselves. Apparently Janeway STILL didn't know that after the time they spent with them in "Starfleet Academy"...

 

[Xhiandra]

The "purge the galaxy" bit was implied later in Voyager to be just a shock-tactic: make yourself sound much more ruthless than you actually are to scare away potential opponents.

At least that's how I rationalise the post-Scorpion retconning of the Undine.

Scorpion Part I
After escaping the first bioship. Kes says what she heard the pilot say:
Kes:...the weak will perish.

When Voyager finds the singularity Species 8479 are using to enter this Universe:
Kes: Yes, I can hear them. They come from a place where they are all alone. Nothing else lives there.....I feel malevolence, a cold hatred, the weak will perish. It's an invasion. They intend on destroying everything.

So it was established in Scorpion Part I that Species 8472 was out to destroy everything, not just the Borg.

So the Borg would have been the lesser of 2 evils. The Borg had already destroyed hope of diplomacy by invading their space. Picard would have had no choice.

I know, that's exactly what I was adressing: as shown later in VOY, the Undine don't really want to annihilate all life in non-fluidic Space, they're just trying to (and succeeding) scare the opponent shitless.

And Picard wouldn't act on premonitions/visions of his empath/telepath alone.
He'd take it into consideration, but wouldn't base his whole policy towards a new species on a 3-second waking dream of Troi's.

What seems to be the deciding factor for Janeway is the attack on Kim; which is a purely emotional response, not rational given how quickly it happened, where it happened and all they ignored about the Undine.
Kes' vision establishes that they're alone in fluidic space, so the only humanoids they ever saw by that point were Borg, that Undine finds a bunch of humanoids on a Borg vessel and lashes out, in pretty poor lighting conditions nonetheless.

 

[R. Star]

8472 defended themselves from the Borg when attacked and had the audacity to counter attack. Their first encounter with Voyager, they attempted to tractor one of their ships, beam it away, then boarded it. Yeah, I'd consider all that hostile too and they to be in collusion with the Borg. Especially since they were actively protecting Voyager the second time they encountered them.

8472 was later shown to be quite reasonable when they're not being invaded. The whole "destroy the galaxy" thing is just Kes's intuition, which could be inaccurate. "The weak shall perish" could just be a battle cry for example, certainly I'm sure some of our generals said we should bomb Germany off the face of the Earth or purge all the Nazi's during WW2, but we didn't quite do it.

Picard would have actually tried TALKING to them before just randomly deciding they're a threat because the Borg might have a meal ticket across their space in all this. To say nothing of Picard would stop and consider two things, other species the Borg will attack after this war(like the guy in Hope and Fear's race) and the opportunity to bring the Collective to it's knees in negotiating with the 8472.

 

[zarkon]

Picard would have gotten a treaty with 8472.

buh bye borg