Should the classic who be colourised? The Debate..

[Orac Zen]

If you're interested in modern television shows, watch modern television shows. If you want to know what television series used to look like, watch the old stuff. But trying to change the old stuff so that it's more acceptable to modern sensibilities is a colossal waste of time and energy.

This - particularly the bit I put in bold.

To each their own and all, but colourisation is something I've never seen the point of. The few attempts I've seen have looked artificial and...well, crappy. Wasting time and resources to try to appeal to those people who think anything made in B&W isn't worth watching is ridiculous. If they're unwilling or unable to appreciate B&W TV shows / movies / whatever as they were made, that's their choice. Nothing appeals to everyone and trying to change it so that it might / does appeal to everyone is pointless.

So no - no colourisation for classic Who.

 

[starsuperion]

well for the record, I am not against b&w.. just wanted to know why the classic fans don't like the idea of colourisation, and so far, no good reasons have been given..

to leave it the way it was simply because that is how it was presented is not an argument..

they did the first doctor who shows in black and white cause colour was not available..

if they had a choice between black and white and colour, I am sure they would have originally done it in colour..

so I just can't see the same side as most of those here who obviously just do not want to see their precious black and white shows converted..

no offense, and not that I can't watch the black and white, to tell the truth after watching the classics in black and white it is hard sometimes to go and watch those in colour.. LOL..

but truly and please forgive me for saying this, but I just don't see a great argument here against colourisation..

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

if they had a choice between black and white and colour, I am sure they would have originally done it in colour..

Aha, but they hadn't and they didn't, that's the point.

Yes, if, say, "The Daleks" were produced today, it would obviously be filmed in color. It would also have a better budget, better special effects, a more elaborate soundtrack, a faster pace and it would probably be much shorter.

We can add all these things now: we can take "The Daleks", add color, re-edit it, add a couple of new shots, change the music, etc... The question is, should we do it? Should we spend time and energy trying to update old television shows to appeal to contemporary tastes, or isn't it more reasonable to produce new shows for contemporary audiences, and to leave old shows untouched for people who enjoy their quaint charm?

 

[starsuperion]

if they had a choice between black and white and colour, I am sure they would have originally done it in colour..

Aha, but they hadn't and they didn't, that's the point.

Yes, if, say, "The Daleks" were produced today, it would obviously be filmed in color. It would also have a better budget, better special effects, a more elaborate soundtrack, a faster pace and it would probably be much shorter.

We can add all these things now: we can take "The Daleks", add color, re-edit it, add a couple of new shots, change the music, etc... The question is, should we do it? Should we spend time and energy trying to update old television shows to appeal to contemporary tastes, or isn't it more reasonable to produce new shows for contemporary audiences, and to leave old shows untouched for people who enjoy their quaint charm?

NO ONE IS SUGGESTING GOING ALL OUT AS YOU KEEP REMINDING ME.. this is only about the colour application to the source material, nothing more.. if you want to go all out like you are suggesting.. then why not take the lost episodes, and then remake them under the moff series with Matt Smith??

all I am merely saying is that colour is what some people will only watch.. so why alienate those who could become fans, by denying them the option? I would think that at least having colour and black and white as an option would be fair, and would give those who prefer colour a choice.. but to take away the choice is not something I can accept..

yeah those shows were filmed in colour back then cause that was all they had.. so..does that not mean that because the technology exists today that we can't make colour for those shows? I mean had the black and white doctor who been superior to colour they would have continued in the black and white format.. as it stands they did not..

anyhow, you have your view and I have mine, but I think that colourisation is not such a bad thing, if it brings in fans who normally wouldn't think twice at watching classic who in black and white, who would look at it and give it a try in colour..

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

NO ONE IS SUGGESTING GOING ALL OUT AS YOU KEEP REMINDING ME..

Actually, I am suggesting it. Because there's no difference between what you're suggesting and what I am suggesting, it's equally absurd.

Some people won't watch a show unless it's in color? True, and some people think old Doctor Who episodes are much too slow, and would only watch it if the editing were a little tighter. And some people are turned off by the old music. Why not give all these people the option of watching the old material tweaked so that it suits their particular tastes?

Because it makes no sense.

People who enjoy classic Doctor Who for what it is can watch it, people who don't enjoy it can watch something else. There is no need to transmogrify the show in such a way that it appeals to everyone. There is no need to proselytize. If some people don't like old Doctor Who because it's in black and white, fine. If some people would love Star Trek if only it had a reggae soundtrack, then too bad, no one will make a reggae version of Star Trek for them.

They're television shows, not ice cream. If you don't like them, don't watch them, but you can't ask for a different flavor.

 

[N-121973]

No. Except for that episode of Mind of Evil. Besides, it would be very expensive with current technology to colourise them all. I think animating missing episodes from incomplete serials should be a higher priority.

Did you mean the whole of Mind of Evil? Also let's not forget about the bulk of Ambassadors of Death, and I think its episode 2 of Invasion of the Dinosaurs.

 

[Bones2]

No. Except for that episode of Mind of Evil. Besides, it would be very expensive with current technology to colourise them all. I think animating missing episodes from incomplete serials should be a higher priority.

Did you mean the whole of Mind of Evil? Also let's not forget about the bulk of Ambassadors of Death, and I think its episode 2 of Invasion of the Dinosaurs.

Oh yeah, I'd forgotten about The Ambassadors of Death. They should do that too. Didn't know about Invasion of the Dinosaurs.

In short, if it was originally in colour but BBC bungling means they've only got it in B&W, then they should colourise it. Otherwise, leave it be.

 

[starsuperion]

NO ONE IS SUGGESTING GOING ALL OUT AS YOU KEEP REMINDING ME..

Actually, I am suggesting it. Because there's no difference between what you're suggesting and what I am suggesting, it's equally absurd.

I completely disagree, there have been countless tv shows and movies that have been reformatted in colour, take for example the older versions of lost in space, they were originally shot in black and white, and those originals have since been updated to colour to match the rest..no tricked out soundtracks,a nd special effects were added.. and those colour DVD's now sell pretty well..so I don't see this premise as equally absurd..

also, I didn't mean to sound snarky on that last post..

Some people won't watch a show unless it's in color? True, and some people think old Doctor Who episodes are much too slow, and would only watch it if the editing were a little tighter. And some people are turned off by the old music. Why not give all these people the option of watching the old material tweaked so that it suits their particular tastes?

Because it makes no sense.

I agree, which is why I say just colourise it, there are more people who would watch Doctor who in colour then in black and white.. regardless of the music, slowness, etc..

People who enjoy classic Doctor Who for what it is can watch it, people who don't enjoy it can watch something else. There is no need to transmogrify the show in such a way that it appeals to everyone. There is no need to proselytize. If some people don't like old Doctor Who because it's in black and white, fine. If some people would love Star Trek if only it had a reggae soundtrack, then too bad, no one will make a reggae version of Star Trek for them.

actually they did release a star trek remastered which has better colour, special effects, a new remastered score (soundtrack) and title sequences...so I don't think that my mere suggestion of colour addition is so outrageous..

They're television shows, not ice cream. If you don't like them, don't watch them, but you can't ask for a different flavor.

well you can for star trek, and lost in space.. why not Doctor who?

 

[N-121973]

No. Except for that episode of Mind of Evil. Besides, it would be very expensive with current technology to colourise them all. I think animating missing episodes from incomplete serials should be a higher priority.

Did you mean the whole of Mind of Evil? Also let's not forget about the bulk of Ambassadors of Death, and I think its episode 2 of Invasion of the Dinosaurs.

Oh yeah, I'd forgotten about The Ambassadors of Death. They should do that too. Didn't know about Invasion of the Dinosaurs.

In short, if it was originally in colour but BBC bungling means they've only got it in B&W, then they should colourise it. Otherwise, leave it be.

Actually according to Wikipedia its episode 1 of Invasion of the Dinosaurs that's in B&W.

 

[starsuperion]

People who enjoy classic Doctor Who for what it is can watch it, people who don't enjoy it can watch something else. There is no need to transmogrify the show in such a way that it appeals to everyone. There is no need to proselytize. If some people don't like old Doctor Who because it's in black and white, fine. If some people would love Star Trek if only it had a reggae soundtrack, then too bad, no one will make a reggae version of Star Trek for them.

I have one more thing to say on this..

I disagree with your statement that people who want to see Doctor who in colour should go and watch something else..why? why is it that important to keep the original show in original black and white??

I think that the show itself is the virtue of change..

the tardis changes, the doctor changes, the companions change, so why shouldn't the colour format also change? change is the very essence of the show, and a little change to the classic series to maybe make it a bit better or to appeal to other fans who do not share the passion for black and white should be welcomed, and not scorned at by whovian purists..

If you ask me the tolerance of the mere idea of colouring a classic doctor who show from black and white to colour is like arguing with the Daleks!

STOP! NO CHANGES TO THE CLASSIC DOCTOR WHO WILL BE TOLERATED! EXTERMINATE, EXTERMINATE! EEEEXXXXTERRRRMINAAAAAAATE!!

Sheesh!

 

[Flibble]

No, the old episodes should not be re-coloured, but animations of the missing episodes would be great.

Starsuperion...slightly off subject. I like the way you spelt Bollux. That was the classic misprint in a Star Wars novel Han Solo at Star's End, - the name of a droid that Han Solo had. It amused me no end to think of him shouting for his droid!

 

[starsuperion]

No, the old episodes should not be re-coloured, but animations of the missing episodes would be great.

Starsuperion...slightly off subject. I like the way you spelt Bollux. That was the classic misprint in a Star Wars novel Han Solo at Star's End, - the name of a droid that Han Solo had. It amused me no end to think of him shouting for his droid!

finally someone got that!

yes, yes, I am a bit of a nerd..but hey, I don't look like one, so it is all good!

 

[Winterwind]

While I generally like disagreeing with The Mirrorball Man simply for the sake of disagreeing, he's bang on with this one.

Classic b&w is exactly that: classic, a window into a by-gone era. I enjoy watching it for what it is. There's absolutely no need to colourise or update anything. If someone can't watch something because it's b&w, or has primitive special effects, etc, well... saying any more could be construed as offensive so I'll just have to hope you follow the direction I'm heading.

 

[starsuperion]

While I generally like disagreeing with The Mirrorball Man simply for the sake of disagreeing, he's bang on with this one.

Classic b&w is exactly that: classic, a window into a by-gone era. I enjoy watching it for what it is. There's absolutely no need to colourise or update anything. If someone can't watch something because it's b&w, or has primitive special effects, etc, well... saying any more could be construed as offensive so I'll just have to hope you follow the direction I'm heading.

that seems remarkably close minded and very Dalek of you...

I respect b&W television as an era.. but i also see the colour side of things, and those who prefer that..

 

[Winterwind]

There's nothing even remotely close-minded about. The closed minds are the ones that feel something needs to be colourised or updated in order to be enjoyed. If you can't appreciate and enjoy something for what it is...

 

[Starkers]

Hear hear!

 

[Orac Zen]

but truly and please forgive me for saying this, but I just don't see a great argument here against colourisation..

You haven't offered a good argument for colourising the series, either. Patronising commentary like this

so I just can't see the same side as most of those here who obviously just do not want to see their precious black and white shows converted..

doesn't qualify. Neither does your rather arbitrary and vague claim that people (what people?) are more likely to watch classic Who if it was in colour. Upon what basis do you make that assertion?

There's nothing even remotely close-minded about. The closed minds are the ones that feel something needs to be colourised or updated in order to be enjoyed. If you can't appreciate and enjoy something for what it is...

Agreed.

 

[starsuperion]

There's nothing even remotely close-minded about. The closed minds are the ones that feel something needs to be colourised or updated in order to be enjoyed. If you can't appreciate and enjoy something for what it is...

I can, I am just saying that there are some who would prefer colour..how can someone be close minded about B&W?? that was the original format, and has been for the last 40+ years..what is close minded are those who scoff at the very notion that some others would prefer colourised episodes of the black and white series..

but truly and please forgive me for saying this, but I just don't see a great argument here against colourisation..

You haven't offered a good argument for colourising the series, either. Patronising commentary like this

I don't patrionise.. and that is certainly big of you, can't find an example to use against colouring, and just attack my text..you obviously just want to argue, and I am not arguing here.. just playing devils advocate is all..

so I just can't see the same side as most of those here who obviously just do not want to see their precious black and white shows converted..

doesn't qualify. Neither does your rather arbitrary and vague claim that people (what people?) are more likely to watch classic Who if it was in colour. Upon what basis do you make that assertion?

there is no basis and vague claim just facts but I never said most people prefer colour, just that there are some who do, and to not cultivate that market seems a bit limiting for the BBC, and you are putting words in my text to make your seemingly snarky and condescending point..as for people..if there weren't fans who aside from this board shared a desire to see classic who in colour then there would not be examples found on the net like:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZS72JYx1js

and this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAOfbnAg4bA&feature=related

and this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pH7LtmLDPA&NR=1

and this:
http://wow-video.ru/view.php?video=...Who+colourised+-+Patrick+Troughton+test+ver+2

articles like this:
http://www.sliceofscifi.com/2009/09/21/color-restored-to-classic-doctor-who-story/

images like this:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/mikeyb_137/WarGames_Interrogation1a.jpg
and so on.. and so on..

There's nothing even remotely close-minded about. The closed minds are the ones that feel something needs to be colourised or updated in order to be enjoyed. If you can't appreciate and enjoy something for what it is...

Agreed.

and that statement doesn't seem close minded to those people (and I sited examples of people who are exploring colour for the early series episodes) who may want to see the classic series in colour???

I am merely trying to have an intelligent discussion and debate about this particular subject.. but for you to attack my character by using statements such as:

Patronising commentary like this, Neither does your rather arbitrary and vague claim

Using words like this to try to present a valid argument against my assertions seems brash and if you can not win on the merits, please refrain from attacking my character as being nothing more then hyperbole, even if it is overtly so..

besides, how would you like to be the 1 guy playing devil's advocate on this subject and jumped on by pretty much everyone else..it's hard to stay focused and debate without feeling like you are getting lynched..

I'm not saying we should do away with the black and white series at all, just offer a colourised version for those who may want that option..

 

[Mr Awe]

Presumably, if there were color versions, there would still be the B&W versions available for those who wanted the original. Colorizing simply opens up more options. Those who want B&W can watch the B&W versions while those who want color can watch those. Everyone is happy.

I personally prefer the original. I always watch the DVDs with the original SFx. But, I certainly don't mind that there is another version on the DVD that has newer SFx. It's no biggie.

Mr Awe

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

I want to see cigarette-smoking versions of Renaissance paintings. There's something about a non-smoking Mona Lisa that just fails to capture my interest.