5x03 Victory of the Daleks (Grading/Discussion) SPOILERS!

[Shazam!]

Yeah, I kinda wish the whole episode had a B-plot about Smith coming across as a mad man trying to convince everyone that the Daleks are bad whilst the main story was something else. The opening 10 minutes or so was brilliant.

Daleks building Daleks is nothing new, but I wish we'd get something other than them pressing a button and then new Daleks emerging. I loved the bit in Genesis... were you saw all those Daleks without a Dalek casing.

New Daleks - don't mind the colours, but really dislike the design now that we've seen them from all angles. Worst Daleks Ever.

The Spitfires in space felt like they had that cool idea and then sacrificed all common sense and logic to force them into the story.

Going over the episode again, it really is dropping in score. I may have to agree with the poster earlier who said tha it was a dud.

 

[O'Dib]

Can someone explain to me how the copyright thing works? Do they really need to have them every season in order not to loose their Dalek license?

 

[EJA]

As I said in an earlier post, those new Daleks actually aren't the only ones out there; there are the original ones that are still living on Skaro. Why does this fact keep getting ignored?

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Can someone explain to me how the copyright thing works? Do they really need to have them every season in order not to loose their Dalek license?

I think the Nation estate has come to the conclusion that the money to be earned by licensing the Daleks and allowing the BBC to use them far outweighs Terry Nation's late-in-life objections to the BBC utilizing the Daleks. (Nation felt that JNT had been disingenuous with him over "Remembrance of the Daleks," and he forbade his literary executors from cooperating with the BBC.)

I don't think the BBC has to use them. But they're paying a lot of money to Nation's estate, so they might as well get their money's worth.

As I said in an earlier post, those new Daleks actually aren't the only ones out there; there are the original ones that are still living on Skaro. Why does this fact keep getting ignored?

That gets into the question of what the Time War did to the Daleks. From a purely linear viewpoint, the Daleks of Skaro exist in 1940; they'll invade Earth and drill out the planet's core in two centuries -- assuming that the Time War didn't alter history completely and irrevocably.

 

[Shazam!]

As I said in an earlier post, those new Daleks actually aren't the only ones out there; there are the original ones that are still living on Skaro.

They're the only ones that can do anything though. All the others are Time Locked into doing everything they've already done up to the Time War. So if the new Daleks tried to pay them a visit they'd probably end up like Dalek Caan.

 

[Kibbin]

Well if the doctor can bump into himself pre-timewar, surely he can bump into daleks pre-time war too? Right?

 

[Skellington]

Plus I suspect being able to replicate a few clothes would be the least of the TARDIS's talents.

Always thought so myself, though I don't think that it's ever even hinted at on the show.

I like the alt uni & crack in the wall explanation for Amy not knowing about Daleks. Hey, maybe we're in the twin ten uni now. And maybe Time Lords exist here.

The twin Ten universe didn't seem to have a time vortex; the TARDIS even "died" upon entering it. Ergo, I don't think so. Anyway, it's been a running joke in Doctor Who since Rememberance Of The Daleks (1988) or before that no-one really remembers these supposedly life-changing events.

Except they didn't seem to be playing it for the joke, the Doctor seem genuinely confused or concerned.

Possibly the phrase "running joke" was a bit strong, but you get the gist.

Well if the doctor can bump into himself pre-timewar, surely he can bump into daleks pre-time war too? Right?

He seems to have been meeting Davros and the Daleks in the same chronological order as they have been meeting him since Genesis Of The Daleks in the mid seventies. Strange, that.

 

[Shazam!]

Well if the doctor can bump into himself pre-timewar

At the risk of an explosion the size of Belgium.

 

[lennier1]

Well if the doctor can bump into himself pre-timewar, surely he can bump into daleks pre-time war too? Right?

He seems to have been meeting Davros and the Daleks in the same chronological order as they have been meeting him since Genesis Of The Daleks in the mid seventies. Strange, that.

Unfortunately we rarely get episodes which have the Doctor encounter (future) acquaintances out of chronological order. A shame since the library episode has proven it to be an interesting story element when done right.

Well if the doctor can bump into himself pre-timewar

At the risk of an explosion the size of Belgium.

They've already given us the french fries. So who needs Belgium anymore anyway?

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

'Twas tosh but amiable tosh -- I voted average. I think Mark Gatiss does better writing straight comedy. I wonder if they had to increase the size of the daleks 'cause the actors driving them are taller and wider than they used to be. Next week looks a lot more promising.

 

[intrinsical]

Last week's episode was light years better in terms of plot and theme. This week's episode just felt like a non-stop barrage of homages with a very rudimentary plot to stitch things together.

Power Dalek Rangers - That was the very first thing I thought of when the new Daleks were revealed.

Independence Day "Taking down the alien saucer with old planes" - I half expected the last plane to kamikaze into the saucer, just like the movie.

Raising the American Flag at Iwo Jima - The raising of the British flag felt a lot like the famous WW2 photograph. It even has the same number of soldiers raising the Union Jack.

As for the cracks, I am guessing that TARDIS is causing it.

 

[O'Dib]

Can someone explain to me how the copyright thing works? Do they really need to have them every season in order not to loose their Dalek license?

I think the Nation estate has come to the conclusion that the money to be earned by licensing the Daleks and allowing the BBC to use them far outweighs Terry Nation's late-in-life objections to the BBC utilizing the Daleks. (Nation felt that JNT had been disingenuous with him over "Remembrance of the Daleks," and he forbade his literary executors from cooperating with the BBC.)

I don't think the BBC has to use them. But they're paying a lot of money to Nation's estate, so they might as well get their money's worth.

K, thanks. I'm just confused 'cause wikipedia says BBC owns the rights to the name and look of Daleks, whereas the estate owns the concept of them. How does one draw the line between the two? Does that mean BBC could only do eps about friendly Daleks without paying royalties? (That would've actually been a welcome development in the Daleks in NY ep)

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

I think Amy's generating the cracks. As someone else mentioned the resolution is probably bound up with the Doctor revisiting her when whe was a wee bairn.

As for the Scottish thing -- any chance we could ever see Shirley Manson as the Rani? I'd like to see a Rani story that wasn't tosh. I think that rumour about Gillian Anderson being cast last year was nonsense, wasn't it?

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

I may have to downgrade my score on the grounds that a *real* Doctor would have done *both* when it came to the choice offered by the Daleks. Especially since he must have known they'd carry out their threat anyway.

Well then they would have had to call it something else than "Victory of the Daleks", right?

 

[Cutter John]

Having thought about it over night, I came up with three dialogue changes that would have helped the episodes logic immensely.

Controller: "Incoming bombers. ETA ten minutes."

Churchill: "And we'll have the entire bloody Luftwaffe overhead inside of ninety minutes if we don't douse those lights!"


Ditch the whole overly long "Its theoretical that we could send something into space" scene. Replace it with two lines.

Churchill: "I think its about time we gave Squadron 40 a chance to try out their new wings."

Scientist "But we haven't finished testing those!"


And by way of explaining how they managed to disarm the robots bomb by reminding him of his girlfriend:

The Doctor: "The Daleks don't have the technology to simulate real emotions, so they've had to copy them from a living human brain."

Sort of explains things better, and it'd be a nice callback to Davison's 'Resurrection of the Daleks'.

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

^^
I thought there was more than enough exposition in the episode, actualy.

 

[BenRoethig]

I like the alt uni & crack in the wall explanation for Amy not knowing about Daleks. Hey, maybe we're in the twin ten uni now. And maybe Time Lords exist here.

There's also that more mundane explanation that her village was just too remote and unimportant. Doesn't sound like DW though.

 

[SeerSGB]

Last week's episode was light years better in terms of plot and theme. This week's episode just felt like a non-stop barrage of homages with a very rudimentary plot to stitch things together.

Power Dalek Rangers - That was the very first thing I thought of when the new Daleks were revealed.

Independence Day "Taking down the alien saucer with old planes" - I half expected the last plane to kamikaze into the saucer, just like the movie.

Raising the American Flag at Iwo Jima - The raising of the British flag felt a lot like the famous WW2 photograph. It even has the same number of soldiers raising the Union Jack.

As for the cracks, I am guessing that TARDIS is causing it.

Or Amy. I'm pretty sure we're going to find out that Amy is responsible for the crack in reality; more or less pulling that original crack from when she was a child like a zipper or a rip in a pair of pants as she travels with the doctor. As to why and how the 1st crack appeared: Paradox or another "Bad wolf"

 

[Australis]

Hmmmmmmm.

First we had RTD with nhis gay agenda.

Now we have Moff and his Scottish agenda.

 

[wamdue]

My question - How did the planes fly in space? They didn't show them with rockets or anything, instead, their propellers looked like they were turning and it made the typical propeller sound effect from an airplane, and they maneuvered just like an airplane, in spaaaaaaaaace

Oh, and how did they get laser guns all the sudden

Presumably, the "gravity bubble" created an environment around the Dalek ship in which the planes could maneuver. And fitting three planes with energy weapons would be a piece of cake for someone who has been building Daleks.

but he didnt build the Daleks, he only thought he built the Daleks.