Enterprise or Voyager?
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Enterprise. By Far.
Can you tell me what channel the new episodes of TNG, DS9 and VOY are on? I cannot find them.
A difficult choice. In the past, ENT has edged out VOY slightly. Now I'm not sure which one is better. Personally, I liked VOY's characters a little better (even if they were under-developed by the writers). However, I found ENT to be a little more ambitious in the end than VOY ever was. VOY was consistent with its mediocrity. Every season had a lot of really boring, forgettable episodes and a small batch of really good ones. ENT had several strong episodes in seasons 1 and 4, but had so many boring episodes in season 2 that I actually stopped watching - the first time I'd ever consciously decided to stop watching a Trek series because I wasn't enjoying it.
So, at the moment, I may have to give the tiniest advantage to VOY. But ask me again next week and my answer may change!
So, at the moment, I may have to give the tiniest advantage to VOY. But ask me again next week and my answer may change!
Saquist
Commodore
I've said as much. I think fans really want to know how ba-...er How good it could have gotten...but the thing is few series are great to the end...very few.
Can you tell me what channel the new episodes of TNG, DS9 and VOY are on? I cannot find them.
Cancellation != planned ending.
Voyager was a good show. TNG and DS9 were excellent shows, and Voyager could easily have been an excellent show. There were some episodes like Prey, The Killing Game, Scorpion, Author, Author, etc. that were very well-written. But if Voyager had more balanced character development, IMO it would have been the equal of TNG and DS9.
Enterprise?
well...it stank bad . As bad as a rotting carcase! Wrong premise, poorly developed and uninteresting characters and poor concepts for stories.
Enterprise?
well...it stank bad . As bad as a rotting carcase! Wrong premise, poorly developed and uninteresting characters and poor concepts for stories.
So by your logic, the original series must have sucked because it was cancelled. I don't think you'll agree with that.
Saquist
Commodore
Didn't NBC relent that the cancellation of Star Trek was mistake.
The series was canceled in its third season, despite the protests of a renewed letter-writing campaign. Marketing personnel of the network complained to management that the series' cancellation was premature. New techniques for profiling demographics of the viewing audience later showed that Star Trek had been highly profitable for advertisers, though this news came too late to resume production of the series.
yeah...........that's...just like Enterprise....
NBC syndicated and got boat loads of money.
Tried an animated series...
Then they were working on phase two the very next year
That became a major motion picture that set the next 35 years into orbit for Trek.
The original Star Trek wasn't a failure it was a success.
How could you look at any other way after Star Trek 2009. As bad as that movie was people paid to see action Trek. The market is there if you're smart.
The series was canceled in its third season, despite the protests of a renewed letter-writing campaign. Marketing personnel of the network complained to management that the series' cancellation was premature. New techniques for profiling demographics of the viewing audience later showed that Star Trek had been highly profitable for advertisers, though this news came too late to resume production of the series.
yeah...........that's...just like Enterprise....
NBC syndicated and got boat loads of money.
Tried an animated series...
Then they were working on phase two the very next year
That became a major motion picture that set the next 35 years into orbit for Trek.
The original Star Trek wasn't a failure it was a success.
How could you look at any other way after Star Trek 2009. As bad as that movie was people paid to see action Trek. The market is there if you're smart.
Voyager -- and not because it was a more successful show (thought it was that too) but because I liked its concept and setting more than Enterprise.
I was just much more interested in the 24th century setting. I liked that VOY was extending the meta-story of the Trek universe...moving the larger narrative 'forward.'
When I first heard about a pre-Federation prequel series, it sounded like a disastrous idea to me. Good backstories that want to maintain continuity with the "original" story are difficult to create -- even in movies. There's such a creative box from Day One, especially if franchise continuity is valued.
I remember thinking something like, "they're going to try and stretch a Trek prequel across seven seasons of TV?! This won't end well..." (and love it or hate it, that's the genius of ST09...)
And it didn't end well, of course. Most of all, ENT never felt connected to the larger Trek story for me. Everything seemed out of place and there were so many elements that prevented it from ever seeming like a believable prequel of TOS. I really like the connected nature of TOS through VOY. With all the continuity flaws, the larger story still flowed progressively together in a neat way. I appreciated that.
And ENT also suffered with me by running away from the name of Trek. In retrospect --and without getting on a soapbox --this decision might have been the unconscious straw that broke ENT's back for me. From the beginning, ENT seemed unimpressed with the rest of Star Trek...and it wasn't long before I felt the same about ENT.
But since then, I really do sympathize with the ENT fans that feel it unfairly gets blamed for "killing the franchise." And I think it's good that many people think highly of ENT (as this thread demonstrates). Trek is large and diverse enough that it has something for everyone. That's one of the best things about it. But that doesn't change my views on ENT. Answer is definitely Voyager for me.
I was just much more interested in the 24th century setting. I liked that VOY was extending the meta-story of the Trek universe...moving the larger narrative 'forward.'
When I first heard about a pre-Federation prequel series, it sounded like a disastrous idea to me. Good backstories that want to maintain continuity with the "original" story are difficult to create -- even in movies. There's such a creative box from Day One, especially if franchise continuity is valued.
I remember thinking something like, "they're going to try and stretch a Trek prequel across seven seasons of TV?! This won't end well..." (and love it or hate it, that's the genius of ST09...)
And it didn't end well, of course. Most of all, ENT never felt connected to the larger Trek story for me. Everything seemed out of place and there were so many elements that prevented it from ever seeming like a believable prequel of TOS. I really like the connected nature of TOS through VOY. With all the continuity flaws, the larger story still flowed progressively together in a neat way. I appreciated that.
And ENT also suffered with me by running away from the name of Trek. In retrospect --and without getting on a soapbox --this decision might have been the unconscious straw that broke ENT's back for me. From the beginning, ENT seemed unimpressed with the rest of Star Trek...and it wasn't long before I felt the same about ENT.
But since then, I really do sympathize with the ENT fans that feel it unfairly gets blamed for "killing the franchise." And I think it's good that many people think highly of ENT (as this thread demonstrates). Trek is large and diverse enough that it has something for everyone. That's one of the best things about it. But that doesn't change my views on ENT. Answer is definitely Voyager for me.
I'm pretty much the same (except its 1-DS9 and 2-TNG, but they're pretty much tied too), but I put Voyager juuuust above Enterprise cause I liked the characters more - the Doctor pretty much had more character development than all the Enterprise characters put together
Kind of a toss-up. I liked and disliked each show for numerous reasons.
Not sure why these two shows get pitted against each other so often in threads like these. I have my suspicions, though.
Not sure why these two shows get pitted against each other so often in threads like these. I have my suspicions, though.
Saquist
Commodore
A well thought out respone.
I think both shows suffered greatly from mediocrity of script writing. ENT more so than VOY but at the end of Voyagers run the intelligent stories started to dwindle down.
In the beginning there was episodes/mystery/conundrums like
Season One.
caretaker
parallax
time again
Prme factors
Season Two
Elogium
Cold Fire
Manuvers
Alliances
MELD
Deathwish
DEADLOCK
THE THAW
TUVIX
BASICS PART ONE
Season Three
Flash back
SACRED GROUND()
Fair Trade
Unity (a rare Good Chakotay episode
Rise
Before and After
Real Life
WORSE CASE SCENARIO (we never find out who created it)
Season 4
SCIENTIFC METHOD
MORTAL COIL (Even though it wasn't a fave)
Season 5
NIGHT
Drone
EXTREME RISK
Thirty Days
COUNTER POINT
LATENT IMAGE
GRAVITY
COURSE OBLIVION (VERY GOOD)
RELATIVITY
EQUINOX
Season 6
EQUINOX PART II
Dragon's Teeth
THE VOYAGER CONSPIRACY (EXCELLENT)
Blink of an Eye
Good Shepherd
Season 7
Shattered
THE VOID
Voyager had some VERY Smart episodes. My favorite of Each Season in underline. With particular emphasis on Equinox Part II which the series FIRST and Only successful two parter since Caretaker.
Overall Voyager had so many smart and intelligent eqisodes. It was almost like TNG but more fun. The last two seasons were dull and uninspiring focusing on Seven's emotional developments and Romance and the Doctor's holographic pursuits. While other seasons focused on the intrigue of the Delta Quadrant they also profoundly reflected on Janeway, Tuvok, Torres and Tom with out being dull.
I believe VOY gets the short end of the stick because of it's very poor two parters, the First Officer problem that seemed to plague every series but the first, the over use of the hologram stories and the over use of Seven of Nine and the mediocrity of all the other stories. Still, though I think Voyager proved to be smarter than mediocre, but only just so.
COURSE OBLIVION (VERY GOOD)
RELATIVITY
EQUINOX
Season 6
EQUINOX PART II
Dragon's Teeth
THE VOYAGER CONSPIRACY (EXCELLENT)
Blink of an Eye
Good Shepherd
Season 7
Shattered
THE VOID
Voyager had some VERY Smart episodes. My favorite of Each Season in underline. With particular emphasis on Equinox Part II which the series FIRST and Only successful two parter since Caretaker.
Overall Voyager had so many smart and intelligent eqisodes. It was almost like TNG but more fun. The last two seasons were dull and uninspiring focusing on Seven's emotional developments and Romance and the Doctor's holographic pursuits. While other seasons focused on the intrigue of the Delta Quadrant they also profoundly reflected on Janeway, Tuvok, Torres and Tom with out being dull.
I believe VOY gets the short end of the stick because of it's very poor two parters, the First Officer problem that seemed to plague every series but the first, the over use of the hologram stories and the over use of Seven of Nine and the mediocrity of all the other stories. Still, though I think Voyager proved to be smarter than mediocre, but only just so.
Could you elaborate on that one? I don't understand what you mean. What kind of problem?
If you are referring to the quality and development of characters, the only show that had a 'first officer problem' was Voyager. Riker may not have been the greatest character in Trek, but he was no worse than half of the main cast and got some interesting episodes in the later seasons.
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