It was Peak Performance. Riker's got the junked out starship to fix up, so LaForge agreed to pass over XO and it went to Worf.
Who was in Command after Data?
- Thread starter Bacl
- Start date
That's just her area of study. She's still a Starfleet officer, she still has command training. Just like Uhura's focus is Xenolinguistics and Data's are exobiology and probability mechanics. Once she passed the Bridge Officer's Test she was perfectly capable of commanding a starship, and presumably could have went on to pursue her own command if she wanted to.
Just because someone is a starfleet officer doesn't mean that they should be put in charge of a ship. Take a step back and look at it realistically. What has she been in charge of in the past? A couple of shrinks? The whole idea behind a counselor taking charge of a ship stretches credibility at best. There's a reason why it doesn't work that way in reality.
decent enough logic. If everyone else is out, let the Klingon just go apeshit on whatever's left!As for 'real life" there should be plenty of high ranking officers hanging out that we haven't seen. Our crew doesn't work 24 hrs a day, there are at least 2 more watches worth of people here. Maybe 3rd shift is lighter, and can always wake the primary crew if needed, but there should at least be another commander, maybe couple of Lt. Cmdrs kicking around to run the ship in the off shifts.
Thankfully, all crisis situations happened during normal business hours on the Enterprise, so we didn't have to deal with the backups in command!
It has nothing to do with WHO she has been in charge of in the past. The point is if she has the necessary training, which she clearly did considering she took and passed the Bridge Officer's Test. And even before that, back in the academy, I'm sure everyone has to go through command training. Realistically, everyone on the bridge should have to be trained enough to be capable of taking command in a crisis.
it absolutely DOES matter. Theres a reason why as people get promotions in the military, they are given responsibility over larger amounts of people. The exception being those in the medical field, who have their rank because of their knowledge and skills. If she isnt regularly in charge of personel then she certainly shouldnt be in charge of a ship.
So someone passes a test and that means they should be put in charge of a thousand people? riiiight
Of course. That doesn't mean you put them in your chain of command though. I'm a sginal officer. I'm trained on how to fire a 50 cal machine gun. That doesn't mean anyone in their right mind should put me in charge of an infantry platoon. Can I do it if absolutely necessary? Yes. Have I been trained to do so? Yes. Would I ever be put in charge of my battalion? Only if every single infantry officer has been killed. Just because you're "qualified" to do something doesn't mean anyone in their right mind will assign you to it
Riker's a great shuttle pilot, and those things aren't exactly known for warp speeds. He is certainly much more skilled at flying at impulse than Troi is. There wasn't anything more pressing that he needed to do. All he did was sit in the center seat and watch the show. His responsibility - ensuring the safety of everyone on board - would have best been served by taking the helm.
This is decidedly not true. I actually went and rewatched the scene in question before I made my comment, and I think you might want to, too:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLSJzOzNVfc
He has other members of the crew consulting with him throughout the sequence, which could have been very distracting from what needed to be done at the helm - unless you're suggesting that one of them should have taken over command rather than doing the important tasks that they were doing, or that he should have taken the helm and given Troi outright command....
I saw in at least two episodes, when the entire bridge was taken over or damaged, command of the entire ship was transferred to Geordi in engineering.
That suggests at the time that there was some policy to give Geordi command when the bridge can't function.
Other than that, Geordi is given command in two other episodes, both times by Picard.
One, is when he's given command of the ship over a higher ranking CE!
He also appoints him as first officer to Riker in Redemption.
In the same episode where Geordi commands, he is replaced by Crusher who doesn't seem comfortable- everyone comments the ship must be in a bad state by then.
Looks like more of a availability and skill thing, rather than a rank thing from the way it looked on the show.
But still, interesting and weird the way they treated the command structure after Data.
That suggests at the time that there was some policy to give Geordi command when the bridge can't function.
Other than that, Geordi is given command in two other episodes, both times by Picard.
One, is when he's given command of the ship over a higher ranking CE!
He also appoints him as first officer to Riker in Redemption.
In the same episode where Geordi commands, he is replaced by Crusher who doesn't seem comfortable- everyone comments the ship must be in a bad state by then.
Looks like more of a availability and skill thing, rather than a rank thing from the way it looked on the show.
But still, interesting and weird the way they treated the command structure after Data.
Last edited:
With all due respect, you missed a couple of things toward the bottom of your chart....Worf
Spot the cat
The Fish from Picard's Ready Room
Mr. Mott
Troi
...Worf
O'Brien
Barclay
Keiko
Chick who was crushing on Data
Wesley
Every other crewman
Spot the cat
The Fish from Picard's Ready Room
Mr. Mott
Troi
I believe you missed a few people... (BOLD= EDIT)
Perhaps the point is, Troi should be at the veeerrry bottom of the list.
On the contrary, I seem to recall about 95% of emergencies arose as the senior staff was attempting to eat.
...Worf
Spot the cat
The Fish from Picard's Ready Room
Mr. Mott
Troi
ITA, my modified list:Picard
Riker
Data
La Forge (season 1 he was put in charge of the bridge at one point)
Crusher (she was in charge of a skeleton crew during the Lore/Data/borg team up)
Worf
Ro Lauren
Guinan (why not)
Barcley
Alexander
Spot the Cat
The Fish from Picard's Ready Room
Mr. Mott
The ghost of Lt. Yar
Deanna Troi
...yeah Troi was pretty much not a character who should ever be in command.
Captain Spot
Sub-Commader Picard's Fish
Chief Medical Officer Kukalaka (Bashir's Teddy Bear)
Chief Engineer Chester (O'Briens cat on DS9)
Chief Security Officer Porthos
Ensign Butler (kirk's dog)
....boldly going were Star Trek has never gone before.
Actually, I remember that ep very well. The chief engineer was Lt. Logan (full lieutenant), while Geordi was a Lt., j.g. Twice Logan tries to pull rank on LaForge, and he says something to the effect that he would remain in command until relieved by Picard or Riker.
On the issue of Troi's command test, and that of Crusher earlier on, "Thine Own Self" makes it rather clear that passing the test has two consequences:
1) Troi gets promoted one step in rank
2) Troi gets qualified to stand bridge watches
Some wish to say that these should be read as follows:
1) This is the only way for Troi to get a promotion to the rank of Commander
2) Troi gets qualified to command the ship
However, the episode never says that much. And other episodes show that medical personnel and other blueshirts can rise to Commander without being qualified to stand bridge watches - McCoy is an implicit and Pulaski an explicit example. Also, other episodes reinforce the real-world view that standing bridge watches is a menial job for junior officers, and a necessary but by no means sufficient qualification for getting a "steady job" as primary, secondary or tertiary commander of the vessel.
On the issue of Troi not knowing what a core breach is, "Disaster" does not state this. Instead, it shows Troi being pummeled by technobabble from O'Brien, and then asking a very sensible clarifying question about the practical implications of that technobabble. It's just that Ro then retorts with sarcasm that is intended to make Troi look bad, and is unrelated to the question Troi was asking...
The episode does establish that Starfleet regulations allow for rank to be observed over experience or training in certain crises. O'Brien knew the technobabble needed to save the day, Ro had the command training, but Troi was the glue needed to keep the crew from falling apart. At times, figurehead leaders are vital to the survival of an organization... Still, the fact that Troi was placed in command of the small group of survivors doesn't necessarily mean she would be placed in command of the whole ship under any circumstances. It just looked that way since the this small group of survivors happened to be stuck on the bridge.
Timo Saloniemi
1) Troi gets promoted one step in rank
2) Troi gets qualified to stand bridge watches
Some wish to say that these should be read as follows:
1) This is the only way for Troi to get a promotion to the rank of Commander
2) Troi gets qualified to command the ship
However, the episode never says that much. And other episodes show that medical personnel and other blueshirts can rise to Commander without being qualified to stand bridge watches - McCoy is an implicit and Pulaski an explicit example. Also, other episodes reinforce the real-world view that standing bridge watches is a menial job for junior officers, and a necessary but by no means sufficient qualification for getting a "steady job" as primary, secondary or tertiary commander of the vessel.
On the issue of Troi not knowing what a core breach is, "Disaster" does not state this. Instead, it shows Troi being pummeled by technobabble from O'Brien, and then asking a very sensible clarifying question about the practical implications of that technobabble. It's just that Ro then retorts with sarcasm that is intended to make Troi look bad, and is unrelated to the question Troi was asking...
The episode does establish that Starfleet regulations allow for rank to be observed over experience or training in certain crises. O'Brien knew the technobabble needed to save the day, Ro had the command training, but Troi was the glue needed to keep the crew from falling apart. At times, figurehead leaders are vital to the survival of an organization... Still, the fact that Troi was placed in command of the small group of survivors doesn't necessarily mean she would be placed in command of the whole ship under any circumstances. It just looked that way since the this small group of survivors happened to be stuck on the bridge.
Timo Saloniemi
Ok, I never said you would put them at the top of the chain of command or anything like that. I said that her being a psychiatrist would have nothing to do with whether or not she was fit to command. Not to mention, after she took the Bridge Officer's Test she was certainly seen doing things that made it seem like she WAS in charge of people. For example, in Starship Mine I believe it was, the one when the Enterprise was having that energy sweep, at the beginning Troi was coordinating part of the evacuation. She WAS in charge of people. Let's also not forget that she had a part in the promotion of other officers. She clearly DID have some sort of responsibility on the ship beyond a counselor.
Similar threads
