Terraforming Venus' Atmosphere

[All Seeing Eye]

96.5% of Venus' Atmosphere consists of Carbon Dioxide which is helping to cause the extreme greenhouse effect. So how can we terraform such an atmosphere?

We build machines on the surface of Venus (powered by Mini nuclear reactors) that extract the CO2 from the Atmosphere and then compresses that CO2 into a Liquid form into huge tankers. There are then two options, the liquefied CO2 can either be shot into space and transported to Mars and dumped into the Martian atmosphere OR the CO2 is pumped and buried under the Venusian surface into pre-mined sealed caverns.

When the CO2 level in the atmosphere reaches a safe level we introduce Flora to convert the remaining CO2 into Oxygen.

This plan just cannot fail.

A future possibility then could be to obtain Hydrogen from Jupiters atmosphere, transport it to Venus and react it with the Oxygen in the atmosphere to create water.

 

[Bacl]

Your plan, while very clever, requires two things that we lack:

1. A means of inter-planetary space travel that is both faster and cheaper than what we currently are capable of.


2. Social will. Sadly, most people do not see why it is in our own best interests to invest in space travel/exploration and terraforming.

However, it is a great proposal. I like the idea of viewing the other planets in our solar system as having too much of one thing and not enough of another, thus we would simply adjust the ratio by taking from one planet and giving to another.

 

[T'Aerwynd]

In addition to the above:
You wouldn't necessarily need huge underground caverns to store CO2 in supercritical form, only porous, permeable rock layers with a hard cap of rock on top. Those rock layers would, of course, have to be thousands of feet deep.

The introduction of flora to convert CO2 into oxygen is plausible, but what Earth flora can survive on Venus?

 

[All Seeing Eye]

In addition to the above:
You wouldn't necessarily need huge underground caverns to store CO2 in supercritical form, only porous, permeable rock layers with a hard cap of rock on top. Those rock layers would, of course, have to be thousands of feet deep.

The introduction of flora to convert CO2 into oxygen is plausible, but what Earth flora can survive on Venus?

The equatorial variety. After the atmosphere of Venus has been cleaned up and the greenhouse effect cancelled out completely (or at least moreso than on Earth), the temperature will decrease dramatically.

 

[c0rnedfr0g]

Hmmmm, considering Venus surface temperatures are about 735 K, I doubt anybody will be setting foot on the planet

 

[Allyn Gibson]

What about dropping algae into the upper atmosphere? I seem to recall that was Carl Sagan's idea. It might take a century or two to work.

The other thing we'd need to do is to figure out how to spin the planet.

 

[All Seeing Eye]

Hmmmm, considering Venus surface temperatures are about 735 K, I doubt anybody will be setting foot on the planet

Let's rewind to the beginning of the thread. Venus is suffering an extreme case of the greenhouse effect, temperatures are that high due to the thick dense Carbon Dioxide atmosphere. As I said, machines will extract the CO2, liquefy it and dispose of it cleaning the atmosphere up. Even Earth has a form of greenhouse effect keeping it warm, i'm talking about completely eradicating Venus' greenhouse effect bringing temperatures down.

 

[T'Aerwynd]

... but to what end? Are you talking about terraforming Venus with the intention of putting humans there? Or just as an experiment to see if it can be done at all?

 

[c0rnedfr0g]

^^ how would these machines be installed if people cannot go to the surface? do you know how long it would take to remove that much CO2 from an entire planet??

 

[All Seeing Eye]

... but to what end? Are you talking about terraforming Venus with the intention of putting humans there? Or just as an experiment to see if it can be done at all?

To put Humans there of course. Even if temperatures are still high when the greenhouse effect has been cancelled out i'm sure something else could be done to lower the temp further. Orbital mirrors perhaps. Also one Venusian day is quite long, living on the dark side won't be a problem, when coming onto the bright side planet wide air conditioning units could help aswell.

 

[scotthm]

i'm talking about completely eradicating Venus' greenhouse effect bringing temperatures down.

Down to what?

Once the surface temperatures of Venus are "down", what can we expect to find on the surface?

---------------

 

[All Seeing Eye]

i'm talking about completely eradicating Venus' greenhouse effect bringing temperatures down.

Down to what?

Once the surface temperatures of Venus are "down", what can we expect to find on the surface?

---------------

Somewhere to live. Awaaaaaaaaaaaaaay from the Volcanoes. But perhaps the atmospheric cool down and adding more water to the planet will render them less active.

Ya know, it couldn't be too out there to think about colonising the dark side of the planet. In other words as Venus rotates (every 243 Earth days) when the sun starts rising people could migrate to stay on the cooler dark side. But still, we don't know really how hot Venus will be when greenhouse free and facing the sun.

 

[Ronald Held]

There is a COE story about lifting off most of the atmosphere as a start.
With our technology, I am uncertain we could implement the parasol method of coollng off Venus.

 

[T'Aerwynd]

Ok ... why Venus? Why not terraform and colonize the moon? Or Mars? Why not use all that money and technology to clean up the Earth so terraforming and colonizing other celestial bodies isn't a need but instead something we can do as exploration demands it?

 

[All Seeing Eye]

Ok ... why Venus? Why not terraform and colonize the moon? Or Mars? Why not use all that money and technology to clean up the Earth so terraforming and colonizing other celestial bodies isn't a need but instead something we can do as exploration demands it?

Because Venus is almost Earth sized and the gravity is far more suitable than the Moon or Mars and has a larger atmosphere to contain Oxygen once we introduce flora. Once the CO2 is extracted terraforming should be smooth sailing.

Also I don't see how we can use CO2 extractors on Earth, Earths atmosphere isn't comprised 96.5% Carbon Dioxide

 

[T'Aerwynd]

Also I don't see how we can use CO2 extractors on Earth, Earths atmosphere isn't comprised 96.5% Carbon Dioxide

Do you mean CO2 extractors as in the kind used in carbon capture and sequestration technology or the kind you're talking about for terraforming Venus?

 

[All Seeing Eye]

Also I don't see how we can use CO2 extractors on Earth, Earths atmosphere isn't comprised 96.5% Carbon Dioxide

Do you mean CO2 extractors as in the kind used in carbon capture and sequestration technology or the kind you're talking about for terraforming Venus?

Venus' atmosphere is so full of CO2 just sucking in the air is enough to extract the CO2.

 

[Kaziarl]

I can see one good use for terraforming venus, and thats because even if we do these things to earth, it still wouldn't help. Earth simply has to many people, and since I doubt were going to count off by three's and give every third person a red shirt, we're going to need to find somewhere else to live.

I also agree that Venus, while currently planet hell, is a prime candidate. Mars has a much lower gravity and thinner atmosphere, and while this would make the physical labor quite a bit easier, would also tax our lungs much like higher elevations do.

The moon would be a good test bed, but for a small colony at most. It would have to be completly self contained under domes, and 1 quite large one for farming and oxygen production alone. It would also be convinient for testing your extractors.

Venus has a gravity that is very close to our own. And after removing the CO2 and making a more palatable atmosphere, the preasure would be more acceptable as well.

All in all, this would take many steps. The main plan is a good one, but we simply don't have the technology to do it. Can we extract that much CO2 with our present technology?

I think people would also be nervous about sending nuclear reactors into space. IIRC thats why we don't use reactors to power sattilites and stations. What would happen if they fell, or blew up on the way up. We'd probably need something else.

I would imagine with an atmosphere like that there would be high winds. Design a wind turbine that could handle extream wind speeds and perhaps that could work.

2 other things to think about. How would it all get put together, and how would it hold up against the acid rain?

 

[T'Aerwynd]

Venus' atmosphere is so full of CO2 just sucking in the air is enough to extract the CO2.

http://www.daviddarling.info/encyclopedia/V/Venusatmos.html

Major components (by volume)
96.5% carbon dioxide (CO2)
3.5% nitrogen (N2)

Minor components (parts per million)
150 sulfur dioxide (SO2)
70 argon (Ar)
20 water vapor (H2O)
17 carbon monoxide (CO)
12 helium (He)
7 neon (Ne)

Not really. You'd still have to separate out the nitrogen and all the other minor components in order to successfully sequester the supercritical CO2 underground. At least, that's how it works on Earth.

And to answer your question, Jolly Old, yes we do currently have the technology to not only separate CO2 from other gases but make it a supercritical fluid (which acts like a liquid but isn't) and inject that supercritical CO2 underground for storage. You'd just have to either make the technology available on an amazingly massive scale, or bring a lot of it in a smaller scale, I guess.

 

[All Seeing Eye]

Not really. You'd still have to separate out the nitrogen and all the other minor components in order to successfully sequester the supercritical CO2 underground.

Why, even the other gases will liquefy under pressure.