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I'm rethinking Geordie marrying Leah

When Leah (rightly) explains how she feels after discovering her holographic copy, GEORDI ATTACKS HER. He blames the victim. He deflects. He doesn't respond to her accusations

The deus ex machina, was that Geordi didn't explain that he wasn't pulling a "Reg Barclay" of keeping a holo-doll of her, and creeping his way into her life; but that just using the hologram purely for information to save the ship, and it acted that way without his programming it to do so.

And he could have had the computer verify that.

SO VHY VOULDN'T HE TELL THE WHOLE STORY, EH?

Answer: cheap drama.
 
The deus ex machina, was that Geordi didn't explain that he wasn't pulling a "Reg Barclay" of keeping a holo-doll of her, and creeping his way into her life; but that just using the hologram purely for information to save the ship, and it acted that way without his programming it to do so.

That's untrue.

If Geordi had been simply using the hologram for informational purposes, then he would not have had the computer synthesize a personality for it, so that he could—in his own words—get personal on the holodeck, after he had been soundly rejected by his earlier date and had used Guinan as a sounding board about seemingly being unable to hit it off with women.

The hologram acted that way only because Geordi ordered the computer to synthesize the personality, an act completely unnecessary had he only been using the hologram to obtain information.

P.S. That's not remotely close to deus ex machina.
 
I honestly don't understand how Leah's and Geordi's behavior can be put on the same ethical level.

Was Leah a little rude? Sure, no more so than the usual male guest star. The difference is that she's a woman. And at least she was honest with Geordi.

A detail that Geordi's apologists, however, gloss over: throughout the episode, Geordi lies. He lies when he invites her to dinner, he lies when she asks how he knew how she wore her hair before, he lies when he tells her that what he wanted to offer her was friendship. This isn't "social incompetence." It's bad faith. And he NEVER ADMITS HIS MISTAKES. It's Leah who's forced (by the writers) to apologize.

When Leah (rightly) explains how she feels after discovering her holographic copy, GEORDI ATTACKS HER. He blames the victim. He deflects. He doesn't respond to her accusations.

Geordi: "I've shown you courtesy, and respect". Of course, Geordi, it's definitely a sign of courtesy and respect to deceitfully invite a coworker to a romantic dinner.
Exactly.

Geordi doesn't lie because he has poor social skills; he lies because he wants to.

And yeah, lots of people lie all the time....but not typically with the goal of trying to foster a relationship with someone, the people who do lie to foster a relationship with someone tend to be called "creeps" or worse for good reason.

The fact that he's lying in the first place is evidence enough that he feels that what he did in "Booby Trap" is at least something that, if Leah knew about it, might paint him in a bad light (otherwise, why not just be honest?), and I can forgive him for not going out of his way to bring it up...but he crosses the line when he uses the knowledge he has of Leah to attempt to manipulate her to bring her closer to him.
 
Some context. She wasn't honest about her reason for being there. The whole encounter, set up by her, is a bait & switch, to get on board as a guest, by manipulating command & Picard, implying she's impressed with his work, but really is there to judge it, make him uncomfortable about it, & has clear animosity for him over it. Anyone else would've spun her around & put her back on the transporter pad immediately, rather than be surprisingly subjected to that. The End. Roll credits. No one has time to be justifying & defending themselves to a designer, with no authority over them. I seriously would've asked her if she was joking about "mucking up her engines" & if not, to GTFO, cuz IDGAF.

But he likes & respects her, and wants to be liked an respected by her, maybe at least have her as an ongoing collaborative resource, which was the whole point of the hologram to begin with. He needed a live engineer to collab with, not the computer, the actual human designer, who knows the engine intimately enough to improvise with it. Having that personality IS the collaboration. It's a wonder they don't already have such a designer collab in the files, like her as an EMH for the engines, that they'd have set, so no other, "too personal", interactions get tripped into, by oddballs like Geordi, who use the whimsically clueless computer to accidentally program sentient holograms, as a hobby.

So, he doesn't send her away, like I would. Furthermore, at this point, him being openly honest about the full nature & history of him liking and wanting to be liked by her (which he still should've) only serves now to make things worse, because she clearly already doesn't, & will be repulsed by it, regardless of how innocent it was. (& it was) That's not an excuse for him to be dishonest, but her misrepresenting herself does exacerbate his situation, & him choosing to be dishonest, in the face of it, just to be liked, has a little understandable context, that I can extend a modicum of empathy to, given he's otherwise a decent person.

So he isn't openly honest, and that's wrong & inexcusable, but I can understand, & slightly empathize, because now he's on the defensive & trying to be liked, which is historically his weakest personality trait. He fumbles the hell out of it, by trying to manipulate how he's going to be perceived.

He isn't outright fabricating blatant lies. He's withholding, & coloring the circumstances. He's running spin & damage control... Badly, & he shouldn't be, and in the end, he admits he should've told her the whole truth, and yes, it was after she apologized for coming there with her own prejudices, which she did. (Should it have been presented in the writing as badly as that? No, but this is 35 year old soap opera. Times were different)

Ultimately, she came there to make him uncomfortable with prejudice & dismissiveness. He resultantly & disingenuously fumbles & made her uncomfortable, with inappropriate ingratiatory behavior. He began with the wrong impression. She's got some wrong impressions of her own, (I maintain her impression about the hologram was wrong) which is why he reacts badly & was at fault for that behavior. Yes, the episode does a period specific bad job of representing that, but they do find a way forward, and it's not entirely unrealistic that they would, after a real collaboration, and having some forgiveness & empathy within them, which I'm apt to also have within myself.
 
You make some good points, but this:
"He isn't outright fabricating blatant lies."

Leah asks him why he accessed her personnel file, and he tells her something to the effect that it's standard protocol when a guest is coming aboard. That is the fabrication of a blatant lie, and he could have told her he consulted it during a crisis situation to gain more insight into the engines without necessarily getting into the "gory details", but instead said something that was completely untrue.
 
You make some good points, but this:
"He isn't outright fabricating blatant lies."

Leah asks him why he accessed her personnel file, and he tells her something to the effect that it's standard protocol when a guest is coming aboard. That is the fabrication of a blatant lie, and he could have told her he consulted it during a crisis situation to gain more insight into the engines without necessarily getting into the "gory details", but instead said something that was completely untrue.

The truth doesn't let her know that he want's some of that.

A little lie, fudging some facts, opens the door to where she has to admit that a very important man, and handsome man, thinks about her like a sexual plaything.

That lie may mean nothing now, while she is married, but how long does a marriage really last in star trek land? One day after the smoke clears, long after season 3, 4 there is going to come a Friday night where she needs a date/chaperone to some place fancy and all the other men in her little black book are busy.

Hmm?

Who said "I am Brahms?"

(Flint did.)

So she's a fucking robot.

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You make some good points, but this:
"He isn't outright fabricating blatant lies."

Leah asks him why he accessed her personnel file, and he tells her something to the effect that it's standard protocol when a guest is coming aboard. That is the fabrication of a blatant lie, and he could have told her he consulted it during a crisis situation to gain more insight into the engines without necessarily getting into the "gory details", but instead said something that was completely untrue.
I'm not recalling it going exactly that way. I recollect that just before she tells him she's married, and she's suggesting he write a paper on a unique mod he'd made, he returns the compliment by saying that writing is more what she does best, offering to collaborate (another bit of that preexisting knowledge about her that he's calling on, and shouldn't be going about it like that)

She responds... finally, by pointing out that he seems to inexplicably know a lot of things about her, & he responds by saying
Geordi said:
I've studied you... Your writings, your Starfleet file. I've admired you... your work
I don't recall any other remarks about her file, but my memory is old lol. I'm open to a correction, if anyone has one. I took that quote from an early draft script, at st.minutae.com. They aren't always exact to the final product, that made it to air, but I'm not seeing anything else about him going thru her file.

Point being, he's not being honest about how he researched her, but he's not generating falsehoods about it either. He studied her, and her file, or at least the computer did, when generating the hologram. He left the rest to himself... again. He's omitting the whole truth, to spare him the embarrassment, or them some more awkwardness. He's put a spin on it, and admittedly, that's not good faith, but circumstances have become extenuating by then & he's already neck deep into withholding that fact, making it worse by the minute, just before she finds it out on her own.
 
I'm not recalling it going exactly that way. I recollect that just before she tells him she's married, and she's suggesting he write a paper on a unique mod he'd made, he returns the compliment by saying that writing is more what she does best, offering to collaborate (another bit of that preexisting knowledge about her that he's calling on, and shouldn't be going about it like that)

LAFORGE: You sure? You know, your hair, it's different.
LEAH: Different than a few hours ago?
LAFORGE: No, I mean it's different than I expected. Different from your Starfleet records.
LEAH: Oh. Yes, I used to wear it up.
LAFORGE: Yeah.
LEAH: Why would you need to see my personnel file?
LAFORGE: Standard procedure when guests come on board. Protocol. I mean, it was nothing specific, actually. Just, you know.
 
It may be standard procedure, but it's not supposed to be done by him. Something that security is supposed to do, not engineering.
...I mean, that seems like small potatoes in this context. La Forge doesn't know what he knows about her because he reviewed her file because he was anticipating her coming aboard; he knows what he knows about her because he created a holographic likeness of her.
 
Oh yeah. I forgot about that. It's a bit sketch. He could've just said it like it was part of that research he'd done, that I referenced above. I mean... But who's to say it isn't standard to check someone's file before they come aboard though? It's still a withholding kind of dishonesty
It may be standard procedure, but it's not supposed to be done by him. Something that security is supposed to do, not engineering.
Maybe, but she is also a guest of the engineering dept. who might be expected to check also. It is admittedly his worst look for being dishonest
 
I know. So he states something which is technically true and lets her draw the obvious but wrong conclusion.
We have no idea whether it's even technically true (e.g. maybe he's supposed to receive some sort of briefing but not generally be expected to review her personnel file), but in this context, he's clearly being deceptive.
 
As I said above, I understand Geordi not wanting to quite provide all of the detail regarding the events of "Booby Trap", but it might have gone a long way to thawing things with him and Leah if he'd answered the question reasonably honestly ("I consulted it while trying to resolve a crisis the ship was experiencing"). And if he'd been able to thaw them a bit via honesty then perhaps he could have proactively (and with due chagrin) come clean about the rest of it rather than experiencing his personal worst-case scenario.

He gets upset with her because of a situation he did the bulk of the work in creating.
 
You know... that comment about her hair is actually the perfect example of how out-of-date this show is, in Itself. Like dude, don't say the hair thing. Nobody needs that in their life, and if you saw a guy doing that today, you'd rightfully think it's creepy, but was it creepy by their standards?

Well, let me just tell you how commonplace it was for guys to comment on a woman's appearance, out-of-pocket like that, back then, their hair, their outfit, their figure, at work, on a bus, to a stranger, WTF ever. I'm not saying it was right (& I never could be that guy, back then, which made me the outlier) but brother was it ever normalized.

And it was on TOS as well. Kirk & Chekov routinely dropped stuff like that too, but when we see it, we have a discernable marker for its obsolescence, when we see the rubber lizard heads & cardboard sets, that we have less of with TNG, now. This episode is older now than TOS was when it aired... & IMHO just as antiquated
 
You know... that comment about her hair is actually the perfect example of how out-of-date this show is, in Itself. Like dude, don't say the hair thing. Nobody needs that in their life, and if you saw a guy doing that today, you'd rightfully think it's creepy, but was it creepy by their standards?

Well, let me just tell you how commonplace it was for guys to comment on a woman's appearance, out-of-pocket like that, back then, their hair, their outfit, their figure, at work, on a bus, to a stranger, WTF ever. I'm not saying it was right (& I never could be that guy, back then, which made me the outlier) but brother was it ever normalized.

And it was on TOS as well. Kirk & Chekov routinely dropped stuff like that too, but when we see it, we have a discernable marker for its obsolescence, when we see the rubber lizard heads & cardboard sets, that we have less of with TNG, now. This episode is older now than TOS was when it aired... & IMHO just as antiquated

Examples of when "Kirk & Chekov routinely dropped stuff like that too"?
 
...
I don't recall any other remarks about her file, but my memory is old lol. I'm open to a correction, if anyone has one. I took that quote from an early draft script, at st.minutae.com. They aren't always exact to the final product, that made it to air, but I'm not seeing anything else about him going thru her file.
...
As an aside, Chakoteya.net has transcripts of episodes as they aired. There is the occasional typo, but they are largely accurate.

The discussion of personality for an interactive holographic consultant reminds me of a completely different holographic consultant in another series: Crell Moset in VOY's "Nothing Human." For some reason, the hologram had to be imbued with personality subroutines to be "sophisticated" enough, along the lines of the EMH, to handle the issue at hand. But that episode is a whole 'nother can of worms.

Kor
 
Didn't Kirk say almost something exactly like that to Saavik in TWoK, about having changd her hair? I'm not as versed in every line of TOS dialog
Not remotely. Kirk asked Saavik if she was wearing her hair differently from when he had seen her earlier, not state (blurt out) that it was different from her official records, records that had been made at a time when he had never met her. That's not even one example, much less anything he routinely did.
 
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