What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?

[Mr. Laser Beam]

But when was it ever said that the Breen armor would explode if they were ever opened?

I just looked them up on Memory Alpha and it doesn't say anything like that.

Guess the Mandela Effect still works.

Although it sounds like something they - and the Romulans - would do...

 

[Farscape One]

I believe that is how many of the early books explained the Romulan war.

I didn't know that. (Haven't read any of the novels that take place in the era right after ENT ended.)

Glad I'm not the only one who thought of that as a possibility. Thanks.

 

[Macintosh]

I won't lie, I left Interstellar with tears. I also liked Oppenheimer. But, otherwise, yeah...

Oppenheimer is still on my "to watch" list. Interstellar is, in my opinion, the most overrated movie of the last ten years. I'm usually a huge sci-fi fan, especially of hard SF like 2001: A Space Odyssey, but it just left me cold.

The Prestige is one of the best movies ever.

I keep forgetting that's a Nolan movie. It is the exception that proves the rule.

 

[drt]

Unless the Earth-Romulan war was fought almost entirely in space or in orbit of worlds. Easier to not see what your opponent looks like if their ship is totally destroyed, either by weapons or self-destruct.

I think it's pretty much implied in "Balance" that it was entirely a space war.

 

[Nyotarules]

Doing another rewatch of SNW and the characters Chapel, M'Benga and Uhura would still work if they were new/original characters....oh well.

 

[Citiprime]

Audiences would flock to a Sci fit war movie with a lot of action, super special effects, and a good story. Star Trek would be happy with a Marvel or Transformers movie level of success.

They'd have to retcon and ignore the fact that humans never saw what Romulans looked like, but as long as the broad strokes are in place the writers are comfortable with changing and ignoring those minor details for sake of a good story. The general audience doesn't know or care about that detail.

I'm not sure they'd have to do that. Just say the Remans were the Romulans' foot soldiers during the war. Although, Spock's dialogue in "Balance of Terror" makes this problematic too since the exact dialogue he uses is "no human, Romulan, or ally has ever seen the other."

You could arguably get around that by saying the Remans technically aren't the Romulans' allies. They're the Romulans' slave army, and Spock was referring to the Romulans and the founding members of the Federation (i.e., humanity, Vulcans, Tellarites and Andorians). Because you wouldn't call the Jem'Hadar the Founders' "allies." They're the Founders' slaves who serve as servants in the Dominion's armed forces.

Any ground troops Starfleet meets will certainly be armored, and this would extend to headgear. So nobody is ever going to see what the Romulans really look like. They'll have helmets, just like in BOT.

It could be similar to how the series Space: Above and Beyond did the war with the "Chigs." It's a war with an alien race that wears body armor, but any attempt to forcibly remove their coverings results in a chemical reaction that dissolves the body.

I think it's pretty much implied in "Balance" that it was entirely a space war.

Sisko has a line in DS9's "Homefront" that I've always been intrigued by, since he likens a Jem'Hadar invasion of Earth to a threat "waging the kind of war that Earth hasn't seen since the founding of the Federation." The possible implication being that at some point during the war the Romulans may have launched a direct assault against Earth.

JARESH-INYO: What you're asking me to do is declare martial law.

LEYTON: What I'm asking you to do is let us defend this planet. We don't know what the changelings will do next, but we have to be ready for them. Ben, tell him.

SISKO: Sir, the thought of filling the streets with armed troops is as disturbing to me as it is to you, but not as disturbing as the thought of a Jem'Hadar army landing on Earth without opposition. The Jem'Hadar are the most brutal and efficient soldiers I've ever encountered. They don't care about the conventions of war or protecting civilians. They will not limit themselves to military targets. They'll be waging the kind of war that Earth hasn't seen since the founding of the Federation.​

 

[Tallguy]

Plus if Earth found a bunch of Remans then they'd just think THOSE were Romulans.

 

[drt]

Sisko has a line in DS9's "Homefront" that I've always been intrigued by, since he likens a Jem'Hadar invasion of Earth to a threat "waging the kind of war that Earth hasn't seen since the founding of the Federation." The possible implication being that at some point during the war the Romulans may have launched a direct assault against Earth.

During the Berman era it seemed that the production heeded the line in Wrath of Khan that Starfleet had kept the peace for a hundred years, so there was never a pre-TOS war with the Klingons. Combine that with no major wars between TOS and TNG, and the line could also mean that the Dominion War was simply the first serious "Earth-threatening" one since the Romulan War.

 

[Nerys Myk]

During the Berman era it seemed that the production heeded the line in Wrath of Khan that Starfleet had kept the peace for a hundred years, so there was never a pre-TOS war with the Klingons. Combine that with no major wars between TOS and TNG, and the line could also mean that the Dominion War was simply the first serious "Earth-threatening" one since the Romulan War.

Did any one tell Garth of Izar? He fought in a pre-TOS war with somebody.

 

[cooleddie74]

Yep. The Battle of Axanar was a critical deep space event as far back as TOS in 1968. Long before Carol Marcus made her comment in Star Trek II the franchise's creators had established that Starfleet had waged some pretty important battles to both keep the peace and even keep the Federation together.

 

[Nerys Myk]

There's also the Battle of Donatu V which took place in 2245. Might be part of the same conflict as the Battle of Axanar.

 

[drt]

That's why I prefaced my comment with "during the Berman era" - they routinely ignored TOS's worldbuilding.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

During the Berman era it seemed that the production heeded the line in Wrath of Khan that Starfleet had kept the peace for a hundred years, so there was never a pre-TOS war with the Klingons. Combine that with no major wars between TOS and TNG, and the line could also mean that the Dominion War was simply the first serious "Earth-threatening" one since the Romulan War.

From [http://www.chakoteya.net/movies/movie2.html]:

DAVID: I've tried to tell you before. Scientists have always been pawns of the military.
CAROL: Starfleet has kept the peace for a hundred [years]. I cannot and will not subscribe to your interpretation of this event.​

The line about keeping the peace was in reply to the line about scientists being pawns of the military. Keeping the peace could have meant not coopting scientific research, keeping peace between scientists and soldiers. Look at the these non-military and non-police examples [https://www.collinsdictionary.com/us/dictionary/english/to-keep-the-peace]:

Do I give her up to keep the peace?
The Sun (2015)

His job is, essentially, to keep the peace with the workforce.
Times, Sunday Times (2015)

[...]

I do loads for him, to keep the peace.
The Sun (2013)

[...]

I'm walking on eggshells trying to keep the peace.
The Sun (2010)

[...]

That will do for keeping the peace in the team room.
The Sun (2010)
​

 

[Tallguy]

During the Berman era it seemed that the production heeded the line in Wrath of Khan that Starfleet had kept the peace for a hundred years, so there was never a pre-TOS war with the Klingons.

Yeah, that's not what that means.

 

[Henoch]

Yeah, that's not what that means.

I can see from a point of view (i.e. the victors) that winning a quick war is the equivalent of keeping the peace.

 

[Rowdy Roddy McDowall]

I like Boyce, but I can see him retiring between five-year missions, so I don't take issue with that. Piper did nothing for me. The actor for Piper, Paul Fix, was a much better fit when he was in The Rifleman.

I especially like P.F. in THE BAD SEED. A second-act character, yet Oscar-worthy.

 

[Tallguy]

I can see from a point of view (i.e. the victors) that winning a quick war is the equivalent of keeping the peace.

But that's not what Carol is talking about. She is refuting David's claim that scientists have always been pawns to the military. And she is saying that Starfleet is not like that. It has "kept the peace for 100 years" and she will not accept David's statement as an explanation for why Stafleet will be collecting all of the Genesis research.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

But that's not what Carol is talking about. She is refuting David's claim that scientists have always been pawns to the military. And she is saying that Starfleet is not like that. It has "kept the peace for 100 years" and she will not accept David's statement as an explanation for why Stafleet will be collecting all of the Genesis research.

...but the one thing Carol did not refute is David's belief that Starfleet is a military organization (just that scientists have not been pawns of the organization), which is more in-universe proof that Starfleet is not some pure body of pacifistic exploration, as Roddenberry attempted to spin that in the decades post-TOS, while ignoring the military structure / nomenclature he added to / built on in the concept. Not to mention how many times the 1701 had been described as having the power and consciously created a measure to authorize the destruction of a panet (General Order 24 for one example), which is not the equivalent of Greenpeace in space.

 

[Commander Troi]

Superman, Spider-Man, and The Fantastic Four: Origin stories I will read / see / hear as many times as you want. (Although seeing a good FF adaptation before I die would be swell.)

Personally, I liked the first FF movie they did (with Jessica Alba).

The Prestige is one of the best movies ever.

God, yes. One movie where I can truly say, "I did not see that coming!" Plus, Bowie as Tesla.

Unless the Earth-Romulan war was fought almost entirely in space or in orbit of worlds. Easier to not see what your opponent looks like if their ship is totally destroyed, either by weapons or self-destruct.

I think it's pretty much implied in "Balance" that it was entirely a space war.

That's always been my head canon.

 

[Tallguy]

...but the one thing Carol did not refute is David's belief that Starfleet is a military organization (just that scientists have not been pawns of the organization), which is more in-universe proof that Starfleet is not some pure body of pacifistic exploration, as Roddenberry attempted to spin that in the decades post-TOS, while ignoring the military structure / nomenclature he added to / built on in the concept. Not to mention how many times the 1701 had been described as having the power and consciously created a measure to authorize the destruction of a panet (General Order 24 for one example), which is not the equivalent of Greenpeace in space.

I consider myself to be at least in the C-suite of the "Starfleet is a Military" club. But citing a Nicholas Meyer script is not necessarily the strongest leg to stand on. OTOH, it just occurred to me that Nick Meyer wrote "There is no money in the future" and everybody ran with that one. So sure, go with it.