What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?

[Nyotarules]

I don't know that this is really controversial - it's pretty obvious - but: Trek was created by Hollywood liberals who absolutely intended the messages of the show to be progressive as they understood such things. Trying to find support for conservative positions in it is a misreading of the intent of almost everyone who did creative work on it.

TIC

TOS
Values change, todays conservative might find a future where mainly American white humans rule a United Earth and are highly influential in a fictional galactic organisation not a bother

TNG
The few female admirals/captain in the show was probably tolerable for a modern conservative after all , Sarah Payne is a conservative and she wanted to be VP

DS9
Black male boss - Might be slightly disturbing

VOY
Female captain and engineer - might be slightly disturbing

ENT
A conservative dream?

PIC
Barely Tolerable? Female admiral, swearing, great white male hope not so great?

DISC
A conservative nightmare....

 

[UssGlenn]

Michael and Saru will be the focus; it's a feature, not a bug.

Marketing might call exploding cell phone batteries "personal hand warmers", but that doesn't make it not a bug.

 

[fireproof78]

conservative nightmare....

Not this conservative.

 

[Mudd]

I have multiple times on this forumstated the worst character in any trek franchise was wesley crusher.
I bet no one complains I must be anti white
anti male or anti straight

Oddly enough, I think the character of Burnham sucks and post as much fairly frequently, and yet no one of consequence has accused me of being a racist for holding that opinion.

It's not particularly challenging to see your biases based upon the context of your posts.

You ought to knock the chip off your own shoulder.

 

[ThreeEdgedSword]

TIC

DS9
Black male boss - Might be slightly disturbing

AND fiery, red-headed female second-in-command. Not even human. Clearly a witch.

VOY

Female captain and engineer - might be slightly disturbing

And coincidentally, still the most-hated Trek captain in certain circles.

PIC

Barely Tolerable? Female admiral, swearing, great white male hope not so great?

I'm sure some see it that way. I just think he's more human now.

DISC

A conservative nightmare....

Well, at least the captain was always a white straight male! OK, apparently aliens don't count, but still.

Steve Shives' tthoughts on why conservatives like Star Trek
(it's hilarious, and controversial):

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[Lord Garth]

Surprised a little by that, I just presumed it was Archer due to the negativity surrounding enterprise

ENT was probably more hated as a series, but Janeway was more hated as a Captain. I was here when both series were current. So I've seen it with my own eyes.

 

[ThreeEdgedSword]

Oddly enough, I think the character of Burnham sucks and post as much fairly frequently, and yet no one of consequence has accused me of being a racist for holding that opinion.

I should probably amend my statement from above. I've probably never been directly accused of racism or sexism in this forum, but I've read many, many posts where DSC fans (not all of them, but a subgroup) generalizes any criticism of Burnham as such, basically lumping them in with the fandom menace and twitter-ranting ex-writers for Trek. And I have read replies to thoughtful, nuanced criticism accusing them of these biases.

Also, complaints about how all the criticism of DSC spoils their enjoyment of the show. That, I think, was the straw to leave that subforum.

And if someone can refer to my postings and point out why I, specifically, might display racist/ misogynist views, that's legitimate and fine.

then lucky you I guess.
I am not the first person to have stopped posting in the discovery forum due to people who just love to bandy about labels....which is what you are doing now

No, they're really not.

What are these biases you claim I have ?

Oh boy.

 

[fireproof78]

Also, complaints about how all the criticism of DSC spoils their enjoyment of the show. That, I think, was the straw to leave that subforum.

I might be quick to defend Discovery but people's opinions are not going to ruin anything about my enjoyment. Ultimately, it comes down to personal filtering through perception of the show, whether characters or design or story, and how it engages.

But, I'm also a sarcastic sometimes and make categorical sweeping declarations about haters. But, I rarely buy in to such large, sweeping, categorical declarations, because I rarely fit the mold myself.

 

[Mudd]

Also, complaints about how all the criticism of DSC spoils their enjoyment of the show. That, I think, was the straw to leave that subforum.

Yeah. I mean, I just...suck it up, guys. We've all been there. Welcome to four years of the Enterprise forum.

 

[Lord Garth]

I'm very careful about who I accuse of being a racist or sexist. If someone complains about "SJWs" or "There's too much diversity!", those are the people I'm going to go after. IMO, they deserve it. Not because they don't like Discovery, but because of their values and beliefs in general.

As far as bashers in the forum, I've been at this for 25 years. I know the game. All I've said is, "If you hate the show, then why are you still watching?", which I only apply to people who actually still watch the show but see no redeeming value in it. Which is quite different from liking the show but being critical of it, or not liking the show overall but finding parts you do like and holding on for those.

Since I stopped watching ENT six episodes in, during its run, I'm actually someone who can say "If you don't like it, don't watch it" without looking like a hypocrite. Unlike most people here, I won't keep watching "Just because it's Star Trek and I have to watch it all!" If I didn't like DSC, I would've checked out after a few episodes. Rarely if ever to post in the forum.

Hell, I liked Lower Decks, but barely post in the forum now that the season is over.

And, yeah. I'm no fan of Serveaux, but I've never once called him a racist or sexist. Take note of that, gazomg.

 

[Oddish]

Steve Shives... I do like him. But if he doesn't get why conservatives like Trek, he maybe doesn't get conservatives.

Trek celebrates virtues like honor and courage and self-sacrifice.
Trek values devotion to family.
Most Trek characters carry and use weapons, which pleases the 2A crowd. There's no indication that personal arms are restricted.
The Federation is similar in nature to the USA, not in terms of capitalism but in terms of valuing individual freedom and individual rights.
Trek condemns doing evil in the name of the "greater good", a popular pastime of totalitarian regimes like the USSR and Nazi Germany.
Trek values EQUAL rights for all. Some conservatives are racist and sexist, yes. But many are not. Though i count myself as conservative, I find such things disgusting.

 

[Mudd]

Trek condemns doing evil in the name of the "greater good...

That's damn close to anti-American right there.

Kirk condemning "race hatred" as he put it is enough to separate him from most right-wing/conservative politicians in my country at this moment.

 

[cooleddie74]

What are these biases you claim I have ?

You basically admit to them in your posts.

 

[Tim Thomason]

saru and spock play aliens
lorca and pike were guest stars in separate seasons and not long term cast members...and both GONE

Spock is half-human (although Peck was a guest star). Pike (Mount) and Lorca (Isaacs) were not guest stars, they were credited with the main cast in the intro.

 

[fireproof78]

Steve Shives... I do like him. But if he doesn't get why conservatives like Trek, he maybe doesn't get conservatives.

Trek celebrates virtues like honor and courage and self-sacrifice.
Trek values devotion to family.
Most Trek characters carry and use weapons, which pleases the 2A crowd. There's no indication that personal arms are restricted.
The Federation is similar in nature to the USA, not in terms of capitalism but in terms of valuing individual freedom and individual rights.
Trek condemns doing evil in the name of the "greater good", a popular pastime of totalitarian regimes like the USSR and Nazi Germany.
Trek values EQUAL rights for all. Some conservatives are racist and sexist, yes. But many are not. Though i count myself as conservative, I find such things disgusting.

I think this highlights most of my own view of Star Trek. I am more conservative and while I have no doubt there are racist and sexist conservatives, the vast majority I know are not. For me, Star Trek simply embodies freedom to what you would like, and allowing others to do what they like. That's what I value most of all is individual freedom and individual responsibility.

 

[XCV330]

TIC

TOS
Values change, todays conservative might find a future where mainly American white humans rule a United Earth and are highly influential in a fictional galactic organisation not a bother

TNG
The few female admirals/captain in the show was probably tolerable for a modern conservative after all , Sarah Payne is a conservative and she wanted to be VP

DS9
Black male boss - Might be slightly disturbing

VOY
Female captain and engineer - might be slightly disturbing

ENT
A conservative dream?

PIC
Barely Tolerable? Female admiral, swearing, great white male hope not so great?

DISC
A conservative nightmare....

LD: Everyone is fucked up in their own diverse and wonderful ways.

 

[Worf factor9]

Most Trek characters carry and use weapons, which pleases the 2A crowd. There's no indication that personal arms are restricted.

IIRC, all weapons were secured in an arms locker until required, such as on an away mission..

Unless you wish to deem a tri-corder as a weapon. Then Katy bar the door.

 

[fireproof78]

Unless you wish to deem a tri-corder as a weapon.

In the right hands...

 

[Oddish]

That's damn close to anti-American right there.

Kirk condemning "race hatred" as he put it is enough to separate him from most right-wing/conservative politicians in my country at this moment.

The only thing I've seen in the conservative mainstream (not those imbeciles in white nightgowns) are opposition to illegal immigration. Quite simply, sneaking over the border is a crime. And, expecting people to enter our country legally or not at all is not racism.

QUOTE: IIRC, all weapons were secured in an arms locker until required.

In "Aquiel" and "Phantasms", Data and Geordi kept their sidearms in their quarters. And Guinan had a rifle stashed behind the bar in "Night Terrors".

 

[ThreeEdgedSword]

If the threshold for racism is "imbeciles in white nightgowns who try to lynch black people", I see the point.

As for weapons... The only civilian I remember keeping weapons is Picard (or his Romulan ex-spy friends) in Picard. And I'm not sure we know that was legal. Ah, Guinan, true. I must say, no matter the general regulations regarding personal possession of weapons, if it was *my* flagship, I'd be a tad concerned about civilians wielding them.