And here I thought it was a space brothel (Quark's Holosuites)
Spoilers General Disco Chat Thread
- Thread starter Lord Garth
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Where do you think Saru ranks among the “outsider” Trek characters like Spock (original not neckbeard) and Data?
place two, right behind Odo, with high chances to take the lead
I think it gave his character new life, in an interesting way, and will allow him to expand his role to touch on changing his culture... will he go back to his home planet in defiance of General Order 1?
So many neat wrinkles to explore.
I would place him third - tied with Data but behind Odo and Spock.
Spock (all incarnations), Odo, then Saru, then Odo and the Doctor tied.
I don't know what the reference to "not neckbeard" is supposed to mean.
Spock
Saru
Odo
Data
Seven
T'Pol
I'm not going to rank them. There's no real point. Spock is Part-Human and doesn't want to show he's Human. Data isn't any part Human and wants to be Human. They're opposites. After that, the comparisons and contrasts end.
They don't really work with Odo, The Doctor, Seven, T'Pol, or Saru. None of those characters are trying to be something they're not. Spock wants to be a full Vulcan when he's not. Data wants to be Human when he's not. The later characters, introduced after Data, are what they are. They grow as people but that's not the same as wanting to be different from their being.
The Doctor is an AI with more sophistication than Data which makes sense since he was created decades later. Seven is a human removed from the collective who can't have all her Borg parts removed. So she's not a Borg anymore but still has Borg remnants sounds about right. Odo's a shape-shifter who likes order. T'Pol is a Vulcan. Saru, if anything, reminds me of Arex minus a third arm, but he's someone who managed to make a pretty good adjustment from a pre-industrial society to a post-warp society.
They don't really work with Odo, The Doctor, Seven, T'Pol, or Saru. None of those characters are trying to be something they're not. Spock wants to be a full Vulcan when he's not. Data wants to be Human when he's not. The later characters, introduced after Data, are what they are. They grow as people but that's not the same as wanting to be different from their being.
The Doctor is an AI with more sophistication than Data which makes sense since he was created decades later. Seven is a human removed from the collective who can't have all her Borg parts removed. So she's not a Borg anymore but still has Borg remnants sounds about right. Odo's a shape-shifter who likes order. T'Pol is a Vulcan. Saru, if anything, reminds me of Arex minus a third arm, but he's someone who managed to make a pretty good adjustment from a pre-industrial society to a post-warp society.
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Seven did have a bit of a "I want to be more human" streak going on with her at times. Not quite Data level, since she was naturally quite crabby about everything.
The Doctor wanted to be treated as an equal, which qualifies him as an Outsider-type, even if he never changed personalities. B'Elanna Torres seems like she might belong in this category, but she was usually pretty comfortable with who she was and her place in society.
The Doctor wanted to be treated as an equal, which qualifies him as an Outsider-type, even if he never changed personalities. B'Elanna Torres seems like she might belong in this category, but she was usually pretty comfortable with who she was and her place in society.
Barclay was another outsider, albeit in a different kind of way. I felt like he got a really good completion as well, being arguably one of the people most responsible for getting Voyager home. He's one of my favorite characters and I was glad he got a small role in First Contact.
Odo is an interesting case. He started off as an outsider looking into Bajoran and Starfleet culture. But then, once finding his people, he rejected them and became an outsider looking in to them as well.
Go climb a Spock. 
Leland and Martok should have their own biker spin-off, like Sons of Anarchy. Just picture them in leather jackets and on Harley-Davidsons.
Still, he made the strangest of remarks at times like when he said that the Founders made the Vorta out of kindness, even though they made them tasteless, with weak eyes and a total inability to appreciate art in any form! It seems like cruel limitations to me!
It's either that Odo was rather weird himself (after all he was against oppressed people fighting for their rights) or that he was desperate to find positive qualities in the assholes that engendered him.
WORF. He isn't any part Human biologically, but he has a strong Human cultural component to his upbringing, and he seems to want to be what it means to be Klingon *as his Human parents taught him* - an idealized form of Klingon. But he often shows that he'd rather be Human than the way *real* Klingons act. I see his situation as a third take, different from Spock or Data, on the question of what it means to be Human.
It's not quite that. Worf takes Klingon culture seriously and literally. But most Klingons know to take it seriously but not literally. He doesn't understand subtext.
Basically Worf acts like he's on the spectrum when it comes to his own people.
Worf also spent time on Q'onos with some Klingon cousins after the Rozhenkos adopted him where he performed various Klingon coming of age ceremonies and declared his intent to become a warrior. So it wasn't just the Rozhenkos who taught him about Klingon culture, there was some direct family influence as well.
Worf is a textbook Klingon because he only knows the textbook. So he actually believes in honor whereas normal Klingons only like to say they do.
It's like someone who's devoutly religious versus someone who just goes to Church on Sundays and that's the end of it.
It's like someone who's devoutly religious versus someone who just goes to Church on Sundays and that's the end of it.
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